The French attacks and gun toting Slaterites

In the wake of the terrorist attacks in Paris Cameron Slater suggests that an armed population would be the best way to prevent terrorism.

HOW GUN CONTROL HELPED THE FRENCH AVOID A MASSACRE…OH WAIT

We hear often, mainly from the left-wing how gun control will stop massacres. That removing guns from society will prevent gun crime.

I don’t hear this. I think Slater made that up.

Fewer guns in society can reduce gun crime and shooting accidents, but that’s unrelated to terrorist massacres.

It is all rubbish of course and we saw evidence of that the other day from Paris.

Criminals ignore laws, and laws create business opportunities for those criminals. Terrorists don’t care about gun control laws, for them it just makes killing large amounts of people easier if they are disarmed by their own governments.

The French government disarmed their population and now they wonder why they are targets.

They are targets because the French armed forces are active in Syria fighting against ISIS. Guns beget armed responses.

We are in a war with Islam. They want to destroy our civilisation and replace it with theirs. We need to fight, hard.

So Europe should arm their populations to prevent terrorist attacks? Slater seems to want to allow, even encourage the people to arm themselves and wipe out ‘Islam’.

I shudder to think what it would be like if people like him were allowed to roam the streets of New Zealand, armed to the teeth,  fighting hard in our defence.

Big talk from Slater. Big stupidity. And not just from him, the Slater tag team are out in force this morning. Spanish Bride posted in Face of the Day:

Back in May today’s face of the day Dame Susan ‘Dhimmi’  Devoy was backing Winston Peter’s call to increase our refugee quota.

Do you know what else we lag behind the rest of the world in Susan? Terrorism.There is a clear correlation between increased Muslim immigration and terrorism in a western country. It doesn’t matter how they got there, what matters is the dangerous ideology and belief system that they bring with them.

I suggest two words of the day for Whale OIl, correlation and causation.

After every single Muslim terrorist attack they have gone out of their way to inform us that it was linked to Islam.They have told us that the organisation behind the attacks is Islamic yet despite this Ms Devoy the other day made a statement as ludicrous as stating that the sky is green.

Ms Devoy might not like the truth but that does not give her the right to tell such bald-faced lies. Obviously she does not want the innocent Muslim community to suffer for what the guilty Muslim community have done but that is no excuse for ignoring the obvious. It is like saying that male on female rape has nothing to do with men. Yes, not all men rape but obviously some do. The terrorists are Muslim and the ideology that they follow is Islam. It may be an unpalatable truth and the Muslim community may be keen to distance themselves from it, much like I would want to distance myself from a family member that killed someone, but that does not change the facts.

That’s a garbled message but the Slaters seem to want to wipe out Islam because of extremist Muslim terrorists. Should women of the world be allowed to arm themselves to wipe out men to eliminate rape?

Members of the Muslim community, the Muslim ‘family’ in France did massacre French civilians and they did do it in the name of Allah. Stop sugar-coating the unpleasant truth Susan. You are fooling nobody.

Blaming “the Muslim ‘family’ in France” for the Paris massacres.

Somehow though I suspect that the real problem is inside your department. Are you leading the department Susan or is the department leading you? Are they feeding you the politically correct lines? Are they telling you what to say? I bet they justify it with the rationale that the lie will protect the local Muslim community. That rationale is the same one currently being used by Angela Merkel to justify suppressing the truth about refugee violence and rape against other refugees and the local German community. Do you really want to follow in her footsteps? I assure you that history will not remember Ms Merkel with kindness.

It’s hard to know what she’s actually trying to say there. This is what Devoy said that Spanish Bride is speaking so streongly against:

New Zealand’s Race Relations Commissioner Dame Susan Devoy said terrorism is not religious based and urged Kiwis to stand with the Muslim community.

“Hate starts small but so, too, does hope,” Dame Susan said.

“Terrorism has no religion and neither does humanity: we urge Kiwis to stand together in humanity.”

The concepts of religion and terrorism seemed to be diametrically opposed to me. Some terrorists use religion as an excuse to kill, but religion isn’t the cause. Misuse of religion is one of a number of factors.

Slater’s armed with keyboards are relatively harmless. let’s leave it at that. I think gun toting Slateritess roaming the streets are unlikely to make them safer.

41 Comments

  1. Reports are coming through that the Paris attacks were planned in Brussels.

    Belgium — Gun Facts, Figures and the Law

    The estimated total number of guns (both licit and illicit) held by civilians in Belgium is 1,800,000 to 2,000,000.

