White Ribbon on John Key and The Rock

White Ribbon has accepted assurances from John Key over radio stunts that have widely been regarded as distasteful, and has condemned The Rock and The Edge radio stations.

From a post on the White Ribbon website:

Recently, The Rock radio station created a segment that referenced male rape in a manner that trivialised this horrific violence. It was an awful exercise in bad taste and helped to perpetuate violence by normalising and trivialising it. We understand that some people won’t see it that way, it will be in their eyes just a joke. We however do not agree.

It’s an old ‘joke’ that I heard in other contexts long before I knew it was associated with prison rape. I agree with White Ribbon that the radio segment trivialised what can be horrific violence.

As many people know, a White Ribbon Ambassador (the Prime Minister) was involved in an on-air segment on the Rock which was highly offensive. We have reached out to the Prime Minister, and we are informed that he did not know what was about to occur, and did not at the time comprehend the rape references or make any. We take the Prime Minister at his word.

If Key was made aware of what was going to happen in advance I would be very surprised if he would have agreed to take part in what The Rock planned.

A statement from the Key last week:

“The Prime Minister does these interviews in the spirit of Christmas and the content is decided by the hosts.”

“The interviews are meant to be light-hearted, and the Prime Minister hopes the media and the public take them that way.”

I think Key’s intent was light hearted but his participation was abused by the radio station.

NZ Herald reports:

Last Wednesday, Mr Key was taking part in an interview at the Rock when he was persuaded to enter a cage that had been brought into the studio.

Once inside, he was told by host Tom Furniss to pick up a bar of soap, and did so to laughter from the station’s staff.

Picking up soap is a reference to prison rape. Furniss then told Mr Key he had a “pretty little mouth” – a reference to the film Deliverance.

I’ve seen Deliverance a long time ago (it came out in the seventies) and don’t remember that reference.

I think what Furniss said and did was inappropriate, highly distasteful and disgraceful.

White Ribbon:

The Radio Station however were aware that they were using a rape reference as the basis of a joke. This all too common acceptance of rape and violence within our society is unacceptable. It can re-victimise and trivialise, and whether directed at men or women, it is wrong.

It looks to me like an irresponsible and dirty attempt to embarrass the Prime Minister, without any thought about the wider implications of their attention seeking.

We ask organisations such as the Rock to consider whether they wish to be part of the solution and help to end the unacceptable levels of violence, or through their actions or inaction, continue to create the environment that supports violence.

I’d like to see a response to this from Tom Furniss and The Rock.

I have just checked The Rock and see they are still promoting “John Key joins Tom in his cage” on their website.

Leave a comment

65 Comments

  1. col

     /  21st December 2015

    This is the most sensible reaction I have seen on this subject. The Rock team spent time planning this stupid stunt, The Prime Minister was winging it totally unprepared for what was coming next.I for one am totally sick of these shock jocks and their filth.

    Reply
    • @ col – It therefore follows we have a Prime Minister who goes into media publicity and interview opportunities either without knowing their content in advance, without preparation and planning or without taking some strategic control of the content; or all of these things?
      1) I don’t think so!
      2) If it’s true …. well, aren’t the implications obvious? “Winging it”
      Either way you have a faulty equation 1 + 1 = nothing.

      Reply
      • kittycatkin

         /  21st December 2015

        I can’t imagine that he would ask for a word by word copy of everything that was going to said and done-there must be some spontenaity. In this case, I think that he was meanly taken advantage of by dirty-minded people who were all in on a ‘joke’ that he was not aware of.

        The Edge people seem to find rape funny, and nothing will change that, I fear. But they have been left looking dirty-minded and silly when their victim didn’t catch on to what they were doing.

        Reply
    • Joe Bloggs

       /  21st December 2015

      @ col
      well you get part of the way there …shock jocks and their filth seems an apposite description. These guys outdo WO as sewerage outlets, and yes PG and Brown I too hope he tells The Rock to get stuffed and stays well away from their fleas…

      But a Prime Minister who is winging it totally unprepared..? If John Key’s judgement and preparation is so impaired that he wings things totally unprepared then we should rightly question his fitness to hold the position of Prime Minister.

      Conversely if he is prepared but fails to impose control as PartisanZ points out, then shouldn’t we again question his judgement and fitness for the role?

