Open Forum – Thursday

8 June 2017

Facebook: NZ politics/media+

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30 Comments

  1. lurcher1948

     /  June 8, 2017

    Mike Hosking talks FAR to fast,and you cannot argue with that

    • Gezza

       /  June 8, 2017

      Could be worse. Imagine Katie Bradford @ his speed.

      • Gezza

         /  June 8, 2017

        Or (shudder, shudder) Andrea Vance ?

  2. Trumpenreich

     /  June 8, 2017

    Was laughing at this and all I could think of was Labour destroyed by Identitiy Politics:

  3. Zedd

     /  June 8, 2017

    I listened to the debate last evening; Members day in the house.. the Natz MPs once again proved that they are not there to represent ‘we the people, BUT them the ‘smug self-interested B@stards’. Labour MP, Meka Whaitiri introduced her members bill, to allow unregistered voters a ‘special vote’ on election day. This was response to the ‘missing million’ in 2014 & the 27k disallowed ‘special votes’. They also mentioned that a recent review of the electoral act has seen a similar recommendation (also ignored by the Natz). It was pointed out that many of these people are; homeless, transients &/or new voters, who had not registered on time.
    The Natz MPs, instead of agreeing that these people should have their democratic right to cast a special vote.. stated that IF they are not on the role, then they do not deserve the right to vote on election day (paraphrased). “B-S” sez I, that’s called ‘disenfranchisement’
    It was pointed out by several opposition MPs that these people, were not likely to vote National & was this the REAL reason they were opposing the bill ?!

    The bill was defeated by 1 vote !

    All I can say ‘So much for DEMOCRACY in NZ!!”

    • Gezza

       /  June 8, 2017

      Roll. The missing million should just get their arses into gear & register.

      • Gezza

         /  June 8, 2017

        You would prefer the of democracy in Iraq, or Iran? even in those countries the right to vote is so precious, people register in time, I bet.

        • Zedd

           /  June 8, 2017

          no gezza.. i prefer REAL NZ democracy, as opposed to the Natz version, which seems to reflect a similar thing in USA.. looking for excuses to get rid of the voters who likely would vote for other parties ! 😦

          now whose spreading misinfo. ?

          • Gezza

             /  June 8, 2017

            OMG. Have they removed your right to register & vote in time?
            Now who’s spreading misinfo?

            When does registration close?

            • Zedd

               /  June 8, 2017

              dont be silly… its a fact of life, that some people miss deadlines. In this case provision should be made to allow kiwis to vote in the election regardless. Its just making excuses to reduce the potential voter numbers for what are likely, not National voters 😦

              ZEIG HILE !

            • Gezza

               /  June 8, 2017

              SEIG HEIL?
              You think this is Nazi Germany? Now you’re you’re not just being silly you’re being downright feckin stupid, mate!

          • Trumpenreich

             /  June 8, 2017

            No one is being got rid of. Your target group is just not motivated enough.

      • Gezza

         /  June 8, 2017

        http://www.elections.org.nz/voters/get-ready-enrol-and-vote/enrol-and-vote-first-time

        Looks to me like you can enrol any time up until just before election day. This isn’t some tinpot African tribal dictatorship where armed bent police or soldiers & ruling party thugs hang around voting booths & beat up people wearing opposition colours, or some retarded US Southern state where they fiddle with the voting via driver’s registration or other ID laws to exclude blacks from being eligible to vote. Get off their butts. If they’re not bothered enough to take an interest in politics & governance until they’ve had a few afternoon beers on election day & suddenly decide they want to now – tuff titty.

        • Blazer

           /  June 8, 2017

          No this is a democratic country where politicians have ethics.Just because ex Nat leader Jon Key had a dedicated black ops team headed by Jason Ede to smear the opposition, aided and abetted by compliant media and the likes of WO and co..doesn’t mean they would dream of doing anything to stymie voting that they think would not favour… them.

    • Trumpenreich

       /  June 8, 2017

      I’m surprised the bill vote was down to such a thin margin.

      “It was pointed out by several opposition MPs that these people, were not likely to vote National & was this the REAL reason they were opposing the bill ?!”

      This is the REAL reason you are in favour of it, you expect anyone to seriously believe you would be making noises about this if they were mostly potential National voters?

      There is nothing stopping anyone from enrolling to vote. Despite a big effort by vested interests ie Leftist organisations, they simply can’t get the politically disengaged to engage.