    The estimated rate of private gun ownership (both licit and illicit) in Belgium is 17.21 firearms per 100 people.

    Why didn’t all those guns amongst the population prevent the attacks?

    • Mike C

       /  16th November 2015

      @George

      You can have a million sane responsible licensed gun owners … and never have a single murder incident.

      All you need is one Islamic extremist nut-job family to get hold of about a hundred automatic weapons … and that creates the Paris Massacres.

      Go Figure 😦

      • There’s about 230,000 licensed firearms owners in New Zealand and an estimated 1.1 firearms.

        I think we have more than “never have a single murder incident”.

        • Mike C

           /  16th November 2015

          @George

          Note my wording in the first paragraph of my comment above 🙂

          And look at your stats in your comment above.

          I would be willing to bet the farm that there are way more murders committed with the 870,000 unlicensed firearms … than with the 230,000 licensed firearms 🙂

          • Where did you get “230,000 licensed firearms” from?

            There are no licensed firearms, they are not required to be licensed.

      • kittycatkin

         /  16th November 2015

        The problem is that a killer will have their gun ready, and will have fewer qualms about killing you that you would about killing them. Most of us would, I think, be nervous and be dead before we reached our own guns.

        That’s why I don’t think that having guns available in American schools will be much of a deterrent. I heard how many people in Florida were killed with their own guns by burglars; my guess is that the person is terrified and opening the drawer where the gun is with shaking hands and the burglar knows what they’re doing and gets there before them.

  2. traveller

     /  16th November 2015

    Gun Lobby types seem to be saying that if France had conceal and carry, citizens who could have fired back at the gunmen. I’m trying to imagine a carrier with a pistol in a packed dark concert hall against AK47s. Not seeing it frankly.

    • Mike C

       /  16th November 2015

      @Trav

      Yeap … staying low and moving as fast as you can to the emergency exit would be your best defense against an AK47 inside a Concert Hall 🙂

      Failing that … hiding or pretending to be dead is your next best option.

      • kittycatkin

         /  16th November 2015

        I’d be so paralysed with terror that I’d look dead.

        Yes, a pistol against an AK47 would be of limited use-like a knife against a sword.Unless the gunman or gunwoman obligingiy turned their back.

  3. “Slater suggests that an armed population would be the best way to prevent terrorism”. Many say the same about crime in general? Works just great in the U.S. of A!

  4. I think you will find that the number of registered weapons in New Zealand exceeds the number of adult New Zealanders, certainly more than Belgium on a per capita basis. The essential dilemma in this problem is that the Muslims who are carrying out these terror tactics are trying to expand their Caliphate, and those who are not terrorists but profess the Islamic faith are compelled to support the terrorists by intimidation and taxing the adherents for the tithes Islam requires from all Muslims. I can’t read minds. I could write a lecture about counter-insurgency tactics, but that would take up too much space. Suffice to say, there is no purely military or police solution to terrorism. It must be a political and military/Police solution based on capturing the hearts and minds of the populace as a whole, isolating the insurgents from all support including finance and propaganda -giving them no safe haven to plan plot and train. So it is a supra national, and probably global problem which requires Governments to cooperate in setting out an agreed aim and plan for dealing with the insurgency. Make no mistake, New Zealand is involved, and we need to seek and obtain the support of all Kiwis including those who are Muslim against the insurgents who do exist in New Zealand logic tells me – why should we be different to other Christian countries?

    • I think you will find that the number of registered weapons in New Zealand exceeds the number of adult New Zealanders”

      No.

      There are four categories of firearms in New Zealand:
      – pistols
      – restricted weapons (eg machine guns, gerande and rocket launchers)
      – military style semi-automatics
      – category A firearms are those that don’t fall under any other category.

      Category A firearms make up the vast majority of firearms in New Zealand.

      Registration of firearms is not required.

      For the other three categoroies a “permit to procure” is required, as is a fireamrms license endorsement.