      Now I’m counting down ..5..4..3.. to a few likely responses that this is a non-issue, a five-minute flash-in-the-pan, a left-wing-led beat-up… in and of itself those are not unreasonable arguments…The trouble is that it’s consistent with other similar errors of judgement, such as ponytailgate, or mincing down the catwalk… no, actually it’s more than that. The prison-rape stunt goes much further than mincing down a catwalk.

      And when it comes on top of significant cuts in funding to rape crisis centres throughout New Zealand, and silencing women parliamentarians who are trying to recount their own experiences of sexual violence, I’m asking myself, where the f**k is the prime minister’s head? What version of morality does he ascribe to that stops him from standing up and saying “No, that’s wrong and I won’t participate”?

      Just think about those last few words for a moment, think about standing up and saying what needs to be said about sexual violence…

      Reply
      • Joe Bloggs

         /  21st December 2015

        Downticks? Really? People would rather John Key and The Rock continue to condone violence, than stand up and say enough is enough? Really?

        I despair for this country’s moral compass

        Reply
        • FarmerPete

           /  21st December 2015

          It is the leap from inappropriate humour, probably not recognised by Key at the time, to ‘continuing to condone violence’ that many won’t respond to. It has nothing to do with moral compass. It is about inappropriate humour foisted on the Prime Minister, who by the way is now also a victim of this ‘joke’.

          Reply
          • jamie

             /  21st December 2015

            “inappropriate humour, probably not recognised by Key at the time”

            I don’t think that flies at all. There was nothing particularly original or sophisticated about the humour.

            It beggars belief that someone as smart and quick on his feet as the PM somehow didn’t understand the joke he was taking part in.

            He had every opportunity to back out at any time, but he chose to carry on taking part in it.

            Reply
            • FarmerPete

               /  21st December 2015

              Of course the humour was tasteless and poor quality. That is a given, and the radio station should be mortified that they could indulge in such tawdry ‘banter’ (can’t think of a more appropriate word here). They have admitted it was preplanned and that it was sprung on Key.
              Sometimes pressure takes the brain hostage. Ever been involved in public speaking? That is quite a common experience even for very experienced people. The more face to lose, the more the pressure. Now, I am not saying that was what happened, but there are lots of explanations that fit just as well as one of ‘legitimising prison rape’.
              Imputing motive to another is a risky business and it nearly always leads to false conclusions.

            • jamie

               /  21st December 2015

              I wasn’t referring to the taste or quality of the humour, but the originality of it.

              It’s an old, old joke and a simple one. It’s not believable to me that John Key didn’t understand it or didn’t get it.

              If it was some new or particularly sophisticated humour it might be believable that he wasn’t aware of what he was taking part in.

              I don’t see anyone imputing motive to John Key. I haven’t seen anyone say he intentionally belittled rape victims or anything like that. The criticism – at least that I’m aware of – is that he was careless to go along with it.

              The only motive I would ascribe to him in this instance is the desire to fit in, to be a good sport.

              Unfortunately in doing so he allowed himself to be part of a pretty offensive display making fun of rape in prison.

              That is an error of judgement on his part but I don’t think anyone – or hardly anyone – would think he set out to deliberately belittle anyone, but in being careless he certainly has.

            • kittycatkin

               /  21st December 2015

              I’d say that it was obvious that he didn’t see the connection between the soap and rape or he wouldn’t have done it. If they’d all been naked in a shower, then it could well have been more obvious. As it was, I don’t think it was obvious at all. I am aware of prison rape, but I didn’t see that this was meant to be a reference to that. Not with everyone fully clothed and in a studio,

            • jamie

               /  21st December 2015

              Kitty I’m not second-guessing your familiarity with this very well-known trope. That’s irrelevant.

              I’m saying I don’t believe that the very worldly, sociable, intelligent, jokey-blokey John Key doesn’t know what “pick up the soap” means.

          • Ratty

             /  21st December 2015

            No-one has the right to demand people not be to be offended at the expense of tasteless humour, that’s up to those who are offended, not the ones who carried out this stunt..

            Reply
            • FarmerPete

               /  21st December 2015

              When the protest is obviously over the top, we all have the right, especially where some complainers (eg NZH this am) put their qualifications out front and centre and use their ‘position as a weapon in the objection.
              All I am saying is ‘hang on a minute, yes it was inappropriate but the reaction is also way over the top’.

