Open Forum – Saturday

24 February 2018

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34 Comments

  1. Corky

     /  February 24, 2018

    Saw Jonsey on the News last night. For once he was pensive and measured..
    Probably more from tiredness and lack of a feed, then a deliberate effort on his part.
    It seems his regional initiatives have been a hit in the provinces. Jonsey is adding to what seems a regular political cycle – Labour takes the initiative; National hold the status quo and stop any backsliding. National really need to ask themselves what they stand for. Maybe pull their constitution out of the top draw and have a squizz.

    • Gezza

       /  February 24, 2018

      This is an initiative that actually needs to be taken. Even though it’s really an NZF initiative, if it delivers results it’s going to be a big win for Labour electorally.

  2. robertguyton

     /  February 24, 2018

    Corky says, and I agree:
    ” Labour takes the initiative; National hold the status quo and stop any backsliding. National really need to ask themselves what they stand for. Maybe pull their constitution out of the top draw and have a squizz.”

    • unitedtribes2

       /  February 24, 2018

      National had a squizz in the top draw but alas there was no constitution there

      • Kitty Catkin

         /  February 24, 2018

        Would that be ‘the top drawer’ ? It makes no sense as you have it.

      • PartisanZ

         /  February 24, 2018

        … National also failed to ask themselves what they stand for …?

        Poor show all round old chap.

  3. lurcher1948

     /  February 24, 2018

    I see that in the US there is a Gun store having a 50% sale next week – they’re advertising it as a “back to school” sale

    • Corky

       /  February 24, 2018

      Always be prepared, Lurchy. When the teachers say: ”make sure your lead is sharpened.”
      They ain’t joking.

      • lurcher1948

         /  February 24, 2018

        A teacher takes down a gunman, the total score 6 pupils gunman,5 dead teacher. so much more logical to ban assault weapons, but then its the NRA and trumps USA

        • Corky

           /  February 24, 2018

          It’s America, Lurchy. By dint of numbers they have a whole heap more scumbags. However, we do OK , given our population, at producing many top quality deadbeats.
          Hell, the government even helps them keep warm between crimes.

    • Gezza

       /  February 24, 2018

  4. David

     /  February 24, 2018

    https://www.stuff.co.nz/world/americas/101735848/india-to-canadian-pm-justin-trudeau-stop-trying-so-hard

    Things must be truly awful if even the NZ media is finally catching up with the coverage of Canada,s Jacinda and his virtue signalling awfulness. His polling is 37% approval rating at the same time his neighbour has just hit 50%, Trudeau was 60% approval and its been downhill ever since.
    http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2018/02/23/donald-trumps-approval-rating-rises-50-per-cent/

    • Corky

       /  February 24, 2018

      That’s so sad. Even liberals must be embarrassed at Trudeau.

      Meanwhile Trumpy proves God, guns and the American way is best.

      • Kitty Catkin

         /  February 24, 2018

        I bet that the rise happened before his spineless performance over the latest school shooting, where he had to have a note telling him to say ‘I hear you.’ in his tiny hand.

        Wait until the next school mass murder, which can’t be too far away, and see how he handles that.

        • David

           /  February 24, 2018

          Not sure what more he could do or any of the other presidents being it’s Congress who make the laws

          • Kitty Catkin

             /  February 24, 2018

            He claims that when things go well, it’s because of him. So….

            He and others who accept money from the NRA have hopelessly compromised themselves and I wait to see how they handle this.

  5. David

     /  February 24, 2018

    https://www.stuff.co.nz/sport/other-sports/101738148/australian-ceo-wants-kiwi-transgender-weightlifter-laurel-hubbard-banned-from-commonwealth-games

    I am with the women on this one you could literally get to the stage where “men” could win all competitions. Life is full of choices and sometimes, which may come as a surprise to snowflake generation you cant have everything and if you chose to transition/self identify etc etc then its not fair to others that you use some genetic advantage to award yourself with some undeserved win. Choices have costs and that cost shouldnt be at others expense.

    • Blazer

       /  February 24, 2018

      agree again…quite ludicrous.

