Open Forum – Monday

12 June 2017

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76 Comments

  1. Gezza

     /  June 12, 2017

    Can’t help noticing that nobody was game enough to answer my question of yesterday:

    If National are evil, are they as evil as c?

    Interetested in your thoughts.

    In my opinion, no – not even close
    (except maybe for Muzza, but I think he might be more a case of just hopelessly lost at the Tailor’s)

    Anybody else?

    c – your thoughts?

    Reply
    • Gezza

       /  June 12, 2017

      (Mushrooms for breakfast)

      Reply
    • Gezza

       /  June 12, 2017

      Alternatively, if unwilling to put name to comment:

      👍 upvotes = less evil

      👎 downvotes = more evil.

      Reply
    • Conspiratoor

       /  June 12, 2017

      I’m a neville nobody G. And Ive got other sandpits. Pick on one of the heavyweights …brown, blazer, sir Al et al, you’re spoilt for choice…

      Reply
      • Gezza

         /  June 12, 2017

        Pussies.

        Reply
        • Gezza

           /  June 12, 2017

          Think about it.

          Reply
          • Conspiratoor

             /  June 12, 2017

            I’ve given it due consideration G and concluded it is about as moronic as the surveys I get from my friends James and Meturia in my capacity as a fully paid up member. Your first question is phrased in such a way as there can be only one of two correct answers – oui or non. You are either ‘as evil as’ or not. There are no degrees of evil implicit in the question. However you then morph seamlessly into a comparative operator – ‘less than’ or ‘more than’.
            I’m not sure what time happy hour begins for you my dear old thing but can I suggest you replace your morning tipple with a glass of God’s champagne.
            I have you there my friend. Game set and match to neville

            Reply
            • Gezza

               /  June 12, 2017

              It did get a bit messy in the end, my good fellow – but these things always do once the bureaucrats get involved in trying to help. You should note, however, that the government has concluded it is not as bad as you suggest. I am sending my man over to collect your Harley. Just leave it outside the gate.
              Sir John

            • Conspiratoor

               /  June 12, 2017

              and as the wild nymph of water rises, so does the god …in man

            • Gezza

               /  June 12, 2017

              Good God man Sir John & I are both scratching our heads over that one.

        • Alan Wilkinson

           /  June 12, 2017
          Reply
          • Gezza

             /  June 12, 2017

            Indeed, Sir Alan

            Never annoy a pussy.

            Have sold your Bentley to the gardener for £10. Posting you the cheque by first post. The man has 9 children & another one on the way. I pay him a pittance. Suggest you don’t delay presenting the cheque.

            Darstardly yours, as always
            Sir Gerald.

            Reply
            • Alan Wilkinson

               /  June 12, 2017

              Go easy on those mushrooms, G. Where did you say you picked them?

            • Gezza

               /  June 12, 2017

              New World. But out the back of the Loading Bay. Bloke did look a bit shady, now I come to think of it.

            • Gezza

               /  June 12, 2017

              We had a car like that. 6d.

              Bit of a grump, she was. Would never have a go at me, but every now & then she’d have a go @ D.

              D wasn’t having any of that ! 6d always came off worse. D knew how to wield a tea towel. 👍

            • Gezza

               /  June 12, 2017

              Sht. * car = cat.

            • Kitty Catkin

               /  June 12, 2017

              Did you find the old, old joke about the Rolls-Canardly car hilarious when you were a child ?

            • Gezza

               /  June 12, 2017

              Don’t know it Kitty.

              Haven’t got much of a sense of humour anyway, so nobody ever tells me jokes. Except Blazer.

              What time do you call this, young lady? And where have you been the last couple of days? 😡 You know I worry about you !

            • Gezza

               /  June 12, 2017

              No reply. 💔 Straight into her room & slammed the door ! 😕
              I just do not understand the young ladies of today ! 😳
              Or yesterday. 😕

  2. Gezza

     /  June 12, 2017

    Off to dad’s Rest Home. Quarterly Residents & Famlies Meeting.
    Will stand quietly & in the back & say nothing.
    Not like last time.
    TTFN
    10.28 am

    Reply
    • Gezza

       /  June 12, 2017

      Utterly failed at standing quietly in the back & saying nothing. 😕

      Reply
      • patupaiarehe

         /  June 12, 2017

        I’d expect nothing less from you G 😉 I found another one from ‘Cake’, that you might enjoy…

        Reply
        • Gezza

           /  June 12, 2017

          Might listen to that shortly patu.
          If I listen to yours late at night sometimes I then can’t sleep 😳
          😀