      Lead a horse to water and all that…

  4. MaureenW

     /  June 8, 2017

    Who would have guessed Bill English was a prophet – he knew in 2010 there was going to be a major housing crisis in Auckland … And the government did nothing about this because why?
    http://www.stuff.co.nz/national/politics/93450365/pm-talked-of-major-housing-crisis–salvation-army

    • High Flying Duck

       /  June 8, 2017

      I think the bit people miss is that there is actually very little they CAN do.
      This is a problem all over the world in desirable cities. Capital gains taxes, stamp duties and restrictions on foreign buyers do not seem to have dampened demand. Even Vancouver, Canada’a most expensive city, where they put massive restrictions on foreign buyers only had a pause and is now up 5% in the last 3 months.
      So while it is a great hobby horse for opposition MP’s to jump on, I have yet to hear of a place where house prices have successfully been reigned in by Government action.
      It remains true that places with large greenfield areas and low planning restrictions are comparatively cheap.
      Places with compact city regulations and places on restricted land areas – like Wellington and Auckland will always be expensive.

      • MaureenW

         /  June 8, 2017

        Between government and the reserve bank, they certainly have means to control housing
        http://m.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=11863826

      • Blazer

         /  June 8, 2017

        Vancouver residential property has been a preferred option for the Chinese since the early 1990’s.The 15% tax on foreign buyers stalled activity, until proxy alternatives were developed.A nation of 1.4 billion people that now has virtually millions of millionaires looking to park/launder money in the safest asset class ,means business as usual.Govts need to ‘get some guts’…but those political donations from chinese businessmen are …hard to..resist.Plenty of solutions..but the only people affected/locked out of the property market are not an important enough voting bloc to change things.QE everywhere,what to do with all this printed’..wealth.Buy countries from underneath the sleepy ,expedient politicians….and make people …tenants in their own…country.Give the locals a job…carrying your bags….thanks..Sir Honky Tonks.

  5. Gezza

     /  June 8, 2017

    Maureen, are you still around? Sorry to be so late, have been grief counselling a recently widowed family member – or trying to as best I can.

    I wanted to ask you for more information on your comments last night:

    “I would like to see NZ stay uniquely NZ.”

    How? What do you think are the unhealthy changes happening?

    “I would like to see housing return to being a form of shelter instead of a reality game of “property casino”.”

    Me too.

    “I would like a government that doesn’t bullshit about immigration”

    Me too. It’s outrageous that Immigration statistics are based on arrival & departure cards. Visa data & no doubt other useful metadata are all held in a database or linked group of them. It’s imposdible believe that more rich, accurate information is unobtainable. If it is, it should be a priority to make it available via a suite of routine queries & routine reports, with system generated graphs/charts.

    “and serves the people who voted for it, instead of the self-serving bunch of arse-holes they are.”

    Well, yes. Me too. But what current parties do you think would not be, or not morph quickly if in government, into self-serving arseholes?

    “I would like education to be meaningful and useful instead of the monetised bullshit courses that are forced upon people trying to gain academic qualifications in their chosen field.”

    What should go, what should remain, in your view?
    
”I would like to see Local Government serve their ratepayers with services they require instead of treating them like a bottomless- pocketed cash-cows for their fucked social engineering projects.”

    Um, me too, kinda. What fucked social engineering projects are you shooting at exactly?

    “I would like to see Local Government held accountable for where and how they spend your money.”

    Yup. Fkn oath.
    
”I would like to see a regeneration of the provinces and smaller cities by moving jobs there (do we all need to be squashed into Auckland).”

    Yup. Definitely. Who’s most likely to do this in the availsble choice of parties, do you think?
    
”Efficient public transport systems that are suited to a city’s particular landscape (instead of forcing people out of cars via hiked parking fees or no parking, forthcoming tolls and city traffic bans) onto a laughably, inefficient PT system.”

    Welly’s public transport I think is pretty good. Who’s in your sights here?

    “The employment landscape is rapidly changing due to demand and opportunities available with technology. When many workers can work remotely from any location, why is is that the vast amount of NZ provinces and smaller cities are virtually barren wastelands of “retiring and dying centres” or home to to unemployed, unemployable and disenfranchised?”

    Is there actually enough work in IT fields to soak up both the IT smart, the unemployables and the unemployed?
    
”NZ’s future to me, looks pretty hopeless in terms of what we are doing now to prepare for the social and employment changes that are just ahead. I have a lot of sympathy and empathy for today’s 20-year-olds- ask some what they think their future will look like in 10 or 20 years time.”

    I have. Beyond gaming & holograms, and being able to work from their mobiles anywhere in the world, or in law or commerce maybe, they didn’t know. One thing I learned was that how things were going to be in 25-30 years time is not what happened.

    What party or party make-up would you like to see NZ have that would be most likely to achieve what you would like to see above, Maureen?

    • MaureenW

       /  June 8, 2017

      These are good questions which I’ll respond to tomorrow.
      Have to admit I’m saving a bit of myself for the Comey Super Bowl.