      • David

         /  February 24, 2018

        Blazer we need to stop this agreeing with one another, 2nd time this week. You were spot on with the lobbyist thing in case you were wondering.
        There is a rather unusual situation with a small lake in north london which has always been reserved for women but recently blokes in bikinis have been using it claiming they are transitioning, the women are not impressed or tolerant and there was some biffo in Hyde Park between the trans protestors and the womens movement.
        I think we are reaching a moment when identity politics is going to consume itself as it inevitably must and then who knows perhaps we can all just get on with our lives and be tolerant and quit this special treatment for particular groups…I have no doubt many trans people are mortified with the palava and just want to get on with transitioning quietly.

    • ts ridiculous that a “human” who has had years of testosterone coursing through their veins with the many, many advantages that affords can turn around and compete against a biological woman.

      She lived as a man for 35 years fgs.

      I am too old fashioned for this very weird world

      • David

         /  February 24, 2018

        There is a lady at my gym who competed in Europe last year and came runner up to a bloke transitioning and like it or not men and women have different capabilities in this area. When you see how much effort she put in it was grossly unfair, it will end up putting women off sport and competing for the sake of a tiny tiny minority which will be exploited by some men.

        • Kitty Catkin

           /  February 24, 2018

          Laurel Hubbard is, I believe, no longer a man.

          Nobody would have their dangly bits cut off & have their penis cut down the middle and turned into a vulva as well as growing tits just so that they can enter a competition as a woman. Her hormone treatment will have lessened her former manly strength.

          Having a sex change is too drastic a cost for the chance of winning a medal.

          • Kitty Catkin

             /  February 24, 2018

            She has the hormones of a woman. Don’t be so narrow-minded. Haven’t any of you ever met someone who has changed gender or who was a betwixt and between and is now what they believe they were meant to be ? What about that beautiful Maori girl who was born a boy but now lives as a girl ? I think that her name is Aroha.,

            • Kitty Catkin

               /  February 24, 2018

              Awa, my mistake.

            • David

               /  February 24, 2018

              Yes I have an old friend going through it, I take offence at being called narrow minded but then when you have no valid argument abuse is the refuge and all the better when one can infer a bigoted position.
              Artificially lowering ones testosterone levels leading up to a competition is little different from taking steroids and then going off them running up to a competition which is why there is on going testing, we dont allow one because it gives an unfair advantage why allow the other albeit more natural one.

            • Kitty Catkin

               /  February 24, 2018

              Laurel Hubbard’s testosterone is the same level as any other female.

              She is now, to all intents and purposes, a woman. It is highly unlikely that anyone would go through all that to have a better chance of winning.

            • Gezza

               /  February 24, 2018

              She can’t change her male skeletal frame or her musculature. They give her an unfair advantage, I’m sure. She shouldn’t be allowed to compete at a woman. She should be allowed to compete against other transitioned women.

            • Gezza

               /  February 24, 2018

              *at = as

          • David

             /  February 24, 2018

            No one knows at what stage she is at but he has had all the advantages of being a man and building muscle for 35 years, all that testosterone and physical advantage of being built a man to then unfairly disadvantage strong competitive women is an outrage.
            I support the transition and hope happiness and contentment are the destiny but I dont think she should disadvantage women in the process. I train everyday I see and know how hard it is, I know both genders who compete and its just not a level playing field.

  6. Zedd

     /  February 24, 2018

    I attended the Sth Dn ‘Buskers festival’ today.. 2nd year ?
    I hear it was much better attended, both with buskers & the public. It was good to see not only aspiring professionals, but families/kids just ‘having a go’ & enjoying themselves.

    Most of the activities in Dn, tend to be either, centred in the Octagon or near the Uni. of Otago campus.. it was good to see, Sth Dn getting this event too ! 🙂

  7. PartisanZ

     /  February 24, 2018

    David Seymour’s End of Life Choice Bill is currently in Select Committee and open to submissions until 6 March … Only 10 days to go.

