Key on The Edge, or over it

There’s been a lot of criticism of John Key performing on radio at The Edge.

Key endears himself to many with his ordinary blokishness. But he sometimes goes over the edge, as he seems to have allowing himself to be drawn into ponytail banter and what is alleged to be joking about prison rape.

Claire Trevett: John Key’s good-sport shtick becomes uncomfortable

Prime Minister John Key’s good bloke routine has worked for him for seven years straight, helping foster the image of him as a good egg, a bit of a joker, a good sport.

Key has made his informal interview slots on commercial radio a major part of his media strategy. Politically, it is is a good tactic. Commercial radio reaches people who don’t give a poop about the more serious side of politics. Key knows that and plays to his audience accordingly.

The problem is his audience inevitably ends up being a lot wider than the one he originally plays to. It gets on social media and news sites.

It is usually harmless fun, however much his opponents might bridle at it. Some of us have even egged him on in such antics.

But he has a startling tendency to go overboard. He can not even blame the hosts who come up with the ludicrous things they get him to do. He’s been in the game seven years and has the choice of saying “no”.

He presumably says no to doing some media related stuff.

His end-of-year slots this year were a case in point. The first was only embarrassing, mainly for him. Confronted at The Edge by a lineup of women with ponytails and told he had a choice of pulling a ponytail or singing All I Want for Christmas, the only real option was the latter. The second on The Rock was more marginal. Asked to get into a cage with comedian Tom Furniss, the danger signs should have been flashing.

Just as Caesar thrice refused the crown, Key resisted requests to get into the cage three times. But then he caved. Once in the cage, the ‘drop the soap’ jokes came out and Key played along, analysing the soap.

Key may have been oblivious to the prison rape references and crude Deliverancequote involved. But no Prime Minister should put himself in a cage, let alone one that ends up with jokes about prison rape.

Not a good look for Key – or a good sound bite.

Barry Soper: Has John Key gone a step too far?

Does John Key go a step too far?

All he needs for Christmas is a good break and perhaps a bit of time to reflect on how he can avoid putting himself into cringe making situations.

But then again his unusual antics don’t appear to have done him any harm, so perhaps that’s what he’ll be reflecting on!

Key runs the risk of eeaching a tipping point where significant numbers of people (voters) start to turn off his more edgy performances.

 

 

127 Comments

  1. Zedd

     /  December 17, 2015

    I can’t believe so many people are fooled by Key’s B-S
    If he’s such a ‘typical bloke’ why could he not even knock a nail into a billboard ? 🙂

    He might be an expert at playing up the cameras.. but their is nothing ‘average or typical’ about him ! (the $50mil man) “wake up Y’all”

    • kittycatkin

       /  December 17, 2015

      He may have made a hash of the nail, but he has made enough money to pay people to do that sort of thing for him-who’s having the last laugh ? Him or the chippie ?

      • jamie

         /  December 17, 2015

        Which is exactly the point, kitty. He trades on being an ordinary sort of bloke but as even you point out in reality he is anything but.

        • Alan Wilkinson

           /  December 17, 2015

          You miss a subtle distinction. Everyone knows he is not an ordinary bloke – he’s a Prime Minister for heavens sake. But he trades on being approachable and friendly to ordinary blokes. And he is.

          • I think I made that point below about him being Prime Minister and the associations the role has; Leader, role model, media personality, ‘target’ et al, with perhaps, a certain expectation of decorum, care and discernment around his public image?

            So we’ve got a PM who is very rich indeed – some would call it by other names I think – but trades on being approachable and friendly to ordinary blokes. (Blokes only?) Ordinary blokes who, presumably, find prison rape jokes funny? Good summer BBQ material I guess? “Bend down and get that soap will ya mate?” Ha ha ha ha ha!!!!

            Even his apologists on here, like KCK, BJM, MW and yourself have been saying how disgusting the joke was. Disgusting humour and disgusting “set up”.

            Can you enlighten me on where exactly the subtlety is in all this?

            • jamie

               /  December 17, 2015

              I think Alan’s point is fairly made.

              As for bbq material, yeah plenty of people do find prison rape jokes funny. Not saying it’s one of my favourite aspects of our culture but it’s pretty apparent.

              The pity is that Key doesn’t seem capable of stepping up to the role and applying a moral compass when faced with such humour, only a political one.

            • @ jamie – okay … ummmm … so, by your own admission there’s an absence of moral compass in the Prime Minister.

              And the political compass is what? Doing nothing? Saying it’s “in the spirit of Christmas” and all very “light hearted”.

              I’d say the political compass is as far out or absent as the moral one. If he had a political compass he wouldn’t have been there in the first place! (I actually want my PM to show some integrity!)

              It’s extraordinary really. “We must attack as “Lefties” anyone who comments negatively on our Leader. Attack. Attack. They must have a left-wing socialist agenda. We must defend our Leader no matter what, even if the negative evidence is utterly overwhelming”.

              Sure, ultimately its a little thing, easily and soon forgotten. I dunno about you though, I’m into principles and for me it’s the principle of the thing.
              Ψ

    • Timoti

       /  December 18, 2015

      So 50 mill means Key can’t be an average dude?

      • @ Timoti – you got it in one! There is another reason too. Wanna guess?

        He’s the Prime Minister of the country for Christ’s sake!

        Whatever I might think of him, whatever I might vote, he is currently the leader of my country. I want the leader of my country to act with some decorum, decency and integrity.