            • kittycatkin

               /  21st December 2015

              Jamie, I can’t see any connection between someone being worldly, sociable and intelligent etc and catching on to a reference to male prison rape in a radio studio (not a prison) where everyone is fully dressed, facing each other and not in a shower. There had been no reference to anything to do with this before. If they’d all been naked and in the shower together, it would have been very different. Context makes a great difference. We don’t all have the grubby minds that the Edge people do, seeing everything in terms of sex..

            • jamie

               /  21st December 2015

              Kitty, as I said it’s not of any interest to me whether you understand this very, very common trope or not.

        • It’s this faux outrage that; developed since we let too many 10 pound Poms in that makes me “despair for this country’s moral compass” rather than the Rock and JK’s stunt. It’s this faux outrage that will ensure I’ll keep on voting National until the left grow some.

          There is no picking their battles for the left and the media – it’s all tosspot. tell-tale, goody two shoes kid’s moaning and groaning like a plane load of Poms. Who gives a toss what Key did on the radio, who instigated what, who said this or that and what the circumstances were. I’m concerned about unemployment, our disgusting tale of 20% that can’t read or write and I care deeply also that we have fourth generation State dependents and jails full of all of the above.

          Key is that Dad joke kind of guy who loves to play to the gallery. He is alternately self deprecating and bit of a tosser. He’s like my brother. However he’s someone who has been a great PM through good and bad. He represents us excellently on the world stage, he’s brought us street cred in Washington and London. He’s smart, successful, astute and knows how to lead from the top and by example. I suggest it’s the combination of his attributes that give him his 65% approval and why the other 365% hate him in the way they hate all success.

          All those who hate his guts and get twisted out of shape every time he eats a hot dog, downs a Steinie or shakes the wrong hand should know that most of us like him because he’s the best PM we’ve ever had.

          Some need to concentrate on being the best they can, helping others where they can and watching their blood pressure. Merry Xmas to the Key Derangement Syndrome sufferers.

          Reply
          • That’ll be 35%. Excuse typos please Key Derangement Syndrome sufferers – are you as outraged over typos as you are about the PM offending your moral sensibilities?

            Reply
            • KRAS – Key Reverence & Adoration Syndrome.

              I contest your assertion: The best PM we have ever had is Michael Joseph Savage.

  2. Brown

     /  21st December 2015

    Lie down with dogs and you get fleas. Doing this crap demeans the role of being PM.

    Reply
  3. Steve Taylor

     /  21st December 2015

    This would be the same White Ribbon campaign that studiously avoids any acknowledgement that around 50% of non-fatal domestic violence is committed against men, by women? Seems its not only David Cunnliffe who is sorry for being a man.

    Reply
    • Joe Bloggs

       /  21st December 2015

      @Steve Taylor

      White Ribbon was specifically set up to focus on violence towards women. So I agree that it’s curious they’d come out so strongly against the same sex sexual-violence that prison-rape is, but not do the same for domestic violence committed by women against men…maybe it would be more consistent for an organisation whose aim is to eliminate violence to stand against all violence, rather than just violence against women

      But those observations turn a critical gaze on people who speak out against violence and that’s the wrong focus. At least White Ribbon speaks out, and that’s a hell of a lot more than most of us do.

      The critical gaze needs to be on crass stunts like this one and the people who participate in them…and whether we like it or not the Prime Minister of New Zealand participated in a crass stunt that worked to legitimise prison-rape

      Reply
      • Ratty

         /  21st December 2015

        +1

        Reply
      • FarmerPete

         /  21st December 2015

        ‘…that worked to legitimise prison rape’. Come on get a grip. It was inappropriate certainly, but ‘worked to legitimise prison rape’, that is a completely inappropriate linkage.

        Reply
        • jamie

           /  21st December 2015

          If you don’t accept that joking around about prison rape is a legitimising act, then what was inappropriate about it?

          Reply
          • FarmerPete

             /  21st December 2015

            Perhaps you would care to explain how that linkage is made? Poor quality, bad taste humour is present everyday of the week. Just because a group or nationality is the butt of a joke doesn’t imply anything other than humour, inappropriate or not. Comment about it, put it down, and direct the criticism where it is due, mainly to the radio station, but to draw such a long bow and say it legitimises prison rape. I repeat ‘get a grip’.