          Reply
          • patupaiarehe

             /  June 12, 2017

            While you’re at it G…

            Lyrics:
            Oh yeah, what we’re living in (let me tell ya)
            It’s a wonder man can eat at all
            When things are big that should be small
            Who can tell what magic spells we’ll be doing for us
            And I’m giving all my love to this world
            Only to be told
            I can’t see
            I can’t breathe
            No more will we be
            And nothing’s going to change the way we live
            Cos’ we can always take but never give
            And now that things are changing for the worse,
            See, its a crazy world we’re living in
            And I just can’t see that half of us immersed in sin
            Is all we have to give these –

            Futures made of virtual insanity now
            Always seem to, be govern’d by this love we have
            For useless, twisting, our new technology
            Oh, now there is no sound – for we all live underground

            And I’m thinking what a mess we’re in
            Hard to know where to begin
            If I could slip the sickly ties that earthly man has made
            And now every mother, can choose the colour
            Of her child
            That’s not nature’s way
            Well that’s what they said yesterday
            There’s nothing left to do but pray
            I think it’s time I found a new religion
            Waoh – it’s so insane
            To synthesize another strain
            There’s something in these
            Futures that we have to be told.

            Futures made of virtual insanity – now
            Always seem to, be govern’d by this love we have
            For useless, twisting, our new technology
            Oh, now there is no sound – for we all live underground

            Now there is no sound
            If we all live underground
            And now it’s virtual insanity
            Forget your virtual reality
            Oh, there’s nothing so bad.
            I know yeah

            Of this virtual insanity, we’re livin in.
            Has got to change, yeah
            Things, will never be the same.
            And I can’t go on
            While we’re livin’ in oh, oh virtual insanity
            Oh, this world, has got to change
            Cos I just, I just can’t keep going on, it was virtual.
            Virtual insanity that we’re livin’ in, that we’re livin’ in
            That virtual insanity is what it is

            Futures made of virtual insanity – now
            Always seem to, be govern’d by this love we have
            For useless, twisting, our new technology
            Oh, now there is no sound – for we all live underground

            Living – Virtual Insanity
            Living – Virtual Insanity
            Living – Virtual Insanity
            Living – Virtual Insanity

            Virtual Insanity is what we’re living in

            Reply
          • Gezza

             /  June 12, 2017

            I like it, I understand it, but it’s a bit nihilistic, & I’d like something more positive & uplifting before I go to sleep. Without hope, optimism, & determination to make things right or better, what’s the point of living?

            Reply
            • Conspiratoor

               /  June 12, 2017

              Here you go G. Be uplifted. The missus will be scraping you off the ceiling. Cheers,c

  3. Gezza

     /  June 12, 2017

    Trying to make up my mind on best policy, assuming no changes to current income tax levels, funding removed from unnecessary spending (major sports or other events, canterbury cathedral etc.

    TETIARY EDUCATION FEES

    1. Free, all degrees & technical quals.
    2. Part-subsidised (half) all degrees & technical quals.
    3. Part-subsidised (half) specific high skill/high need degrees & technical quals
    4. User pays all degrees & technical quals
    5. Free but bonded for selected courses ( eg nursing, teaching)
    6. Part-subsidised but bonded for selected courses (eg nursing, teaching)

    Anybody got any views? Any preferred option or combo.

    Reply
    • Alan Wilkinson

       /  June 12, 2017

      Scholarships to pay fees. Bonded options too, preferably sponsored by businesses.

      Reply
      • Gezza

         /  June 12, 2017

        Govt or businesses funding the scholarships?

        Reply
        • Gezza

           /  June 12, 2017

          * sorry Al, just clicked – sponsored = funded. 👍

          Reply
          • Kitty Catkin

             /  June 12, 2017

            Free = paid for by taxpayers, of course, i.e. everyone else.

            I wish that I could feel guiltier that when my generation who sailed through university at taxpayers’ expense, even being given the equivalent of the dole to live on and paying 10% of our fees (those were the days-sighhhhhh) were older and running the country we pulled that particular ladder well out of reach of the generation after us. ‘Tough titty, suckers,’ We didn’t cry. .

            Reply
            • Kitty Catkin

               /  June 12, 2017

              Of course. (slides eyes sideways)

    • Blazer

       /  June 12, 2017

      you and Al are talking common sense here.Why can’t…politicians.

      Reply
      • Gezza

         /  June 12, 2017

        Thanks, Blazer. Education’s an investment in all our futures but especially the mokos’. I despair at the politicians. But there’ll be wastage if everything’s free from taxpayers with no payback expected, imo. Open to discussion. Do you have a preferred option from above, or a another one?

        Reply
        • Blazer

           /  June 12, 2017

          your points 5 and 6 are the best imo. depending on the degree.Seems far too many are trying for degrees/diplomas that they either can’t complete to compete or are not a pathway to employment.Just one example I know of….a course for T.V cameramen….big student loans…course completed…no jobs.

          Reply
      • PDB

         /  June 12, 2017

        Yep – 4 and 5.