        This means don’t go on face-ache radio to appeal to the youthful, narcissistic, deadhead fu*kwit lowlife vote – there’s only 3 of them anyhow – the rest will never vote for anything – and show some leadership if you do get caught out – the chances of which will be greatly diminished – don’t just giggle.

        • Nothing wrong with the PM going on a variety of Radio stations. I think its interesting you dismiss the listeners of the Edge… that’s a bit elitest isn’t it? key is just sowing seeds with potential votes and speaking to them through TEHIR preferred medium. Smart politics I reckon

          • Timoti

             /  December 18, 2015

            Partisan Z is more a considered Radio New Zealand devotee with little time for such levity. We all have our own buzz.

            • True Timoti… prefer Sports Radio myself and a bit of rock. Kathryn Ryan is a ok in small doses but most of Nat Radio is a snobby, leftie circle jerk…. in my opinion…

            • Timoti

               /  December 18, 2015

              National Socialist Radio.

          • @ dave1924, Timoti – funny, isn’t it, that yesterday and earlier today we were all in agreement that this prank on this radio station was … what were some of the words, puerile, facile, derogatory, slimey … et al.

            This 4 or 5 minutes of Edge radio was what I was refering to all along.
            Someone said Key does it for what’s in it for him, so I extrapolated, based on those few minutes, about the ‘target audience’, the ‘lowlife’ vote, all 3 of them.

            I reckon there’s some humour in that, don’t you? I’ve repeatedly acknowledged my appreciation of KG’s and Timoti’s humour. “National Socialist Radio” is funny Timoti! I appreciate it on that level. It’s untrue, but appreciated.

            Now it’s all about WHAT I LISTEN TO!!!??? (Tanty!!!)

            And, oh dear, to get back on topic just briefly, if only it was just “levity”.

            • I love your posts PnZ – entertaining if the TL;DR doesn’t kick in.

              I listen to Nat Radio a lot. Mostly 9 to Noon. And it does have a slant….. but i filter it out when Ms Ryan lets fly on her take on everything… a smile like hers makes up for all sorts of Leftie in my view….

  2. Joe Bloggs

     /  December 17, 2015

    Key is charismatic for all the wrong reasons. Instead of acting like the clown prince of NZ Parliament perhaps a little more dignity and gravitas might make a proper man of him

  3. Zedd

     /  December 17, 2015

    The only place Key would look ‘average & typical’.. maybe at the ‘Parnell Millionaires club’ ?

  4. Nelly Smickers

     /  December 17, 2015

    I’d be very happy to ‘horse around’ with JK !

    He could yank my pony tail anytime her liked…..or even Max for that matter.:)

    • Mike C

       /  December 17, 2015

      @NellyS

      Max Keys girlfriend is a short supermodel … so you and I have two chances of him ever wanting to horse around with either one of us … which are:-

      NONE … AND FUCK-ALL 🙂

      • Nelly Smickers

         /  December 17, 2015

        Well, I know for a fact that Max Key isn’t gay, so I’d at least be in with a chance 🙂

        But your chances Mike, would most certainly fall into the ‘…AND FUCK-ALL” category

        • Mike’s a chick, Nelly, quite a hot one at that.

          • Nelly Smickers

             /  December 17, 2015

            Not sure you know what you’re talking about SPC.

            Mike C farms on Great Barrier… and fancies himself as a bit of a ‘tough guy’.

            • Alan Wilkinson

               /  December 17, 2015

              You’ve missed out on a bit of history, Nelly. SPC is right.

            • kittycatkin

               /  December 17, 2015

              Max Key’s girlfriend is a model, but is she a ‘supermodel’ ?

  5. John Key is our elected Prime Minister who leads a Government which has made a lot of progress towards the sort of Democracy we deserve as demonstrated by the General Election. He is not universally loved, but then who is? What he does for New Zealand is to create friendly relationships with all of the significant political leaders, except perhaps Putin who is not a nice person. My real fear is that between the MSM Party and the key haters of our PM, he might say stuff it, I don’t have to put up with this sort of negativity and resign prematurely. Then all of New Zealand will suffer. I am not saying he is without flaws, but that makes him just so human like most of us!

    • Joe Bloggs

       /  December 17, 2015

      bjm – your summary of Key’s position, role, and achievements is inarguable…but just think how much more respected Key would be if he didn’t give the MSM and key haters all of these lamebrain behaviours to criticise…

      maybe, just maybe, some of that negativity you mention has been as a result of his own childish carryings on?? FFS, he’s not Adam Sandler, so why behave that way…

      • Alan Wilkinson

         /  December 17, 2015

        I don’t think it would make the slightest difference to all the Lefties with Key Derangement Syndrome. And I think it mostly works for him with the rest of the population.

        • Zedd

           /  December 17, 2015

          Yes & I’m certain that if he started wearing a blue outfit with a big ‘S” on it & a red cape.. some of you would believe he’s really ‘SUPERMAN’ 🙂
          ** WAKE UP, you fools

          • kittycatkin

             /  December 17, 2015

            I am sure that if he didn’t act in this lighthearted way from time to time, he’d be criticised for that by those who look for anything they can find to sneer at in his actions. Claire Trevett is over-analysing this to a ridiculous extent. He obviously didn’t catch onto the significance of the bar of soap in this context-who would but a person with the sort of mind that sees sex everywhere and always sees it dirty ? We don’t all have dirty minds. He wasn’t naked in a shower with other men when this happened, and so obviously didn’t see that someone was having a very inappropriate joke at his expense and one that would probably fall flat with most people.