            Reply
            • jamie

               /  21st December 2015

              Perhaps you misunderstood me. I was asking what you found inappropriate about the joke, not specifically about linking it to anything else.

            • FarmerPete

               /  21st December 2015

              I did misunderstand you (I guess that underlines my point about imputing motive). I find lots of humour tasteless or inappropriate, and also in some cases artwork (eg the Virgin in a bottle of pee).
              I can’t see the value in deriding a group or section of the community in a pointed or nasty way. But, I also believe in free speech, so sometimes that is the price we pay.
              I also hate with a passion the propensity we all have today over trivial stuff. And no rape is not trivial, but pathetic, crass humour is.

            • Joe Bloggs

               /  21st December 2015

              Poor, bad taste humour?? Sorry fella, I’ve got a sense of humour but I just don’t think sexual violence is funny

            • Many of us out there are not in Penal Reform Leagues. Many of us are so crass and so base that we derive amusement from the thought of a hardened NZ prisoner being the “butt” of jokes. Apart from ensuring that they’re locked securely away, kept fed and dry and maybe the tiniest bit rehabilitated nobody much cares about much else. There’s some of us out there who have quite unpleasant thoughts about anyone who has transgressed enough to go to prison. There’s some of us who think that those who think thepick up soap joke is indicative of promoting sexual violence or can’t/won’t contextualise it are living on another planet or are just politicising.

            • The Prime Minister of New Zealand, leader of the National party, going on a radio show is NOT politicising it? Anything whatsoever that happens on said radio is automatically politicised by his merely being there. It’s so simple, unless you are KRAS, as you say.

        • Joe Bloggs

           /  21st December 2015

          I think we must agree to fundamentally disagree on what constitutes a legitimising process, Farmer Pete…

          I share a view of legitimacy as social influence induced by feelings of “should,” “ought to,” or “has a right to,” in other words an appeal to an “internalized norm or value.” And I also share a view that legitimising processes occur when people allow other people to define the boundaries of appropriate behaviour in a given situation.

          When we stop questioning what the boundaries of appropriate behaviour are, then we implicitly endorse behaviours that stray over those boundaries.

          Add a figure of authority (play along with me for as moment and agree that John Key is a figure of authority) into a situation where he’s a party to crossing boundaries and you have the hallmarks of a legitimising process in action…because you not only have other people defining what the boundaries are, but you also have figures of authority participating in that process of definition…and legitimacy is, after all, a psychological property of an authority, that leads those connected to it to believe that it is appropriate, proper, and just.

          That’s how I make the linkage…but if you or Alan want to continue turning a blind eye then that’s entirely your prerogative.

          Reply
          • Alan Wilkinson

             /  21st December 2015

            The essence of humour is surprise and a challenge to orthodoxy. Black humour even more so. But to describe it as legitimizing is simply false. It is much more subtle than that as it parodies our reactions or ambivalences to evil. Not having watched, nor intending to watch the programme my guess is this “humour” failed on pretty much all counts of taste, wit and originality.

            However, my ease at ignoring it is doubtless facilitate by my complete lack of respect for or susceptibility to influence by “figures of authority” – which is certainly a prerogative I intend to continue to exercise and recommend to you.

            Reply
      • Steve Taylor

         /  21st December 2015

        Hi Joe,

        You may want to check the Canadian back-story to the campaign. It emerged out of a University shooting, and was gender-universal in its approach to the perpetuation of violence.

        Reply
  4. Bob

     /  21st December 2015

    Both the Rock and the Edge ambushed the PM, they are childish and pathetic and should try and grow up, PM should refuse all future requests, not worth the aggravation to get involved.

    Reply
  5. Patzcuaro

     /  21st December 2015

    To me it seems that both parties are at fault here.

    The radio stations/DJs live in a ratings bubble where all that matters is audience. We saw the tragic end result of this when the DJs in Australia impersonated the Queen when Kate was in hospital. It seemed like a bit of harmless fun at the time but every action has a reaction and once the stunt is pulled the the DJs have no control over the consequences. A bit like firing of an email, once sent you lose control of where it ends up.

    In John Key’s case he is the Prime Minister and he needs to maintain the dignity of that role. The radio spots are a good way of him making contact with a constituency that doesn’t normally follow politics and are therefore a valuable tool.

    I think that he needs to get his minders to lay down some ground rules that balance maintainng the dignity of his office with his desire to maintain contact with day to day people.