    • Qualified “yes”. I certainly agree that politics and diplomacy must play a part, the larger the better I reckon, that it’s global and efforts need to be supported by all Kiwis. Not sure we’re a Christian country any longer though? Secular-and-Christian, Multi-cultural with Bi-cultural foundation maybe? Hence we are different from other former Christian nations, though certainly not immune from terrorism. The rage seems to be directed against the USA and Coalition of the Willing though, doesn’t it? I wonder why? Is it because the USA has been defending democracy all over the world for so long? Listening right now to RNZ, a fellow saying “intercepted intelligence says what they [ISIL] want is a massive military intervention which will suit their propoganda and recruitment” or words to that effect, and “what we must be very careful about is giving them what they want”. I have growing respect for that poor bastard who preceded Churchill at the outbreak of WW2. “I have here a letter, signed by Mr Hitler …” At least he tried. But we have a seemingly inevitable tendency to force. Guns, guns, guns … and of course ultimately there may be little choice …?

  5. Joe Bloggs

     /  16th November 2015

    I spent a couple o minutes on WO this morning (garggh, how my eyes burn…)

    Frankly the place is worse than a tinfoil hat convention…

  6. Goldie

     /  16th November 2015

    Pete: “They are targets because the French armed forces are active in Syria fighting against ISIS.”
    Nonsense. They (or rather, we) are targets because the fanatics believe that western civilisation is corrupt and Godless and the enemy of creating a worldwide caliphate – hence the Daesh comment had lots of religious nutty stuff about targeting “pagans gathered for a concert of prostitution and vice”. They may hate us because our forces are in Iraq fighting them, but, more significantly, they hate us (modernity/liberal western civilisation) for who we are and how we live. You might not buy into the “war of civilisations” thesis, Pete, but THEY DO.

    • Islamic State’s response to the Paris attacks:

      In its claim of responsibility, Islamic State said the attacks were a response to France’s campaign against its fighters.

      It also distributed an undated video in which a militant said France would not live peacefully as long it took part in US-led bombing raids against them.

      “As long as you keep bombing you will not live in peace. You will even fear travelling to the market,” said a bearded Arabic-speaking militant, flanked by other fighters.

      • Goldie

         /  16th November 2015

        Naughty Pete. You have been selective in your quotes.

      • Missy

         /  16th November 2015

        That is their public reasoning – possibly their excuse. I read an interesting article over the weekend (sorry I can’t remember which news organisation) which looked at why Paris is a centre for Muslim extremism – this has apparently been going on for decades, it is not a new thing in Paris – and one of the reasonings that were looked at is French History. The view is that France is seen as the home of the liberal ideals, the separation of church and state, and of course the modern republic, this view was described as being against the values of the Islamic fundamentalists.

        Perhaps their statement is their ‘excuse’ but the real reasoning is something in the above, they find our form of democracy so distasteful they will symbolically attack the capital of the country that prides itself on its liberal values.

        Not everything put in public is correct, I would take any statement from ISIL/ISIS with a grain of salt – that is what they want the world to think, it may be a part of it, but I think you will find it is not the whole reason.

      • Goldie

         /  16th November 2015

        The idea that the Paris massacre is a response to French actions is false (and if that is what you are arguing Pete, then you are just plain wrong). France has only been bombing Syria after it had received threats from Daesh – and the planning and preparation of the massacre predates the French air strikes. And it involved Daesh cells in countries which are not bombing Syria.

        The Daesh goal is to create a sick medieval caliphate by eradicating any “Godless” alternatives (hence why Daesh are systematically blowing up all the cultural sites in Iraq and Syria). Paris represents everything they hate – a city of culture, liberalism and tolerance… The statement Daesh produced as it claimed responsibility for Paris makes that obvious with its reference to the Bataclan theatre as “idolaters together in a party of perversity”.

        Daesh cannot be reasoned with or negotiated with, and stopping air strikes on them will not lead to us living in peace.

        Have a read of this article Pete, http://www.theatlantic.com/magazine/archive/2015/03/what-isis-really-wants/384980/

  7. And France’s response to the Paris attacks:

    France launches ‘massive’ airstrike on Syria, destroys two jihadi sites

    France has launched a series of airstrikes on an Isis stronghold in Syria, the French Defence Ministry told The Associated Press.

    The attack comes after Isis claimed responsibility for a series of coordinated terror attacks that left 132 people dead and injured 352 more in six locations throughout Paris on Saturday.

    The strikes targeted the ISIS-held city of Raqqa in Syria, The Associated Press reports.

    French officials told the Associated Press 10 fighter jets dropped 20 bombs, striking an Isis command and control center, jihadi recruitment center, a munitions depot and a training camp.

    http://www.nzherald.co.nz//world/news/article.cfm?c_id=2&objectid=11546042

    • Exactly what ISIS want! Escalation. More propoganda, more recruits, and bet your life more arms and supplies … from where!? All this won’t harm Western military-industrial economies either though.