      • Gezza

         /  June 8, 2017

        Thank you. I had excellent material to work with.

        Re: God yes. 😬 😀

        • Gezza

           /  June 8, 2017

          PS: Sorry the formatting is not great. I formated it with correct spacing in the iPad Notes App, but some has scrunched up after pasting into WordPress. Should’ve checked & re-inserted missing line spaces before posting.

    • MaureenW

       /  June 9, 2017

      Don’t know how this will format, but I’ve had a stab at answering your very good questions:-
      “I would like to see NZ stay uniquely NZ.”

      How? What do you think are the unhealthy changes happening?
      “The Gold Coast was probably nice once upon a time, it got converted into a tourism mecca; an ugly clanging, banging, buy it here, buy it now shithole. I liked NZ more when you could go to more places and do more things without the need for licenses and cash registers. It had more of a “just do it” feel, rather than book it, get in line and pay ya money. We’re all just customers now.

      ..Well, yes. Me too. But what current parties do you think would not be, or not morph quickly if in government, into self-serving arseholes?
      “I can’t think of any”

      “I would like education to be meaningful and useful instead of the monetised bullshit courses that are forced upon people trying to gain academic qualifications in their chosen field.”
      What should go, what should remain, in your view?
      “My dissatisfaction is more around the debt for education factor. Once people could go to university and work a part time job to support themselves – I don’t believe that is viable anymore due to the cost of accommodation. Accordingly these kids are incurring massive debts, to happy banks obtaining qualifications many are un able to get jobs with at the end. Just left with massive debts”
      
”I would like to see Local Government serve their ratepayers with services they require instead of treating them like a bottomless- pocketed cash-cows for their fucked social engineering projects.”

      Um, me too, kinda. What fucked social engineering projects are you shooting at exactly?

      “In summary, drippy ideas that are dreamed up for “the little people”.
      Forcing up car-parking fees and minimising street parking in order to force people on to public transport in order to turn around that announce that the transport service is successful because more people are using it, when in fact it’s a shitty system that people are being forced on to.
      Trying to pretend that people would be happier on bicycles, by creating un-used bike lanes on over-burdened roads.
      Zero Waste Strategies and trying to micro-manage people into recycling.
      
”I would like to see a regeneration of the provinces and smaller cities by moving jobs there (do we all need to be squashed into Auckland).”
      Yup. Definitely. Who’s most likely to do this in the availsble choice of parties, do you think?

      “The Government would make attractive deals for businesses to relocate to other centres where the physical location of the business is not a limitation to their product/service delivery. When an “old” industry fails / shuts down, it’s replaced with a new industry. While the people who do the jobs may change, the money still goes around these centres instead of them being left as wastelands”
      
”Efficient public transport systems that are suited to a city’s particular landscape (instead of forcing people out of cars via hiked parking fees or no parking, forthcoming tolls and city traffic bans) onto a laughably, inefficient PT system.”
      Welly’s public transport I think is pretty good. Who’s in your sights here?
      Agree Wellington is pretty good. Auckland is in my sights here see my comments under social engineering.

      “The employment landscape is rapidly changing due to demand and opportunities available with technology. When many workers can work remotely from any location, why is is that the vast amount of NZ provinces and smaller cities are virtually barren wastelands of “retiring and dying centres” or home to to unemployed, unemployable and disenfranchised?”
      Is there actually enough work in IT fields to soak up both the IT smart, the unemployables and the unemployed?

      “The jobs don’t have to be in the IT sector, more and more business is conducted through Online Services, people don’t need to physically visit the offices of companies they deal with”
      
”NZ’s future to me, looks pretty hopeless in terms of what we are doing now to prepare for the social and employment changes that are just ahead. I have a lot of sympathy and empathy for today’s 20-year-olds- ask some what they think their future will look like in 10 or 20 years time.”
      I have. Beyond gaming & holograms, and being able to work from their mobiles anywhere in the world, or in law or commerce maybe, they didn’t know. One thing I learned was that how things were going to be in 25-30 years time is not what happened.
      What party or party make-up would you like to see NZ have that would be most likely to achieve what you would like to see above, Maureen?
      “I don’t know, but a Government that caters for the demographics of the nation it serves”

      Lastly, and it wasn’t in my previous comments New Zealand should have a properly self-funded Superannuation Scheme – along the lines of Australia.

      • Gezza

         /  June 9, 2017

        Thanks Maureen. Gonna look this over in detail.

      • patupaiarehe

         /  June 9, 2017

        Touche, Maureen. Well said.

  6. Gezza

     /  June 8, 2017

    From my nephew. Science teacher in Msryland USA. I did a double take at first. The guy even looks quite a bit like denephew.