E-cigarettes/vaping to become legal

E-cigarettes have been available in New Zealand but illegally. Authorities seem to have ignored illegal sales.

The Government has just announced that they will be made legal. Research on risks is ‘still developing’ but using them is seen as safer than smoking tobacco so is a less unhealthy alternative.

Vaping products won’t be subject to the same excise tax that makes tobacco so expensive.

They won’t be able to be used in non-smoking areas.

Nicotine e-cigarettes to become legal

Associate Health Minister Nicky Wagner today announced the sale of nicotine e-cigarettes and e-liquid will be made legal with appropriate controls.

“Scientific evidence on the safety of e-cigarettes is still developing but there’s a general consensus that vaping is much less harmful than smoking,” Ms Wagner says.

“The Government is taking a cautious approach by aligning the regulations around vaping with those for cigarettes. This ensures cigarette smokers have access to a lower-risk alternative while we continue to discourage people from smoking or vaping in the first place.”

New rules for all e-cigarettes, whether or not they contain nicotine, include:

Restricting sales to those 18 years and over Prohibiting vaping in indoor workplaces and other areas where smoking is banned under the Smoke-free Environments Act Restricting advertising to limit the attraction of e-cigarettes to non-smokers, especially children and young people.

“This is an opportunity to see if restricted access to e-cigarettes and e-liquid can help lower our smoking rates, reduce harm and save lives,” Ms Wagner says.

“The Government is strongly committed to achieving our goal of a smoke-free New Zealand by 2025.”

All vaping products will need to meet quality and safety standards. The Ministry of Health will set up a technical advisory group to help define these standards.

A regulatory regime will also be established so the Ministry can consider whether other emerging tobacco and nicotine-delivery products should be regulated as consumer products in future.

“Public consultation showed a strong appetite for change so the Government is looking to introduce an amendment to the Smoke-free Environments Act this year. The changes will likely come into force later in 2018,” Ms Wagner says.

The Ministry of Health will continue to monitor the evidence concerning e-cigarettes and other emerging tobacco and nicotine-delivery products.

Some are happy with this, like David Seymour and ACT:

Government adopts ACT’s vape policy

ACT Leader David Seymour has welcomed the Government’s decision to legalise nicotine e-liquid without excise tax.

“Nicky Wagner’s office has confirmed to mine that nicotine e-cigarettes won’t be subject to excise tax. It’s the outcome ACT has been advocating for.

“This is huge win for smokers looking for a safer alternative. It’s a loss for the public health wowsers who seek to stigmatise any personal habits they disagree with.

“Excise tax on tobacco continues to be a serious burden on the families of smokers, and disproportionately hurts poorer New Zealanders who are more likely to smoke. The Government needs to reverse its recent extreme tax hikes, but in the meantime it’s good that smokers are free to access a better option.”

But not everyone is enthusiastic.

1 News: Nicotine e-cigarettes ‘just another ploy by tobacco companies’ -Tariana Turia

Many have hailed the move, but Ms Turia said the nicotine content was still a downside.

“I think it’s just another ploy by the tobacco companies. they’ve still got nicotine in them you know to keep people that addicted,” she said.

Hone Harawira has also had a grizzle about it.

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70 Comments

  1. Kevin

     /  30th March 2017

    Good stuff. Shows the government is open to argument and may be persuaded to make other things that are currently illegal but that shouldn’t be illegal, legal, with the appropriate regulations and controls of course.

    Reply
  2. Nelly Smickers

     /  30th March 2017

    Wayne said he was thinking about getting an *E-bike*…..he wants to give up cycling XD

    Reply
  3. Zedd

     /  30th March 2017

    e-cigs have to be better than smoking tobacco.. vaping smells better too

    Reply
    • Anonymous Coward

       /  30th March 2017

      What’s in that liquid though?

      Reply
      • Griff

         /  30th March 2017

        They use two ingredients to make the base liquid.
        Propylene Glycol (PG) –
        Vegetable Glycerine (VG) –. …
        The ratio depending on the style of machine you buy.