          • Mike C

             /  December 17, 2015

            @Zedd

            I gave you an up-vote … simply because I think that you are so ballsy every time you put John Key down in here. LOL 🙂

            • kittycatkin

               /  December 17, 2015

              He talks a load of balls on this subject, anyway. The repetition becomes rather…repetitive. One knows exactly what Zedd is going to say when John Key’s mentioned.

            • Mike C

               /  December 17, 2015

              @Kitty

              Let it not be said that Zedd does not give 100% when it comes to John Key 🙂

            • Zedd

               /  December 17, 2015

              oh dear…. 😦

              I better go to the naughty corner

            • Mike C

               /  December 17, 2015

              @Zedd

              I like the fact that you are not a Sheeple in here 🙂

            • kittycatkin

               /  December 17, 2015

              100% boring repetition about John Key is what he gives; one knows exactly what he’s going to say as he’s said it 100 times before in the same words. It would be nice if he said something original.

    • @ bjmarsh1 – in another situation, regarding stage acting, a wise man once said to me, “There are as many Lawrence Oliviers walking the street as you could point a stick at. As many good looks. As many good voices. As many good theatrical senses. The real Lawrence Olivier happened to be in the right place and the right time and do all the right things, along with having a deal of luck”.

      For instance, as the result of a drastic pay cut, the idea that if ‘what’s-his-name’ resigned as CEO of Fonterra no-one else could do the job just doesn’t wash with me. There are probably thousands of people who could and would do the job just as well for a fraction of his pay, and still be well paid.

      The Prime Ministership is an elected position, not a God-given Emperorship or Sainthood.
      John Key does it his way. Someone else would just step up to the plate and do it their way, that’s all.

      So yes, it is exactly Key’s “way” that I object to. It’s clearly Key himself who has a derangement syndrome. The question is, how badly is it affecting his judgement?

      Wakey, wakey!

      • Alan Wilkinson

         /  December 17, 2015

        “It’s clearly Key himself who has a derangement syndrome.”

        It’s extremely unclear how you justify that claim. The man has been one of NZ’s most successful prime ministers ever despite two major trauma events during his terms – the GFC and Chch earthquake. You need more than a bald assertion to counter that record.

        • Zedd

           /  December 17, 2015

          @AW
          you missed the other excuse ‘Team Key’ uses
          “its all the fault of the previous Labour Govt. !”

          Come on man.. admit it; Key has fooled you too :/

          • kittycatkin

             /  December 17, 2015

            Change the rcord, Zedd, the needle’s stuck on that one.

          • Alan Wilkinson

             /  December 17, 2015

            You haven’t. Personal attack, tick. No evidence, tick. No logic, tick. Lefty, tick. Nothing changed then.

  6. alloytoo

     /  December 17, 2015

    We enjoy unprecedented access to our leader compared to the rest of the western world. So naturally we complain.

    • The type of access implied by the soap in the studio?

      • kittycatkin

         /  December 17, 2015

        It wasn’t his idea-and away from the context of being naked in a communal prison shower who’d think it meant that ? Everyone was fully clothed and it wouldn’t be at all obvious what the reference was except to those with vulgar minds.

  7. kiwi dave

     /  December 17, 2015

    I want a leader – not a millionaire buffoon

    • Alan Wilkinson

       /  December 17, 2015

      You’ll look in vain elsewhere in Parliament.

    • kittycatkin

       /  December 17, 2015

      Well, KD, that’s exactly what you have.

      It’s obvious that you don’t know many millionaires or you’d know that people who make that sort of money are hardly likely to be buffoons.

  8. He is a leader, even if a lot of the followers are there out of curiosity!

    • Zedd

       /  December 17, 2015

      So was Adolph !

      • kittycatkin

         /  December 17, 2015

        It’s Adolf. He was German, not French, and it’s an insulting comparison. John Key is Jewish and his mother escaped the Holocaust unlike 6,000,000 other Jews. Shame on you for saying that. That is sinking very low indeed.

        • Mike C

           /  December 17, 2015

          @Kitty

          Wasn’t Hitler Austrian?

          • kittycatkin

             /  December 17, 2015

            Yes, but I couldn’t edit-there’s no real difference, anyway. I hoped that nobody would notice.

            • kittycatkin

               /  December 17, 2015

              Zedd may, of course, have meant someone called Adolph, not Adolf Hitler.

            • Zedd

               /  December 17, 2015

              Actually I was just comparing one ‘populist’ fascist authoritarian dictator with another LOL 🙂

            • Mike C

               /  December 17, 2015

              @Kitty

              But I did … sorry about that 🙂

            • kittycatkin

               /  December 17, 2015

              That’s all right….the dog really liked your Christmas choccies that you won’t be getting now.

  9. Maggy Wassilieff

     /  December 17, 2015

    Am I to believe that this wasn’t a set-up?
    Why would Key know that this was an “in joke” about rape in prison?
    He isn’t a boarding school boy where these 3rd form pranks may have been all the rage.
    He’ll get my vote for as long as these slimy attempts to smear him keep cracking on.

    • MW et al – you seem to be saying he couldn’t have responded by saying, live on air, “No. I don’t support this. This is wrong, insulting and deviant. I will take this opportunity to speak out against it”?