        Reply
    • Conspiratoor

       /  June 12, 2017

      Engineering, megatronics and medicine free with entry to second year based solely on merit. And no foreign students. Bonded for 10 years after graduation.
      Useless degrees, such as arts and social sciences, for institutionalised bludgers. Zero subsidy.
      Partial subsidies for historians, phycisists and mathematicians.

      Reply
      • Gezza

         /  June 12, 2017

        Total Foreign Student immediate exodus could crash the Tertiary system financially. And there are other benefits in Tourism, Commerce & Foreign Relations etc.

        Reply
        • Blazer

           /  June 12, 2017

          says National glove..puppets…b/s.

          Reply
          • Gezza

             /  June 12, 2017

            I think it’s being overdone – but it’s recognised internationally there are these benefits, so there may be worth in restricting entry to certain fields, and prohibiting their going straight into residence programme on completion. Must go home first. It’s also just a point to consider on implementation of changes re how much taxpayer funding needs to be diverted into picking up the financial hole. Objective is no income tax increases.

            Reply
            • patupaiarehe

               /  June 12, 2017

              Perhaps there should be a stipulation that foreign students must enter employment that is relevant to their studies, to retain their work visa.

      • Gezza

         /  June 12, 2017

        (historians? 😳 my arse 😀😀😀 )

        Reply
      • Alan Wilkinson

         /  June 12, 2017

        Scholarships awarded at the highest level for excellence should not discriminate by subject. Genius can contribute to humanity in many ways and should be free to do so as it chooses without constraints from other people’s preconceptions.

        Reply
        • Gezza

           /  June 12, 2017

          Indeed. Look at the good I do.

          Reply
        • Conspiratoor

           /  June 12, 2017

          How do you determine Genius Al, when every second arts major is a self confessed genius. I’ve got a better idea. Demonstrate a contribution to humanity and we might refund the taxpayer’s contribution to your education

          Reply
          • Alan Wilkinson

             /  June 12, 2017

            Very high marks in academic exams is the usual route to Scholarship. Every second arts major doesn’t qualify. I’m talking about the top dozen or so students in the country.

            But your proposed qualification route is worthy of support too. Trouble is it doesn’t provide the help when it is needed. Maybe it could be done in a pass it on way – ie those qualifying are not given the money, but are given the right to choose a student or students to support with it.

            Reply
        • Gezza

           /  June 12, 2017

          How do we encourage more business / wealthy philanderer-philanthropic scholarships?

          Reply
          • Conspiratoor

             /  June 12, 2017

            Promise them a gong G. Works every time

            Reply
            • Gezza

               /  June 12, 2017

              Heaven forbid. Last thing Sir Alan & I need are too many coarse fellows with no breeding at all to be joining the ranks !

    • patupaiarehe

       /  June 12, 2017

      I’d go with 5 G, but everything should be ‘bonded’. There is no such thing as a ‘free lunch’. In return for ‘free’ education, graduates should have to work in the field they are trained, for a minimum of 3 years.
      The key to making training relevant, & work though G, is appreciating that different individuals learn in different ways. And appreciating that most people enjoy doing an honest days work, and being rewarded for their efforts.
      I’ll do my best, to give an ‘engineering perspective’ on it, since that is my field of expertise. So here are the ‘job options’, in an engineering workshop, and what is required…
      Labourer/TA (Trade Assistant)- Do what you are told, without injuring yourself, or others. Pay rate $18-$20/hr
      Welder- Weld steel structures together. Pull a trigger all day. Pay rate $22-$29/hour, depending on qualifications.
      Fabricator- Interpret drawings, & ‘tack’ steel structures together, for others to weld. Pay rate $26-$33/hour.
      The point I am trying to make, is that one doesn’t have to be an ‘intellectual giant’, to earn a pretty good honest living in NZ. But the company I work for, struggles to find anyone, who can do any of the above.

      Reply
      • patupaiarehe

         /  June 12, 2017

        So here is the really funny (or not) thing. The (very capable & talented) Indian fabricator who I work with, had to get his work visa renewed, a few months back, so we had to advertise his job. Three SA’s, who were still living there applied, and two Indian guys who were in Singapore. And one Kiwi, who didn’t bother showing up for his job interview. Needless to say, my Indian friend was most delighted, as were we. Good people are hard to find….

        Reply
        • Gezza

           /  June 12, 2017

          How long’s the work visa valid for before it has to be renewed again?
          Can he get residence, out of interest?

          Yes, the days of common courtesy seem to be long gone. The kiwi no-show, at least he/she could’ve rung, texted or emailed & said, “Look sorry – got a job in Finance or staying in bed today because I feel unappreciated” or whatever. What age?