        Flavors are unlimited.

        Any one who knows someone who smokes should get them into vaping it is so much better for your health and cheaper .

        Reply
      • Zedd

         /  30th March 2017

        whats in the liquid ?

        1080 or some other synthetic ??

        Reply
        • Anonymous Coward

           /  30th March 2017

          I thought it was high fructose corn syrup, antifreeze and the water from rain soaked ashtrays.

          Reply
        • Conspiratoor

           /  31st March 2017

          They are imported from china. Need I say more

          Reply
    • patupaiarehe

       /  30th March 2017

      What’s in that liquid indeed! I imagine it will only be a matter of time, before someone ‘fortifies’ vaping liquid with THC. The stoners will then be able to indulge in public, & no-one will be any the wiser, due to the lack of ‘that smell’. Unless they inhale a little ‘passive vapour’, that is…. 😀

      Reply
    • Conspiratoor

       /  30th March 2017

      Hey zedd, I read somewhere that a fat dak deposits four times as much tar into the lungs as baccy. Can this be true?

      Reply
      • How many ‘fat daks’ is one person likely to smoke per day? Total consumption is what is important, not what’s in a single fix.

        Reply
        • Kitty Catkin

           /  30th March 2017

          It’s true-but something in dope makes it less harmful and likely to cause lung cancer* *(not just the fact that nobody-I imagine-smokes 40 or more joints a day.)

          * too long to explain, look it up

          Reply
          • They presumably they don’t put all the additives in cannabis.

            This is remarkable, reported by 5 major tobacco companies:

            This is the list of 599 additives in cigarettes submitted to the United States Department of Health and Human Services in April 1994. It applies, as documented, only to American manufactured cigarettes intended for distribution within the United States by the listed companies.

            I won’t list them all here.

            https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_additives_in_cigarettes

            Reply
            • Kitty Catkin

               /  30th March 2017

              It seemed strange that the tar was less harmful than I would have imagined it to be. The thought of a lungful of tar is most unappealing !

              Of course, there are additives and additives….but I am still very glad that I no longer smoke.

            • Blazer

               /  30th March 2017

              @Kitty ..’you no longer ..smoke…’..did you ever….!

        • Blazer

           /  30th March 2017

          I have seen functioning potheads who start the day with a joint,go through at least a tinny’ every day. ..of the week.

          Reply
          • And they are as nothing compared to the “functional” alcoholics and problem drinkers …

            Reply
            • Blazer

               /  30th March 2017

              I was just about to sip another Steiny (a good Japanese beer)when I read this post..you must be a ..cad and a ..bounder.

            • and a dandy Blazer … don’t forget dandy …

              In reality I’m a neo-dandy … and a fop …

              I much prefer Chardonnay.

              … a wowser too.

          • Gezza

             /  30th March 2017

            And I’ve seen some who were passing round & dragging on doobies every couple of hours & were zonked out & totally unmotivated to do anything all day, every day except listen to music & drink coffee & beer. Mind you, the three of them were functionally illerate, unemployed, & unemployable anyway. Few people could be bothered getting that wasted.

            Most recreational users I imagine might have a two or three tokes on a joint & just relax & enjoy whatever they like doing when they’re mildly stoned. 3 tokes of an evening or before a jam session was all I ever wanted. More than that had no worthwhile effect. Never used it before doing a gig as I’d sometimes forget what I should be playing, & in one band the leader was a cop & his rule was, “I don’t care if you do dope, but don’t bring it into the band.”

            He knew defensive driving & would overtake me @ +130kph at 1am in the morning on the way home from gigs. 😡

            Reply
            • patupaiarehe

               /  30th March 2017

              It’s the same as anything else G, it affects different people in different ways. After a ‘smoke’, I can stay up all night thinking about how to make the world a better place, whereas my ataahua wahine would rather curl up in bed, & sleep for ten hours. Some people get silly when they’re pissed, some get sad, & some get violent.