      Something like that I’d respect. Haven’t seen any of that though. And please, do not cite the last ditch apology at the very end of play the other day in the House.

      He willingly took part in this “slimy attempt to smear him” and didn’t respond.

      Hello! Wakey wakey!

      And Alan, people step into the ‘role’, which happens to be occupied presently by John Key. The role isn’t JK its the Prime Ministership. Any number of other politicians could do it.

      • kittycatkin

         /  December 17, 2015

        I wouldn’t have said that either, as I don’t have the sort of mind that would see what they were getting at. Maybe if they’d all been naked and washing themselves together in a shower….but even then, not everybody would see this as a sexual invitation if they weren;t in a prison. From what I gather, in prison it’s an order, not an invitation when picking up the soap happens, anyway.

        Not everyone would see picking up a bar of soap in a radio studio when they were fully clad and so was everyone else as a reference to prison rape in a prison shower where everyone’s wet and naked together and someone is ordered to bend over. I most certainly wouldn’t. The anger should be at the dirty-minded clods who set John Key up in their dirty-minded ‘joke’.

        • KCK – as I see it, the fact you wouldn’t have responded either is meaningless as an argument. As Prime Minister of the nation I wouldn’t have involved myself in that type of radio appearance in the first place.

          The type of prank is also irrelevant.

          Our (dare I say it) ‘free market’ supports these sort of wanker radio stations, evidence the Princess Katherine prank in Australia, which, we might recall, resulted in the nurse suiciding.

          So, IMHO, it is incumbent upon the politician, in this case the Prime politician, to scope out the territory before engaging. Simple as that, no question.

          Spontaneity is one thing, but Key and his advisors know this sort of purile crap is targetted at ‘the set up’. Pigs will fly before I’ll believe they don’t know this sh*t.

          My conclusion is he willingly participated.

          • Alan Wilkinson

             /  December 17, 2015

            It’s obvious he willingly participated. It’s not obvious he was party to the lewd crassness of the “host”. Presumably, though, the kind of listeners who tolerate that jerk don’t care about anything more subtle than his filth masquerading as humour. Transferring the exchange back to the normal world should put the blame squarely where it belongs, on the radio station.

            • Right now on RNZ, Key says its “in the spirit of Christmas” and “light hearted” !!!! Light hearted banter?

              OM f*ing G! Dig that hole deeper and deeper there John. Dig it!
              (Your loyal followers shall not notice and you bloody know it)

              No Alan, just plain no. That filth – which I agree it and he is – that radio station, that “jerk”, is part of the normal world. The real world.

              You go in there “at your own risk”. Buyer beware! The good ole’ free market. Yeeehaaa!!!! Home, home on the range.

            • Alan Wilkinson

               /  December 17, 2015

              There’s a lot of stuff that is part of the normal world that we need to put up with so it will put up with us. Even more so for politicians.

            • PZ, I would have accepted your personal view as your right to have an opinion which differs from mine but for the Wakey Wakey comment at the end. To me this indicates proselytising on your part for a fixed pro Left agenda. Your slip is showing!

            • Fair enough bjm. Picked up on Zedd’s TM there. I don’t know Zedd or what his agenda is. I often enjoy his posts.

              I’m a bit of a drama queen, I freely admit it. That’s what I believe it is, dramatisation. I’m propounding a partisan view. Pushing the envelope a bit. (What makes me think I have any right to do so I’m not sure? But we sometimes seem comfortable with KG and Timoto et al doing so on here?)

              I’m not a Leftie. Honest. I am a non-aligned citizen voter. On some issues I’m probably centre-right and some centre-left and some centre-centre. A centrist?

            • PZ -thanks for your response. I too claim to be a centrist by which I do not mean that my positions on various things are determined by the balance of extreme Right or Left arguments about an issue. Rather, I rely on commonsense research and an appreciation of the evidence available. If I don’t want or need to take a fixed position I like to think I keep eyes and ears open for reasonable propositions. I did complete an on-line assessment on my political viewpoint which I admit was not scientifically proven, and found myself immediately to the Left of the Centre line on the graph!

            • Mike C

               /  December 17, 2015

              @BJ

              Not just once 🙂

    • Maggy – its telling that Labour and friends only have smears to attack him on. On policy they have zip, nada, nothing. Key just smiles and looks through it as he knows they are 30-35% hard core Labour/Green votes he could never ever reach so why worry about thema nd why worry about their bile & invective.

      It was interesting the response to the first non inflation increase in some benefit rates that Key and English delivered – some mute praise and howls of its not enough,when their beloved Clark and Cullen did zip in that area instead spewed middle class welfare about with 0% student loans and juicy WFF payments…

      Key is a winner. His finance jobs are incredibly hard work involving long hours, relentless decision making and all while your job is never safe from the next candidate hungry for the role.

      Haters are going to hate. 2017 could see a few coronaries as all that bile and hate explodes if Key wins again…

  10. Its’ one thing to carry on like a fourth form schoolboy looking for laughs on the radio; what I can’t abide is to see him carry on like that in Parliament, where serious issues are being dealt with.

    • @ belledejourNZ – I wonder what the respective listener stats are for The Edge and Parliament? Both get reported widely where the PM is concerned I guess but I find your comparison ellusive.