    The radio stations need to appreciate this and also lay down some ground rules for their DJs. The radio spots that John Key does are a privilege not a right and should be treated as such rather than trashed.

    Forget the three strikes and you out, the PM should let the radio stations know it’s one strike and your out.

    Reply
  6. Here is a good insight into Key’s personality, by another person who is the same type. ESTP.
    Plenty of insights here if you have the patience to watch it. 🙂

    Reply
    • FarmerPete

       /  21st December 2015

      Really, the MBTI? Wow.

      Reply
    • “Plenty of insights here if you have the patience to watch it.”

      Or, if we blithely accept that you have any authority to pronounce on the personality traits of anyone. If you do please show your credentials, and in the absence of that, please tell us about your own personality.. I’m Myers Briggs ENFP myself with a flexible P to T ratio.

      Reply
      • FarmerPete

         /  21st December 2015

        I am an ENTP and I have possibly more experience than most with this tool. I am also a clinical psychologist by training and ran probably the most well known appraisal unit for many years. Would this qualify?
        I would not use the MBTI in any other setting than team building. There is lots wrong with it.

        Reply
        • I guess your qualifications are satisfactory. 😉 If Key is an ESTP, he’s clearly a very self aware one with a well developed “I” side to him. Do you think his upbringing gives him an underlying humility that blunts the ESTP edges? My partner is an ESTP, I know them well enough.

          Reply
      • sure, I haven’t typed Key myself, he did a ‘quiz’ (test) which indicated his preferences were ESTP. I myself am INFJ. I thought it was interesting what EJ said about the disconnect between his (coldish) eyes and his smile. ‘The Smiling Assassin’ 🙂

        Reply
  7. Zedd

     /  21st December 2015

    Surely Key knew what he was getting himself into.. again, efforts to appeal to the ‘lowest common denominator’ (populist appeal),
    BUT sounds like he was taken as a fool (again !)

    time he got his head out ‘.. but you cant fool all the people all the time…’ :/

    Reply
    • I don’t think Key is a fool at all, though he enjoys this kind of ‘fooling around’. It is a useful persona to distract attention away from his true agendas and activities.

      Reply
      • What are his “true” agendas and activities do you think?

        Wanting this little country to be the best it can in any way we can would be my pick for his number one. Then I reckon he wants health and happiness and independence for Stephie, and Max. Then he wants to drop his golf handicap and maybe trade up to something larger in Hawaii. You’re not going to tell me he’s a Mason (Jewish I’m not seeing it!) or that he’s a member of the New World Order now are you bdj??

        Reply
        • No I’m not going to tell you that. 🙂 Nothing wrong with the Masons! 🙂
          But I don’t happen to believe Key is working in the interests of the kinds of people who listen to radio for the brain dead. Regular folks. He never has been, and never will, is my estimate.

          Reply
          • If he wasn’t working for them why would he appear on their show?

            He’s simply who he is, there’s nothing complicated you should know that about an ESTP. Those “brain dead” people still vote and “that laugh of a bloke” Key who seems to be doing a “decent job” is the one front and foremost in their minds when they step into the box.

            Reply
            • I have already answered that. He may need the votes of the normal bloke, yes, but he is working for the one percent – in my opinion.

  8. Alan Wilkinson

     /  21st December 2015

    Too much already. A media ploy to keep a trivial storm in the teacup alive via the professionally perpetually offended.

    Reply
  9. Really?

    Key wants to connect with a voter segment who often are NOT engaged in the political debate and conversation.

    So he goes on youth/bogan/rocker stations to broaden his comms effort. Good on him for doing so and its very middle of the road political communication strategy I would have thought to reach out to elements outside your locked in died in the Blue voters.

    His prep for such events will be around the messages he wants to project and he would have been warned to be careful, but he is human and he got caught out

    Now The Edge/The Rock do puerile humour and they are always looking for something a bit edgy. Key got caught out – he doesn’t endorse it and he got stitched up.

    But the whole white ribbon attack is just more of the same bs attack from lefties who DEMAND you stay with their message or else. Don’t comply, don’t enthusiastically support and you will be attacked, vilified and publicly shamed. Lovely stuff.

    Key had no intention of being party to prison rape jokes he got hoodwinked.