            • I don’t think the violent part can really be said of dope smokers, can it?

            • patupaiarehe

               /  30th March 2017

              Can’t say that I’ve ever witnessed it, PZ.

            • Blazer

               /  30th March 2017

              ‘Mind you, the three of them were functionally illerate, unemployed, & unemployable anyway’..hard to get a band together these days G…ASK ..ub40.

            • Gezza

               /  30th March 2017

              “I don’t think the violent part can really be said of dope smokers, can it?”

              Kenny Boy was certainly planning some when he found who nicked his flaming 6 heading plants from the back yard. 😡

            • patupaiarehe

               /  30th March 2017

              Touche’ Blazer, though I suspect that most here won’t know what a ‘UB40’ is…

            • Gezza

               /  30th March 2017

              It’s never hard to get a band together Blazer. What’s hardest is to get a good singer, a drummer, a semi-decent bass player, a place to practice that doesn’t have neighbours bitching about the racket, & a bunch of people in it who can still stand the sight of each other after six months of egos & arguments over everything from the music they want to do, to their playing, to their farting in the tea room.

            • Blazer

               /  30th March 2017

              @G…’get a good singer, a drummer, a semi-decent bass player, ‘..this is called a trio..+ you is a ..quartet,Can’t help,can’t sing ,can’t play a musical instrument..but am generous with my applause..and appreciate ..talent.

            • Gezza

               /  30th March 2017

              My point is, guitarists are 10-a-penny, but bassists are not. Same with drummers. Playing & singing at the same time not every guitarist can do, but it’s best if they can do bv’s and/or share lead vocals if you are doing 3-4 hour gigs. A good singer, one who has a good vocal range, is also important if you’re doing covers, especially if you’re doing a variety of song types & styles. An ability to mimic accents is also handy.

              You’re my kind of audience member though, Blaze. It’s soul-destroying being up there working your butt off if you have a crowd that’s unresponsive. Applause & appreciation from the listeners usually lifts the band’s performance, & interacting with them is easier too.

            • patupaiarehe

               /  30th March 2017

              Here’s a good one, from a bunch of unemployed potheads… 😀

              https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/UB40#1978.E2.80.932008:_Formation_and_rise_to_stardom

            • Aren’t the very best bands made up of the “functionally illerate, unemplode & unemplayable”?

            • Kevin

               /  30th March 2017

              I can’t count the total number of times I’ve used cannabis on my fingers and still have a few left over. Although I find the affect better than alcohol I’ve never gotten much of a kick out of it. Not meaning to sound self-righteous but I get much better high out of a good workout.

            • Kevin

               /  30th March 2017

              *can*

            • Blazer

               /  30th March 2017

              @ G and Patu…nice !..my experience in life is musos have a wonderful appreciation of ..humanity…a personal observation..politicising it..I think the left promotes ..creativity and diversification.

            • Blazer

               /  30th March 2017

              @Kevin…[Deleted, inappropriate insinuation. PG]

            • Gezza

               /  30th March 2017

              OMG. “illerate”?? Can’t believe I actually said that. 😱

            • You didn’t Gezza … You WROTE it!

            • Gezza

               /  30th March 2017

              😡 Pendant ! 😃

            • Gezza

               /  30th March 2017

              “Aren’t the very best bands made up of the “functionally illiterate, unemplode & unemplayable”?”

              I believe that’s just The Rolling Stones. 😳 Mick Jagger only pretends to be illiterate. He can read cheques. Sloppiest live band in the world I reckon. Punk rockers put more effort in to sounding like their records than the Stones do 😀

        • Conspiratoor

           /  30th March 2017

          Risk of respiratory effects from inhaling marijuana smoke are heightened by the more intensive way in which marijuana is smoked — when smoking marijuana compared to tobacco, there is a prolonged and deeper inhalation and it is smoked to a shorter butt length and at a higher combustion temperature.
          This results in approximately 5 times the carbon monoxide concentration, 3 times the tar, and the retention of one-third more tar in the respiratory tract. Higher levels of ammonia and hydrogen cyanide have also been found in marijuana smoke, compared to tobacco (Moir, et al., 2008; Wu et al., 1988; Tashkin et al., 1991; Benson & Bentley, 1995).