      Hopefully you mean something like, “It’s one very, very stupid, unwise, derisory and insulting thing to carry on like a 4th former looking for laughs on the radio. It’s a very similar but utterly unforgivable thing to do so in the debating chamber, where it demeans not only the subjects of his childish comments and his colleagues but the very Parliamentary process itself?

    • Belle – the parliament stuff you see most on the News is question time. Its monkeys in a zoo and lasts 30-40 minutes. The rest of the time on major debates all MPs from all Parties look, sound and behave a heck of a lot better..

      I would back Key and Englishs’ intellect on major policy matters over most in the country. These guys are not dumb.

  11. @ Alan – Ummmm, yes …. and your point is ….?

    The problem with standing for Parliament and becoming Prime Minister is that you place yourself in a somewhat “special position” in the real world. A position we call “leadership”. A very visible position. A position where you are likely to be a model for many people and where people will be “out to get you”.

    It seems kind of obvious to me, you therefore need to be very careful about how you engage with the real world. Engaging with its “low life” media seems kind of unwise?

    Doing unwise things over and over again seems kind of strange?

  12. Alan Wilkinson

     /  December 17, 2015

    “Engaging with its “low life” media seems kind of unwise?” Politicians have to go where the voters are and sometimes hold their nose there. That is simply life. I recall Norman Kirk and Bert Walker at a big tournament in Christchurch where unfortunately the NZ champion got drunk and obnoxious during the event and presentations.

    As Churchill noted, the best argument against democracy is a five minute conversation with the average voter. Nothing has changed since.

    • Alan, well said. I am impressed by the logic of your comments. You obviously have a great memory for Churchill’s comments, do you know where he said it?

    • Dig it Alan!

    • jamie

       /  December 17, 2015

      Alan, just because politicians have to go to these places and interact with these people doesn’t mean they have to lower themselves to that level.

      In your example, for example, did Norman Kirk and Bert Walker join in by getting obnoxiously drunk just to fit in and be good sports?

      Of course not.

      • Alan Wilkinson

         /  December 17, 2015

        No, they looked embarrassed and tried to tactfully shut him up. Not having heard (or wishing to hear) the radio programme I have no idea whether Key audibly did the same or got crude with them, but my guess would be that he probably did not realise what they were up to at all.

        • “He probably did not realise what they were up to at all”

          Your Honour, we are speaking here about the Prime Minister of the nation.
          Your Honour, the prosecution rests.

          • Alan Wilkinson

             /  December 17, 2015

            The PM is supposed to be familiar with prison slang?

            • No, that is not what I have been saying.

              Aside from maybe setting an example, the Prime Minister is supposed to use the media strategically, not be at its mercy, which you seem to be repeating over and over again is the case.

              Repeating it over and over appears to be defending the Prime Minister for engaging in the circumstances which bought about this prison rape joke ‘set up’, whether knowingly or not.

            • Alan Wilkinson

               /  December 17, 2015

              He is using the media strategically as I explained and you ignore. That involves a bit of risk taking for bigger gain. Obviously his background is exactly that. You want him to be what he is not and never will be: risk averse, timid and a butt-protector. That is a bureaucrat, not a currency trader and politician.

            • This one’s gonna go down the line like the other day Alan.

              This is “using the media strategically”!!!?????
              Holy sh*t, really!?
              I’m not ignoring it. I’m deriding it. That’s some kinda strategy you got there mister Prime Minister (with all it’s associations, despite all your media wranglers)

              This strategic use of the media buys him what? The deadhead f*ckwit idiot media savvy lowlife vote?
              All 3 of them! The rest, of course, are laughing at him for being sucked in and for thinking they might ever vote at all anyhow.

              Risk averse and timid? No. I’m talking sensible, cunning and beguiling. I think maybe he should protect his butt in this particular case though.

              OMG – “not a currency trader and a politician”? The first is hardly the highest of personal recommendations or qualifications for the second Alan.
              “How did you make your millions?”
              “Oh, buying and selling national currencies, you know, speculation of the lowest order. Nothing productive”.

              This is ‘The Donalds’ claim to fame too, isn’t it. A fortune made in ethically tenous ways. Property speculation.

              I know we agreed not to tell each other what to do Alan, but I can’t help it. I’d stop digging this hole now if I was you.

            • Alan Wilkinson

               /  December 17, 2015

              “buying and selling national currencies, you know, speculation of the lowest order. Nothing productive”

              Oh dear, I see some education is in order. Anyone can buy and sell currency and almost all of them will lose money. The banking professionals who make money for their companies doing it employ sophisticated strategies and mathematics as well as economic analyses (and sometimes illegal inside information). They have to react very quickly and accurately to events which can occur at any time of night and day. They are productive in the sense that they give the seller a higher price than s/he would otherwise get and the buyer a lower price than s/he would otherwise have to pay as well as making a profit for their bank and hence their shareholders and customers. Liquid currency markets are important for international trade and particularly for countries like NZ for which it is a large part of their economy.

              A successful currency trader has a cool head, is good at mathematics, very competitive and savvy at human politics, motivations and reactions.

              I know all this because another close family member was one!

            • @ Alan – what you’ve described is a long-winded way of saying “speculation in money” or usury, and an equally long winded way of getting off topic. I’ll get back to you about currency trading.

            • jamie

               /  December 17, 2015

              @Alan “The PM is supposed to be familiar with prison slang?”

              That’s quite a twist. The “don’t drop the soap” routine is one of the oldest tropes around.

