Media watch – Wednesday

3 January 2018

MediaWatch

Media Watch is a focus on New Zealand media, blogs and social media. You can post any items of interested related to media.

A primary aim here is to hold media to account in the political arena. A credible and questioning media is an essential part of a healthy democracy.

A general guideline – post opinion on or excerpts from and links to blog posts or comments of interest, whether they are praise, criticism, pointing out issues or sharing useful information.

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47 Comments

    • PartisanZ

       /  January 3, 2018

      “Supply growth is emerging as the biggest risk for global dairy markets,” with the entire dairy complex witnessing weakness, he said.

      Hang on a minute! Growth = Risk? Growth = Weakness?

      Isn’t “growth” what its all about?

      • Corky

         /  January 3, 2018

        Movement is life..stagnation is death. Socialism is dead.

        • PartisanZ

           /  January 3, 2018

          Well, except we’re reaching the point, or have possibly passed it, whereby ever increasing growth, with its associated resource depletion, environmental damage, pollution and habitat destruction – not to mention war and threat of more war – means death … and sustainability (which I think you call “stagnation”) means life … for future generations …

  1. sorethumb

     /  January 3, 2018

    Fake News has little impact. Those who are exposed to it also read widely

    • Blazer

       /  January 3, 2018

      wouldn’t put any value on those conclusions.The MSM,is trying to protect any credibility,they may have…left.

  2. PartisanZ

     /  January 3, 2018

    Now we’re talking …

    Jarrod Gilbert: Rich should pay bigger speeding fines – Herald

    http://www.nzherald.co.nz/opinion/news/article.cfm?c_id=466&objectid=11968593

    • Alan Wilkinson

       /  January 3, 2018

      Was just reading this and thinking what a Lefty fuckwit. An article based on the fact that traffic fines damage a lot of poor people by sending them into the criminal justice system when they can’t pay somehow manages to conclude that the solution is to fine rich people huge amounts thereby encouraging them to emigrate. Brilliant. Turning one problem into two problems.

      • Blazer

         /  January 3, 2018

        encouraging them to ..emigrate….what does it…take!

    • Corky

       /  January 3, 2018

      And compulsory life course skills training for the poor. Lets not discriminate against them This prat has eaten too much Xmas pudding laced with brandy.

    • As usual, the cost of trying to administer such a regime would result in a bloated bureaucracy chasing it’s tail in an unachievable target to make it “fair.”

      • Blazer

         /  January 3, 2018

        pretty simple…go by tax codes…any chicanery…double the fine..again.

      • Gezza

         /  January 3, 2018

        “Grappling with these issues is hardly new. In 1774 Montesquieu scratched his chin wondering: “Cannot pecuniary penalties be proportionate to fortunes?”. If you don’t know, Montesquieu is one of the great Enlightenment thinkers and a person who you quote when wanting to sound intelligent at dinner parties.

        But we don’t need philosophers when we have the Scandinavians who have addressed the issue head on. In a number of those countries, speeding fines are levied relative to income.

        In 2015, a Finnish multi-millionaire businessman was fined €54,000 ($91,000) for having a heavy foot. He was unimpressed, grumbling: “Ten years ago I wouldn’t have believed that I would seriously consider moving abroad. Finland is impossible to live in for certain kinds of people who have high incomes and wealth.”

        And right there, even though he might not have realised it, he gained an appreciation of the big impact that fines have on poor people. Although seldom can the poor afford to emigrate in protest.”

        Seems fair.

        • Alan Wilkinson

           /  January 3, 2018

          So he emigrates and the poor are still stuffed by the system. Seems braindead stupid to me but what do I know.

          • Blazer

             /  January 3, 2018

            you can bet he never emigrated,they very rarely do.Empty threats the same as in France,when Hollande was…elected.

          • Gezza

             /  January 3, 2018

            I bet he didn’t emigrate. Who’s going to accept someone with $91,000 in speeding fines?

            Why shouldn’t fines for offences generally be indexed to income, Alan? How is it fair that someone on a lesser income gets fined a higher percentage of income than someone on a high income for the same offence?

            • Alan Wilkinson

               /  January 3, 2018

              You know that people who can’t pay fines usually get let off without paying anything eventually. But the premise of the article is that they don’t so how is fining rich people more going to help? Bloody ridiculous nonsense you are trying to justify.

            • Gezza

               /  January 3, 2018

              Most people have to & do pay their fines. Blustering bombastic diversion is not explaining why it wouldn’t be fairer to index fines to income levels.

            • Alan Wilkinson

               /  January 3, 2018

              You are the diverter -irrelevant to the point I made and the premise of the article.
              As for fairness, it is on the eye of the beholder. Under your assumption those who don’t bother to earn anything would pay nothing.

            • Gezza

               /  January 3, 2018

              No, you are incorrect. This is relevant, Sir Alan. I quoted the very part of the article that shows it IS actually a relevant question, one that logically arises within it. Not my fault you posted an article that actually raises the question of whether indexing fines to income would be fairer, & that when I focus on that, because it’s a relevant point, you can’t explain why it wouldn’t be. I win again. Sorry about that.

              We can talk about those who can’t pay anything & whose fines get wiped elsewhere, if I choose to. Right now though I’m off to NW to get milk & other supplies.

            • Alan Wilkinson

               /  January 3, 2018

              Tosh. Drink your milk and leave serious debate to others.

            • Gezza

               /  January 3, 2018

              Apologies, Sir Alan I see the article in question was posted by PZ. However, contrary to your nonsense, the essential point of that article IS actually as I have said, and it even says, further down:

              “Leaving aside the odd millionaire businessman, the Finish laws appear popular; or at least they were in 1999 when a survey showed four out of five Finns supported them. It’s hard to argue that millionaires shouldn’t be affected by speeding tickets, and I imagine that the Finns put those €50,000 to good use. Is this approach likely in New Zealand? I can’t see it.”