          Reply
          • patupaiarehe

             /  30th March 2017

            when smoking marijuana compared to tobacco, there is a prolonged and deeper inhalation and it is smoked to a shorter butt length and at a higher combustion temperature.

            I suspect that the difference is reducing, with every increase in excise tax C…

            Reply
            • Conspiratoor

               /  30th March 2017

              I just don’t get it pat when you could buy a bottle of scotch for the same price as two packets of these things, a single malt for three. It’s a crazy crazy world

            • patupaiarehe

               /  30th March 2017

              Each to their own C, I’m not a big fan of spirits myself. I suspect you’d be complaining loudly, if the government decided to start taxing scotch, at the same rate as tobacco. If they did, your favourite single malt would cost the same as a carton…

            • Blazer

               /  30th March 2017

              you should try heroin and cocaine…..Con..you’ve lived a sheltered life!

            • I’ve never tried any hard drugs. Neither cannabis. I use a minimum of prescription drugs. I’ve only used alcohol, and these days usually avoid getting pissed. I don’t like losing control of my brain.

              I don’t think I’ve led a sheltered life. There are plenty of natural pleasures that don’t require artificial stimulation – and greatly increased risk.

            • Conspiratoor

               /  30th March 2017

              Notwithstanding smokers die earlier, the tax on tobacco reflects the drain smokers place on the health sector. No such justification exists for scotch, in fact the opposite is true. A good single malt taken in moderation is the elixir of youth. Cheers,c

            • Conspiratoor

               /  30th March 2017

              While I’m on a roll, members of my whanau work at the coal face. No-one will tell you this publicly but where surgical resources cannot cope and decisions need to be made on priorities, smokers get shunted

            • patupaiarehe

               /  30th March 2017

              Can’t say I’m surprised by that C. I think it’s a shame that they have to ‘prioritise’. They should be funded properly, so that they don’t have to.

            • @ Conspiratoor – “when you could buy a bottle of scotch for the same price as two packets of these things, a single malt for three. It’s a crazy crazy world …”

              And on this occasion C I’ve got to say the craziness stems almost entirely from government interference in adult personal freedoms …

              This isn’t always the case …
              I don’t want adults to drive without a license …

            • Conspiratoor

               /  30th March 2017

              @parti. Government interference… personal freedom. Give yourself an uppercut. You’re starting to sound like a libertarian

          • Kevin

             /  30th March 2017

            Cannabis can be eaten. Also if legalised the amount of THC can be regulated so for example users could choose a strain with a high amount of THC but smoke less of it for the same affect but less harm to the lungs.

            Reply
            • Blazer

               /  30th March 2017

              have you got a recipe for ..hash’ cakes ..with butter and..bananas…!

            • Conspiratoor

               /  30th March 2017

              I guess all of us old ‘heads’ have got a story there Kevin

  4. Gezza

     /  30th March 2017

    “Scientific evidence on the safety of e-cigarettes is still developing but there’s a general consensus that vaping is much less harmful than smoking,” Ms Wagner says.

    “The Government is taking a cautious approach by aligning the regulations around vaping with those for cigarettes. This ensures cigarette smokers have access to a lower-risk alternative while we continue to discourage people from smoking or vaping in the first place.”

    New rules for all e-cigarettes, whether or not they contain nicotine, include – Restricting sales to those 18 years and over, Prohibiting vaping in indoor workplaces and other areas where smoking is banned under the Smoke-free Environments Act, Restricting advertising to limit the attraction of e-cigarettes to non-smokers, especially children and young people.