    But you know what all you sheltered little flowers – its the a type of humour that is very prevalent in workshops, garages and blue collar work sites all over this country. You may not like but that’s just life in the real world outside the inner city and leftie luvvie bubbles

    Key will go on those stations again – but he will be warier. Those stations give him access to talk to voters that Labour has abandoned and voters the Greens ridicule – voters that could be pivotal to him winning a 4th straight election

    Reply
    • FarmerPete

       /  21st December 2015

      It’s also prevalent in every group in the country, but in some cases the targets are deemed more socially acceptable to ‘attack’.

      Reply
      • Yes that is the hypocrisy of the whole thing. Who you can make jokes about and who you can’t.

        This latest outburst of Get Key Now is just another sign of how divorced from mainstream normal Kiwi’s a lot of the Media and leftie opinion “shapers” are..

        Reply
    • Hahahaahahahaha a down vote on a link to Kathryn Ryans thoughts on politics f the matter…. that made my day : )

      Reply
  10. Joe Bloggs

     /  21st December 2015

    This has been an interesting debate. There have been moments when I have felt encouraged, and others when I’ve felt offended, by comments made today. That’s for me to deal with, not you lot.

    Just to make a few things clear though…my reaction isn’t Key Derangement Syndrome. It’s not chardy-sipping socialism, or life in a leftie luvvie bubble, whatever other depersonalising label some of you like to throw out there. I’m just a normal mainstream kiwi, who’s been a Key supporter for as long as he’s been in parliament, but y’know something? Right now, I feel let down by him …

    You see, I’m a survivor of domestic/sexual abuse. Been there, done that, got the tee shirt (and the scars) to prove it…and know what? I still don’t get the humour..

    Reply
  11. kittycatkin

     /  21st December 2015

    It’s obvious from John Key’s response to the request to pick the soap up that he’s not seeing it in that way, even if the others in the video are. He seems bemused and wondering why he’s being asked to do this pointless action.

    Reply
    • jamie

       /  21st December 2015

      I disagree. I think he appears extremely uncomfortable with the whole business.

      Reply
      • I thought Key looked quite uncomfortable with what happened too. Most people would have been,

        Reply
        • Nelly Smickers

           /  21st December 2015

          @PG

          Nope – not JK. He revels in this sort of carry-on.

          He excels in making the great unwashed think he is just like one of them, without a clue what’s going on.

          In reality, with a 100mill in the bank, properties all round the world, he don’t give a shit 🙂

          And good on him I say!

          Reply
          • jamie

             /  21st December 2015

            He usually revels in the horseplay but it didn’t look like he was reveling in it this time.

            He looked to me like he knew what was going on was pretty poor but for some reason he wasn’t willing or able to put an end to his part in it.

            I sort of agree with those who say he was ambushed, but he has set himself up for it too. By being so eager to play the fool on these sort of shows he has put himself in a position where it’s very difficult for him to back out.

            The hosts understand this and will keep pushing him further. I think it’s a bit of a game of ‘how low, how crude, how far can we get the PM to go.’

            The trouble is that he has made such a selling-point of being the guy who is up-for-anything that it he says no to anything now he looks like a spoilsport.

            Reply
  12. kiwi guy

     /  21st December 2015

    “I agree with White Ribbon that the radio segment trivialised what can be horrific violence.”

    All jokes “trivialise” something, that’s the whole point.

    Reply
    • @ KG – indeed, that is the whole point and the length and passion of this very discussion attests to the ‘power’ of it, no matter what your point-of-view or whether you get put down for taking part in the discussion or for still taking part in it, here we are “taking part in it”.

      Would the joke have trivialised prison rape if someone else had been the butt of the humour, another celebrity perhaps, or one of the station’s average listeners? It certainly wouldn’t have got the media attention, would it?

      So the joke can’t really be taken out of context, and, sadly, guess who was there in the thick of it? Guess who was essentially the butt of it?

      What I find amazing is the implication John Key goes on ‘Breakfast’ or Q&A or 3D or Story and just “wings it”? It’s astonishing to imagine people believe this. These things are scripted to various degrees and if the various degrees aren’t on offer “the PM is unavailable for comment”. Certainly there may be room for surprise in some of them, but when you’re the PM, you surely don’t leave your maximum “room for surprise” to a bogan radio station which arguably means nothing to you or to your support base?

      @ jamie “it he says no to anything now he looks like a spoilsport”.

      You make your bed, eh?

      Reply

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