              And because he can’t see this happening in NZ, even though it would be fairer, he wimps out with:

              “Still, we should have a conversation about the impact of fines on certain groups — particularly because unpaid they drive people to court and into the criminal justice system leading to impacts most undesirable.

              Our sense of justice is sometimes like our driving, and we should be inspired by the best of it.”

              I am doing serious debate. You’re not. You’re just bloviating about rich people emigrating if they were more fairly fined.

            • Alan Wilkinson

               /  January 3, 2018

              Rubbish. I’m saying (repeatedly) that fining supposedly rich people heaps does nothing whatever to solve the problem of poor people’s lives being destroyed by traffic fines. That is a real problem. What is fair is a fake problem since the answer is whatever most benefits the answerer politically or financially.

            • Gezza

               /  January 3, 2018

              Go and bloviate about that elsewhere. This subthread is from my asking you a simple question & you’re still blithering on about something irrelevant to that question. I’ve already won this one. Everybody knows. Sod off & stop being a pest about it.

            • Alan Wilkinson

               /  January 3, 2018

              You go bloviate elsewhere. This is my subthread and you are not hijacking it to your daft fake issue. If you just want to muddle on about fairness start your own thread by yourself.

            • Gezza

               /  January 3, 2018

              The whole thing is PZ’s thread. I just got it back on track with the main issue after you pooh-poohed the idea & made a ridiculous assertion that the article’s author said the solution to the problem of poor people ending up in the criminal justice system was to fine rich people more (which he doesn’t say), Corky had one of his usual swipes at “the poor”, putting them all into one of the limited number of boxes that is all he can ever conceptualise, & Duncan said it would result in a bloated bureaucracy.

              The main issue is that fining people based on their income level is fairer. The whole point of a fine is penalise someone for committing an offence. To be truly fair, the degree, not the amount, of financial penalty should be the same for everyone.

              Anyway, maybe richer people paying bigger fines would pay for any increased bureaucracy. Let’s give it a go & see? The Finns like it.

            • Alan Wilkinson

               /  January 3, 2018

              The Finns like it

              Another failing economy:
              https://tradingeconomics.com/finland/gdp-per-capita-ppp

            • Gezza

               /  January 3, 2018

              Irrelevant. If you want to debate that, best posted as its own comment with a blurb from you, contending that their economy is failing because rich people are fined more for offences. Not wasting my time on it here. Sorry.

            • Alan Wilkinson

               /  January 3, 2018

              Finland is attempting to recover from a decade of stagnation by cutting spending and reforming labour laws

              No doubt all part of improving your “fairness”.

              -https://www.reuters.com/article/us-finland-government-populists/finland-dodges-government-collapse-after-nationalists-split-idUSKBN1941IZ

            • Alan Wilkinson

               /  January 3, 2018

              And following that silly traffic fine the Left got booted out of Government in the 2015 Finish election and a right-leaning coalition took over. So not that happy probably.

            • Gezza

               /  January 3, 2018

              I have no more time for your ranting.

  3. sorethumb

     /  January 3, 2018

    “Hostiles”: The Wild West
    By portraying frontier life at its most brutal, he leaves the viewer pondering America’s murderous history and its continued demonisation of the “other”.
    https://www.economist.com/blogs/prospero/2018/01/wild-west?
    Economist is ideologically possessed.

  4. sorethumb

     /  January 3, 2018

    Here’s one about the racist right-winger (Obama returned his statue)
    https://www.flicks.co.nz/movie/darkest-hour/

  5. This seems a fairly dubious claim.

    • duperez

       /  January 3, 2018

      After all the ponderings over years it simply gets down to “Guy Wallace has just confirmed Scott Watson is the killer.” And the Herald has the headline “Gable Tostee: Girl in glitter was ‘looking for a fight’.
      http://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=11968832

      I remember many discussions soon after half way through the last century as we considered changes which meant people having so much more leisure time and how that time would be spent.

      The next big thing to free us could be upon us. This time our minds will be freed, giving us even more time for other things.

      TOP, (sorry Gareth), The Oracle Panel, can be established. The panel can do our thinking for us and tell it how it is.

      Guy Wallace and Gable Tostee are obvious sitters and (not just as a sop for ‘TOP’) Gareth should be on it. Matthew Hooton and Rodney Hide along with Peter Dunne, now he has the time, would be there.
      Michelle Boag and Lizzie Marvelly know what’s best and will let us know so would be great in the group. Anyone who would quibble about lack of balance of gender numbers needn’t worry. No matter how many males are involved Boag would have things uneven.

      Only one person could be the leader – Mike Hosking. Actually would we need others? Where is he with our answers to the Sounds case, glittery boobs, Palestine, deaths on the road, New Year fireworks, netballers not earning enough, … ?

  6. PartisanZ

     /  January 3, 2018

    Google’s `Dutch sandwich’ shielded 16 billion euros from tax …

    “President Trumps’ tax law, which was passed last month, will give companies such as Google an incentive to repatriate much of that cash by offering them a “one-time”, 15.5 per cent tax rate on the hoarded funds.

    After that, foreign earnings will be taxed at 10.5 per cent, with companies allowed to deduct foreign tax liabilities from this amount.

    The law will also impose a 13.1 per cent tax on certain international patent royalties. That could hit Google’s tax arrangement in which its Bermuda-based subsidiary licenses Google’s intellectual property to its other foreign subsidiaries.”

    – The Washington Post

    https://www.stuff.co.nz/business/industries/100298667/googles-dutch-sandwich-shielded-16-billion-euros-from-tax