    All vaping products will need to meet quality and safety standards. The Ministry of Health will set up a technical advisory group to help define these standards.

    A regulatory regime will also be established so the Ministry can consider whether other emerging tobacco and nicotine-delivery products should be regulated as consumer products in future.

    That’s odd. Isn’t this pretty much all the cannabis lobby are asking for too?

    Reply
  5. 68A Exemption for tobacco manufactured for personal use
    (1) Section 68 does not apply to the manufacture of tobacco in a private house or dwelling place, but only if and as long as the conditions specified in subsection (2) are met.
    (2) The conditions are as follows:
    (a) the tobacco must be manufactured by an individual (the individual) who is 18 years or older:
    (b) the individual must manufacture the tobacco in the individual’s private house or dwelling place, for the individual’s personal use and not for sale to any other person:
    (c) the leaves or plants used in the manufacture of the tobacco must have been grown—
    (i) on the land on which the individual’s private house or dwelling place is located; and
    (ii) for the individual’s personal use and not for sale or other disposition to any other person:
    (d) the amount of manufactured tobacco that is manufactured in the individual’s private house or dwelling place, in any year ending with 30 June, must not exceed 15 kilograms.

    Section 68A: inserted, on 1 October 2008, by section 8 of the Customs and Excise Amendment Act (No 3) 2008 (2008 No 68).

    http://www.legislation.govt.nz/act/public/1996/0027/latest/whole.html

    Reply
    • Something like that could work for cannabis too … as part of the domestic grow-your-own policy …

      But then … Who would be the ‘baddies’ …?

      Reply
      • Gezza

         /  30th March 2017

        The ratbags who come round at night & pull your plants up & disappear with them just before you harvest.

        Reply
        • Yeah … but that’s a risk with anything … washing on the line …

          If they can purchase dope legitimately from the local corner dairy, at a reasonable price, [whoops*] there’s probably little motivation to steal someone else’s private plot … since that involves all the drying and processing …

          [Whoops*] Conundrum for Righties and National and possibly any other government … How do you justify people being able to buy cannabis for less than, and possibly a lot less than tobacco …?

          Mind you … You can drink yourself to oblivion nowadays for less than the price of 50oz’s of baccy …

          Oh … the myriad impediments to just law-making …

          Reply
          • patupaiarehe

             /  30th March 2017

            You raise an interesting point, PZ. For the price of 50g of tobacco, one can buy more than enough alcohol, to poison themself to death, in a couple of hours. One could smoke 50g of tobacco in an evening too, and most likely wake up feeling a little hoarse…

            Reply
            • Gezza

               /  30th March 2017

              No I don’t think you could do 50g of tobacco in a night patu. Nicotine’s poisonous in high quantities, I think, & at the very least you’d have a massive headache.

            • patupaiarehe

               /  30th March 2017

              Make it 30g then. I suspect you get the point I’m making, and are just being argumentative for fun. Funnily enough, a few decades back, my 7 flatmates & I (as well as several ‘hangers on’) could get through around 28g of the other stuff, on a Saturday night…..

            • Anonymous Coward

               /  31st March 2017

              On a LARGE night of nearly constant chainsmoking, you could easily get through a packet of 20, but unless you rolled them really fat there aren’t enough hours in a night for one person to smoke a whole pouch.
              Though 7 flatmates and hangers on who had smoked an ounce would get through a 50g no worries.

            • Griff

               /  31st March 2017

              Lethal dose for alcohol is around 14 standard drinks in a hour.
              Lethal dose for cannabis is unknown .
              It is not possible to physically smoke or eat enough to kill your self.

              Back in the day I smoked way more than 20 in a night on the piss.
              When Tobacco was cheap there were many with 60 plus smokes a day habits . They used to put saltpeter (Potassium nitrate) into the ciggys to make them burn quicker so they could sell more.

        • Blazer

           /  30th March 2017

          BOL…X 10!;)

          Reply

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