              No one need be the slightest bit familiar with prison slang to get it.

            • Alan Wilkinson

               /  December 17, 2015

              I’ll take your word for it, Jamie. But if it is so common, how come the Lefties are getting so excited about it?

  13. Mike C

     /  December 17, 2015

    @PartisanZ

    Firstly … Zedd has never had “An Agenda” as far as I have been able to see over the past year or so since I have been here 🙂

    And Secondly … why on earth did you call yourself “A Drama Queen” ???

    • @ Mike C – did you like my three words? Did you get it? Did you dig it?

      Even if Zedd’s a way out Leftie I say good on him or her for what he or she says.

      I call myself ‘this model citizen and artist’. A lot of my artistic expression has been drama.

      A very special form of spontaneous drama.

      And a very good definition is, “Art is exaggeration in the direction of Truth” (J Fox)

      I have also put it this way –

      “Thus, with the magic ingredient imagination, life becomes art, and art, life”

      • Mike C

         /  December 17, 2015

        @PartisanZ

        Okay … it’s Official … you write a whole lot of shit on here 🙂

        • @ Mike C – care to explain? You asked me about “drama queen”?

          If you had predetermined what I should answer you could just say it yourself?

          I believe I exaggerate somewhat at times, hopefully for effect. I dramatise.

          How does a few quotes constitute “a whole lot of shit”?

          What are you saying? That people don’t exhibit their personalities on here?

        • Robby

           /  December 17, 2015

          @ Mike C – I don’t mean to be rude, but isn’t that a tad hypocritical of you?? 😀

  14. Back on topic. 5.30 News on RNZ reports that Key took part in the radio show in the spirit of Christmas, it was “light hearted” and the radio station decided the content.

    I am led to believe that our highest regarded current affairs shows do not get to completely decide the content. That questions can be ruled “out of bounds” for various reasons.

    So the PM has foregone these prerogatives, given up his usual powers, for the sake of appearing on the Edge?

    In the political and parliamentary worlds of carefully worded press releases, media wranglers and highly selected appearances I find this extraordinary beyond belief.

  15. Mike C

     /  December 17, 2015

    @PartisanZ

    You said you were a “Drama Queen”.

    You cannot “Unsay It” 🙂

    • @ Mike C – Okay, I am trying to understand? Is it worth my while?

      “You said you were a “Drama Queen”. Correct. Yes I did.

      “You cannot “Unsay It””. I’m happy to know that Mike C, especially since I wasn’t trying to “unsay it”. Can you provide evidence I was trying to? I can’t see any. I certainly didn’t intent to unsay it. I go as far as to say, I don’t want to unsay it.

      Does saying I’m a drama queen disqualify me from something?
      Being taken seriously perhaps?

      In my recollection this is the second time you’ve asked me something like this, I’ve responded somewhat personally – with a degree of personal revelation – and you’ve shot me down. This is your modus operandi presumably?

      Anyhow, I should have learned the first time and now I have.
      Ψ

      • Mike C

         /  December 17, 2015

        @PartisanZ

        Really … I have an MO ???

        • @ Mike C – it would appear so to me. I kind of “entrapment” thing goin’ on?

          Reveal something about your true self to me?

          • Mike C

             /  December 17, 2015

            @Partisan

            No entrapment strategy on my part 🙂

            I shall now reveal some thing about my true self to you … which is:-

            “I am training to be a helicopter pilot”.

  16. kittycatkin

     /  December 17, 2015

    The Duchess of Cambridge is not called Princess Katherine (her name is Catherine, anyway) and suicide is a noun, not a verb. Nobody would say ;homicided’. I hope,

    • @ KCK – I stand corrected. So, aside from this technical stuff, what do you think of the subject matter?

  17. Robby

     /  December 17, 2015

    I heard the so called ‘interview’ on The Rock when it was first broadcast. I’m not a fan of JK myself, but lets put this into perspective.
    The breakfast show on The Rock is a complete farce at the best of times. I only listen to it because it is on the workshop radio. These idiots laugh so hard at their own stupid jokes, that in my opinion they are a far better example of a ‘circle jerk’ than WO ever was/is. JK was foolish to go on air with them. To accuse him of trivializing prison rape by playing along with these idiots is a pretty long bow to draw….

    • Would he wander into a Mongrel Mob Headquarters to do a PR stint? He goes into Idiot Radio because he’ll be seeing the opportunity to be better than any risk. How many radio companies and stations does he have an ongoing familiar relationship with?
      He uses them, they use him.
      Naturally enough when a subject of contention and controversy comes up his availability and willingness are considerably diminished. Then he makes very managed appearances in situations where he has as much control as possible.

      • @Duprez…. unavailability? When the house is sitting Key is always available and does Q&A everyday walking to and from the chamber…. Unavailable is a stretch…

    • @ Robby – THWANNNNGGGGG!!!! (Longbow string sound)

      He played along with these idiots. Prison rape happened to be set-up subject de jour.
      If it had been traditional rape we’d be having a very different conversation eh?

      And yet, there are those for whom prison rape is a reality and very sensitive subject.

      That should be a lesson in opportunity vs risk I guess?

  18. Goldie

     /  December 17, 2015

    I wonder, of all the people who hate John Key so much, whether they have actually met and talked to the guy?

    • @ Goldie – I’ll jump in the rusty, old, unwarranted, unregistered Bitsa Mishi van right now and head for Wellywood to meet him shall I?