    You can read the legislation and make submissions here –

    https://www.parliament.nz/en/pb/bills-and-laws/bills-proposed-laws/document/BILL_74307/end-of-life-choice-bill

    Seymour also has a website http://www.lifechoice.org.nz with lots of information about EoLC and the Bill, with a page that makes it really easy to email your MP or even every MP from the various parties to tell them how you want them to vote –

    http://www.lifechoice.org.nz/email_your_mp

    My principal concern in supporting End of Life Choice is for those people who will commit suicide anyway – and we know not how many of them there are each year – and for those who would use the option if it were available. The Oregon State U.S.A Death-with-Dignity experience indicates the numbers of these people are not large.

    With 4.2 million people Oregon has a similar population (and demographic?) to Aotearoa New Zealand. From 1998 – 2015 “a total of 1,545 prescriptions were written and 991 patients (64 percent) died by using legally prescribed lethal medication.”

    https://www.physiciansweekly.com/how-successful-is-oregons-death-with-dignity-act/

    And here’s a longer, well written article by Courtney S. Campbell, Hundere Professor in Religion and Culture at Oregon State University, who is basically opposed to the ODDA on religious and moral grounds, while admitting, “I find myself still affirming that there are other ethically preferable policies to achieve patient choice, control, and “dignity” in the end of life, even while recognizing that individual patients do sometimes find themselves confronted with the need to employ that “last resort.”

    https://www.thenewatlantis.com/publications/ten-years-of-death-with-dignity

    I have grave reservations about Clauses 15 & 16 of David Seymour’s Bill due to close personal experience, and have submitted these along with my recommendations for change –

    “Had they been allowed to surround themselves with family and loved ones at their chosen time for passing-away, I believe both my friends [who committed suicide] would have chosen to exercise End of Life Choice at home and without a doctor present.

    I therefore cannot support Clauses 15 & 16 of the End of Life Choice Bill – in their current form – requiring a doctor to be in the room or in close proximity and “provide the medication”. I believe these provisions of the Bill –

    A) unnecessarily burden the doctor with “providing the medication to the person” [but not administering it] at the chosen time or end of life ‘moment’.

    B) virtually necessitates end of life choice occurring in a hospital or hospice setting

    C) may be highly unsuitable or even impossible in some remote rural areas and

    D) may simply be unacceptable to some individuals or minorities; Maori or other ethnic, religious or social ‘identity’ minorities.

    I believe that an ‘at home without a doctor present’ provision must be made available, with no sacrifice of safety requirements.

    After all, why does a doctor need to be there? In case the patient dies!

    Recommendation: I believe that Aotearoa New Zealand should follow the Oregon State [U.S.A] ‘Death with Dignity’ model regarding prescription, provision and doctor presence at end of life. Here is Oregon Health Authority’s FAQ on the subject –

    “Q: Must a physician be present at the time the medications are taken?

    A: The law does not require the presence of a physician when a patient takes lethal medication. A physician may be present if a patient wishes it, as long as the physician does not administer the medication him/herself.”

    I recommend that Clauses 15 & 16 be amended to closely follow the highly successful Death-with-Dignity citizens initiated legislation which has operated successfully in Oregon State U.S.A since November 1997.

    Whether you support or oppose EoLC, please make submissions and let your MP or all MPs know how you feel.

    I look at it like Cannabis Law Reform: If it fails this time it ain’t coming around again for quite a while.

    PartisanZ

    PS – A third friend/acquaintance of mine recently committed suicide, and the possibility exists they may have been terminally-ill. Our suicide statistics don’t tell us, but with an average 58 people per year choosing Death-with-Dignity in Oregon, indications are a similar number or more of our annual suicide toll are terminally-ill patients who “employ that ‘last resort'” … and whose families, loved ones and communities suffer the dreadful, unnecessary aftermath.

  8. lurcher1948

     /  February 24, 2018


    hope it works

  9. lurcher1948

     /  February 24, 2018

    Whatever happened to jeff wilsons hair, waiting for the rugby to start,but Jeff Wilson was called GOLDIE once, POOR BUGGER, BAULD AS A BADGER, not me

    • Corky

       /  February 24, 2018

      Lack of copper, Lurchy. First the nits die. Then the hair goes grey. Then it falls out. All that’s left is to shine that baldhead with Bay Rum.