          Reply
        • patupaiarehe

           /  June 12, 2017

          The real challenge lies in retaining ‘good people’. Foreigners, especially Indians, don’t quite grasp the ‘kiwi sense of humour’, which often isn’t really that funny.
          Kiwi tradesmen, in my industry anyway, are all too well aware that their skills are in short supply. I had to ‘haul’ one of them in to the office today, and in the nicest way possible, try to suggest that he should ‘pull his banter back a notch’, in order not to upset others. And here was his response…
          Him “Is this about that whinging indian cunt?!”
          Me “Is it? I just said we needed to have a chat.”
          Him “I’ve got nothing to say!”
          Me “About what?”
          Him “You know what!”
          Me “Do I? You seem to…”
          Him “Maybe I should just pack up my tools & go
          Me “Maybe you should just realise that a joke is only funny, if both people appreciate it.
          Him “He should just stop being a sooky cunt, and get a fucking clue about how this country works!
          Me “Sooky cunt, huh? I don’t see him threatening to pack up his tools & leave…”
          After a day like today, I’m rather tempted to apply to the NZQA, for a ‘cross credit’ on an ECE degree…

          Reply
          • Gezza

             /  June 12, 2017

            What are his jokes about?

            Reply
            • patupaiarehe

               /  June 12, 2017

              About how the airport at Mt Maunganui does pilot training, just pretend you aren’t a terrorist. And about how the indian guy is so slow (he isn’t) that he should ask for an apprenticeship, so he will get paid what he is worth. I’ve attempted to coach my indian friend, on how to give it back, but he won’t. It’s a cultural thing.

            • Gezza

               /  June 12, 2017

              So are his jokes. But good that you gave him a finger waggle.
              Those sorts of jokes might be funny in the right setting but the last one sure isn’t if they aren’t close male friends. Sounds like a blowhard.

            • patupaiarehe

               /  June 12, 2017

              They aren’t funny. I’ve warned them both verbally. One of them has been warned twice. No prizes for guessing who I’ll be backing, when they are both in front of the director of the company. Which will probably be tomorrow. God, give me strength…

            • Gezza

               /  June 12, 2017

              Weirdest thing. I suddenly start getting downticks around the place & then Brown posts. Happens a lot since I first accidentally noticed a while ago. Probably just coincidences though.

              This blowhard – reckon I’ve met his type before. How does he get on with the other staff?

            • patupaiarehe

               /  June 12, 2017

              Pretty well, albeit reluctantly. Really talented & capable, but a complete pisshead. The others respect his talent, but give him shit for being a drunkard. He accepts both, because he deserves both

            • Gezza

               /  June 12, 2017

              Oh well, at least he has got a sense of humour I suppose, unlike some miserable pricks you sometimes encounter.

              How do the others feel about Ranjit & “Rocky”, & Rocky rarking up the little guy?

            • patupaiarehe

               /  June 13, 2017

              They thought it was hilarious, until I pointed out to them, how it might feel to be on the ‘arse end’, of that sort of ‘humour’. The directors & I have discussed the ‘Rocky’ situation, and have been told that ‘Rocky’ needs to be disabused of the notion that he will get a phone call from them, begging him to come back, after I call his bluff on leaving. He is their problem now, I’d love to be ‘a fly on the wall’ of that office tomorrow… 😀

            • Gezza

               /  June 13, 2017

              Ya a good bastard, mate, give us an update.
              Hittin the sack. Ka kite ano, patu, e hoa

            • patupaiarehe

               /  June 13, 2017

              Nighty night G. Should catch a few zzz’s myself. I’ll most likely be dragged into an argument tomorrow, that I really can’t be bothered with. Life was so much easier, when I just had to make stuff… 😉

  4. Blazer

     /  June 12, 2017

    sound economic management!?Prof Steve Keen…’ if your debt grows at 10%, and this enables your economy to grow at 5%, anything less than a more rapid rate of credit growth in the future will cause your economy to contract.

    Said another way, as long as you can grow your debts at a faster pace than your income — forever — you’ll never have to experience another economic downturn.

    That statement right there, lays bare the entire ridiculousness of everything the central banks have, and are currently trying to engineer.

    Eventually, reality always catches up

    Reply
    • Kitty Catkin

       /  June 12, 2017

      You borrow money at 5% interest and invest it at 10% interest,

      That is probably the sort of thing he means.

      Reply
      • Blazer

         /  June 12, 2017

        no he does not mean that at…all.Growth relies on…accelerating..debt levels.

        Reply
  5. Kitty Catkin

     /  June 12, 2017

    If Gareth Morgan thinks that people won’t see that his join us and we’ll donate to a cause that nobody would say wasn’t a good one is a form of that good old tradition of vote buying, he’s very naive.

    Reply
  6. Blazer

     /  June 12, 2017

    but ,but Key said NZ is not a..tax haven….’https://www.greens.org.nz/news/press-release/foreign-trust-numbers-reveal-scale-problem-national-wanted-keep-secret

    Reply

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