      No, hang on, I’m going to Dorkland for Xmas. I’ll stop in at Hell-ends Ville on the way and casually call in at the Key estate and vineyard for a quiet tipple and a chat with the PM. I bet he’ll welcome me with open arms!?

      Happy to meet the man, honestly, if he ever appears up North in a decile one town or village near me.

      • Robby

         /  December 17, 2015

        Good luck with that PZ. If, however, you had a well aged single malt in your ‘sin cabinet’, and told the ‘right people’ you were ready to take the lid off it, I’m pretty certain that your local MP would be happy to have his ear bashed… 😉

        • @ Robby – during the Northland by-election campaign, Winston published his itinerary for a visit to my town one day. A meeting with the Chamber of Commerce in Kaitaia starting 10am and then a “street meeting” in my little town – one hour’s drive away – at 11.30, then on to Ruakaka, like 2 hours+ south, for his next meeting at 1.30pm I think.

          Despite the absolute impossibility of this actually happening, maybe around 40 or so people gathered, from a population of 140, and patiently awaited the arrival of the big black bus.

          Needless to say Peters never showed. The itinerary was farcical. No messages, texts, twits or facebook posts showed up either. We stood around generally fomenting radicalism, as we do around here.

          Many of us voted for Winnie anyhow. Voted strategically. He was the first candidate in over 30 years with a hope of displacing National.

          Never thought of trying to contact him with news of a vintage malt though. Gotta remember that if there ever is a next time, which I very much doubt.

          • Alan Wilkinson

             /  December 17, 2015

            So what on earth did you hope to achieve by voting for Winston?

          • Robby

             /  December 17, 2015

            And he did it! Displaced National, that is ..That’s a pretty good show, and he didn’t show. Keep that vintage malt ageing, email him & remind him about it regularly. 😀 Tell him what you just said here, and if he doesn’t show up before next Friday, I’ll be very surprised, disappointed actually…

            • Can I say this? Oh hell, freedom of speech, you know?
              1) To show National that 20 odd years of neglect of the region, or of many voters “feeling” neglected, shall not go unrewarded.
              2) To show you don’t send a boy (Sabin) to do a man’s (Carter’s) work so the man can become Mayor and, arguably, push National’s agenda of local body amalgamation?
              [Specially not a bad boy pretending to be good?]
              3) To encourage alternative Parties and National itself to come back in 2017 with real, meaningful policies for Northland. This will equally keep Winston on his toes if he wants to keep the seat for himself or NZF.
              4) Any other reasons any other voters had …?
              Now, before you come back with your response from the intelligensia, remember this very night you have been expounding and praising John Key’s appeal to the average bloke. The average Northland bloke spoke Alan, and he spoke quite loud! Oddly, his woman spoke too. And, a whole bunch of entirely independent women spoke as well.
              I hope we do get proper RMA reform. Not sure Mark Osbourne would have tipped the scales on that score?

            • Alan Wilkinson

               /  December 18, 2015

              I simply refer you to Churchill’s quote. Voting for Peters has stymied RMA reform for another term and achieved absolutely nothing for Northland or NZ.

            • PartizanZ, I was born in Ngataki mum le years ago, and was educated at Kaitaia Primary/ College along with 3 siblings. We four were all Worth Street mob members and faced the usual challenges of growing up in the Far North. I have tried to get back every year to touch base with the people who I know and respect as real individuals. I had the honour to command some of them on active service in Malaysia, Borneo and Vietnam and weep for those who have gone before including an elder brother who died in service from an unrecognised vascular condition. I retain huge pride for the people I grew up with during my formative years including big Peter Jones, little Peter Jones, Muru Walters, Pat Walsh and John Walsh, the Gregory brothers, the Biggwither family from Pukenui who I shared Christmas holidays with in my more tender years and was looked after by their mother who was a wonderful big hearted lady who took a young 3 year old pakeha into her whanau and made me feel a part of it.
              I consequently have an opinion about Northland and the needs of my home area for it become the dynamic power house for Tourism and Maori development it should be Alas, in recent years, it has lost its mana because of the effects of drugs, alcohol, gang violence, and the demise of moral values. There is a clear need for the Far North people to seize control of the local Government and make the democratic decisions needed for the future of the second most under-developed part of New Zealand. Some Maori need to lose their arrogance and negativity about non-Maori New Zealanders and remember we are all in the same waka.
              I know there are people of huge capability in the Far North. What has happened in the last few years is a clear signal to Government and Opposition alike, Enough is enough. Beware the taniwha!

            • Sorry, I was 13 years old.

            • @bjm – āe, kia kaha matua. I am pakeha and agree “we are all in the same waka”, though we’re not ‘the same’.

              Did you read Anahera Herbert-Graves column ‘Peace within ourselves’ in the Age on Tues 15 Dec? I thought it was wonderful.

              People learn moral values bjm. They don’t just magically have them and then lose them, as you know. And they learn them as much or more by example as by ‘education’ or being taught. As Anahera points out, there also has to be a match between our internal values and the external values ‘out there’ in the world (which are also ours?). Especially if you are asked to enact those values and they don’t match yours.

              So the ‘fence at the top of the cliff’ questions for me are, “What is it about life nowadays that erodes moral values”?
              And what are the external values ‘out there’ which are incompatible with wholesome, ethical internal values?