  8. Ratty

     /  16th November 2015

    One major missed point.

    All the guns in Africa held by concert goers would have not made one slight difference.

    You try take a gun into an Eagles of Death Metal (or Queens of the Stone Age I suppose, or indeed any gig or public) performance in America.

    They would be confiscated.

  9. Hi Pete, I understand where you are coming from about the number of weapons in New Zealand. I used Justice Thorpe’s estimate in 2006 (?) of 1.3 million weapons. To which I subjectively added the weapons held by the NZ Armed Forces say 15,000, Hence my contention of per capita excess.

  10. Missy

     /  16th November 2015

    Pete, the comment Slater made about those in favour of gun control is (I believe) out of the USA and in relation to school massacres. Slater is trying to conflate Terrorist attacks and School Massacres and using the arguments from one to formulate arguments for the other – it is a bit like comparing apples and oranges.

    I am not surprised Slater is taking this view, he does seem to be very much against Gun Control, and in favour of the general population being allowed to carry concealed weapons, this is just another excuse for him to get on his pro gun bandwagon.

  11. Missy

     /  16th November 2015

    Pete, we may see religion as the excuse, not the cause, but we have to remember that ISIL/ISIS do appear to be religiously motivated. Their goal seems to be to create a caliphate ruled by Sharia Law – to downplay or brush away the religious aspect of the attacks by ISIS/ISIL is to deny a motivating force, and we will never get on top of this if we do not acknowledge that their religious goals, and interpretation of the Koran is one of their motivating factors. Too many in the media and Politics spend a lot of time denying the religious element of this, that in my opinion is dangerous, it needs to be acknowledged that religion is a big part of what they are doing. I am not saying all muslims are terrorists, but all ISIL/ISIS are muslim. They are a subset of the religion.

    • kittycatkin

       /  16th November 2015

      The IRA were all nominally Catholic, of course, but they were no more Christian than the terrorists are good Muslims. They used it as an excuse when they had to.

      I am not 100% sure that the Troubles in Ulster are over forever, but they seem to have ceased for now-if only this would happen on a larger scale. Sigh.

      One must remember that even if all As are Bs, not all Bs are As.

  12. Klik Bate

     /  16th November 2015

    “We need more immigration” they said.

    “Islam is peaceful” they said……..

    http://www.miamiherald.com/news/nation-world/world/article44800977.html

    • kittycatkin

       /  16th November 2015

      So is Christianity, but look what’s happened in its name in the past. One only has to read about the Tudors; even in Elizabeth I’s time there were terrible things happening. They were limited only by their technology.

      • Klik Bate

         /  16th November 2015

        Although to be fair ‘kitty’, I think that like most people, I’m more concerned about what happened on the weekend, not five hundred bloody years ago!

        LOL!!

      • Brown

         /  16th November 2015

        FFS Kitty brush up on theology. There is a gulf between Islam and Christianity as Christians acting like pricks in the past were not acting in accordance with the text while the Muslims doing bad stuff are. Until we get this difference into the skulls of people we are not going to address the problem in either the short or long term.

  13. Mike C

     /  16th November 2015

    Who was it that said in here last week that Duncan Garner and Simon Lusk went on a hunting trip together … and that it was going to be shown on “Story”?

    Did I miss that “Shooting Killing Butchering Story about the Dam”? LOL 🙂

  14. Alan Wilkinson

     /  16th November 2015

    Frankly it is rubbish trying to deny that the Muslim religion is not causally linked to the violence, not just of ISIS but many other terrorist groups as well as national and internal sectarian conflicts all through the Muslim world. There is a reason Muslims are flooding into the Christian democracies and it is simply horrific violence, persecution and intolerance from their Muslim brothers. So I call hogwash on those denying what is blatantly obvious. Muslims have a major problem with intolerance and violence. They have to address it as a religious reform.

    • yeah no chance of a great reformation coming about.

      • Brown

         /  17th November 2015

        The worrying thing is that what we are seeing is the Muslim reformation. This type of behaviour is at its core. Muslims that behave well do so in spite of the faith, not because of it.

  15. “I suggest two words of the day for Whale Oil.” Profligate.

    I suggest one word – ‘lunatic.’