              There’s plenty of “answers” to both questions I reckon, or issues to investigate. There’s a lot about the organisation of society that teaches amorality or immorality, I reckon.

              So along with individual responsibility, education and personal change, we can apply some ethics to the system as well. Don’t demonstrate to the children what we don’t want them to copy. Forget this, “Do as I say, not as I do” rubbish.

              I hope I haven’t heard you wrong. I certainly awhi this matua, I go along with this, “the dynamic power house for Tourism and Maori development”.

              I thank you again for your deep sharing.

            • @bjm – I reckon we can add a few more industries to those two of yours, Tourism and Maori Development.

              From my experience in the North and especially Hokianga, add “The Arts” to this list. Visual arts, performing arts, film etc, with Maori arts a big component of all those.

              Other than dairy, there are also many smaller niche primary industries – various branches of agri-and-horticulture (including viticulture) – and the secondary industries stemming from them – the value added processing, manufacturing and marketing industries.

              The North has heaps of potential. Question is how to activate it or activate it even more than it already is?

      • Little to no chance meeting him on a Helensville Estate PnZ…. he lives in Parnell!

        • @ dave1924 – and he’ll probably be in Hawaii anyhow, eh? I couldn’t afford a detour to Helensville regardless. Cheers.

          • He earnt his cash so Hawai’i is all good by me. He needs a place to be away from the NZ Media and its relentless whining, negativity and endless attempts to get him…

            • @ Dave1924 – “He earnt his cash”. I can’t argue with that, but what the hell, I will anyway. (You may want to read no further?)

              This depends on the credence you give to ‘systems theory’ or the idea of an ‘economic ecosystem’. E.g, producers rely on consumers and, ideally, rely on them being workers as well. Hence, depressing workers wages is counter-productive for consumption, which is unproductive for production. (I’m generalising wildly here).

              An analogy is a natural ecosystem can’t operate with predators alone. Predators need prey. Individual predators and prey may compete in life and death struggles, but in the sense that both populations are required to maintain the ecosystem, they could be said to ‘cooperate’ in doing so.

              Some economic sub-systems, events or “fashions” favour certain individuals, groups and industries. A great example is Rogernomics’ deregulation, which favoured merchant bankers and made multi-millionaires out of the Faye Richwhites et al.

              I think John Key and the Money Traders (that’d be a good name for a band eh?) fall into this category. Conditions favour them making extremely large amounts of money personally. Wouldn’t the economic ecosystem be better off if they made reasonable, ethical amounts of money instead? If the remaining money was liquid in the productive sector rather than lining someone’s pocket (and yes, investment portfolio)? [There is some evidence vast salaries and dividends remove money from the productive sector]

              Meantime Unions have largely been disarmed by government legislation. Sure, you can argue legislation armed them in the first place, but today’s situation might be said to mostly favour employers. Of course they don’t all make excessive or obscene profits or salaries by any means. I’m not saying that.

              Indeed, I hear just today that our economy is up 0.9% and looking good largely on the back of manufacturing. Many sectors, the commentator on RNZ said, have “recalibrated” themselves. This is great news! Really, I think it’s great.

              I sure hope it trickles down or flows across to more employment and higher wages? I don’t hold out a whole lot of hope for this though.

              Oh hell, for those who did read this far, sorry, I should never have learned to touch type.

            • Ethical? hmmm… ok PnZ. Economic ecosystem is fine but it doesn’t have to be predatory and prey if you exercise your brain.

              As for Key his function as a currency trader when he started out, its a pretty important function allows exporters and importers pick a price and know they can buy/sell currency against the NZD at any time.

              Some people make lots of money – big deal. As long as its not illegal it doesn’t worry me.

            • @ dave1924 – I was exercising my mind very well I believe. It was an analogy, a comparison, of an ecosystem with two components which appears competitive but in fact – from a distance – in the long view – has an ultimately cooperative outcome. Predator and prey were not meant to align to anything in economics. Call them “labour” and “capital” if you like?

              I have to admit my understanding of currency trading is quite limited. When one searches “alternatives” one gets stuff about Bitcoins and green dollars.

              Some people making lots of money is a big deal for me, especially hideously large amounts of money. This is because ultimately it’s an ecosystem with a finite amount of money in it (more-or-less).

              I liken it to the oceans of the planet (money) and the tides, which I guess is the pull of the Moon’s gravity, eh? (The Moon might therefore equate with “capitalism”? No matter)

              The Moon rises, and when the waters of the world are drawn over to one side the tide is “in” over on that side, one hemisphere, and the tide is “out” over on the other side. Rich and poor?

              Problem is, the Moon is stuck there. It ain’t orbiting the planet. Z’how I see it.
              Ψ

    • Zedd

       /  December 18, 2015

      @Goldie
      I sez wot I seez..

      btw; I do know one person who met him & said he is the ‘politician through & through’.. but is there actually a real man behind the MASK ? :/

  19. This blog subject has a long tail? No I did not mean “tale”. I think it is engaging and recall something Alan said earlier and modified it to say “A successful Prime Minister has a cool head, is good at mathematics, very competitive and savvy at human politics, motivations and reactions” and added that a successful Prime Minister in New Zealand also needs to be egalitarian, honest and a strong family man with moral fibre. I also would add that in the absence of feminine charm the PM should know when to present a stern front. A democratic leader draws the line fairly liberally but also knows that when that line is stepped over the recalcitrant should be stomped on from a great height.