‘Hate speech’ – hateful expressions, or knowingly stirring up hate

I’ve seen this term used a number of times: “You don’t hate people.”

I have always seen ‘hate’ as a very strong term, but there seems to be a lot of hate today, often for trivial things.

The Oxford dictionary tends towards it being a strong term:

hate (verb)

1 Feel intense dislike for.

   1.2 Have a strong aversion to (something)

Hate (noun)

1 Intense dislike

   1.1 Denoting hostile actions motivated by intense dislike or prejudice

People seem to have intense dislike of fairly trivial things these days. There was an item last night on Sunday on road rage which showed extraordinary and violent reactions to relatively minor incidents on roads.

‘Hate speech’ has been a big talking point lately.

Do people really hate things that others say?

Or do they just hate that people say things they disagree with?

I suspect there’s a lot more tendency towards the latter.

John Roughan: Forceful speech is not always hate speech

Some things a parent says to a child go in very deep and stay for life. I can still hear my mother telling me, “You don’t hate people.”

I quickly forgot who it was I’d just announced I hated because her reply was more interesting. “You hate what they say or do, you don’t hate them. You don’t hate people.” Her tone was matter of fact not moralistic, and I worked out what she meant. It was simply a fact, there was goodness in everyone.

I agree to a large extent, although I thing hate could be justified for some people. Despicable actions can be hated, and despicable people can also be hated.

Hate is a heavy word and I rarely use it…

Same for me, but I see and hear the term used a lot.

…but it is getting quite an airing in this very important debate we are having since Phil Goff closed Auckland Council venues to Stefan Moyneux and Lauren Southern. This week supporters of the mayor have decided “free speech is not hate speech”, which, on the evidence of the banned pair’s internet posts, seems unfair.

Southern hates Islamic attitudes to women and for that reason she hates Islamic immigration. I think my mother would permit that, probably agree with it. I’m not sure what Molyneux hates…

I don’t know whether Southern hates Muslims, Islamic attitudes to women or Islamic immigration. But she certainly seems to stir up feelings of hate, both in support and in opposition to what she says,

I strongly disagree with some aspects of the Islamic religion, but that’s in general terms. I strongly disagree with aspects of the Christian religion, and the Jewish religion, and other religions.

I strongly disagree with some Islamic attitudes to women  – and also to some Kiwi attitudes to women as expressed online.

However I don’t hate Islamic immigration, nor do I fear it. I have no reason to do so. I don’t hate Muslim immigrants, and I certainly don’t hate Muslim people I pass on the streets of Dunedin (that happens quite often). I have no reason whatsoever to hate these people.

But some people do seem to hate Islam, hate Muslims, and appear to hate Muslim immigrants.

If Southern and Molyneux play on some people’s hates and fears, if they provoke expressions of hate, then are they guilty of hate speech?

Or is it just speech that they know will provoke feelings and expressions of hate? Are they trying to generate and propagate a frenzy of hate?

It is possible to stir up hate without using specifically hateful phrases in their speech.

Perhaps that’s what others hate about Southern and Molyneux.

 

79 Comments

  1. Corky

     /  July 23, 2018

    ”However I don’t hate Islamic immigration, nor do I fear it.”

    I don’t hate Muslims. I just don’t want them in New Zealand because I fear them. Why do I fear them? Because overseas experience factually shows the things these people believe in
    are incompatible with our culture. Therefore common sense tells me prevention is better than cure. I’m sure many Europeans would agree with me.

    I don’t fear Muslims as a community in New Zealand. I fear what that community MAY become or breed.

    • Theoretical maybe some time in the future vagueness.

      We have serious actual problems in New Zealand now that I think deserve far more attention. In particular the ongoing horrific levels of domestic and public violence that cause huge amounts of problems.

      • Alan Wilkinson

         /  July 23, 2018

        It’s not theoretical that our security services now have to spend time and resources monitoring immigrants and convrrts for terrorist activities.

      • NOEL

         /  July 23, 2018

        I do get a chuckle out of the islamophobic brigade here and their fears for NZ.
        Gangs have been radicalising young people for decades. Have a son whose living with a TBI after inadventantly walking into a gang area. Left for dead because he had a “mean as phone”
        Never had any problem walking past the Mosque.

        • Corky

           /  July 23, 2018

          Your ignorance is fascinating. But each to their own.

          • NOEL

             /  July 23, 2018

            Yup there are a lot of them to fear.
            https://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=12017499
            vs
            how many gang members in the meth trade targeting our youth?

          • lurcher1948

             /  July 23, 2018

            Corky,your fans

            • lurcher1948

               /  July 23, 2018

              Corky got to ease off your hatred of the unknown and muslims, a member of your family will probably KILL YOU

            • sorethumb

               /  July 23, 2018

              She [Helen Clark] said to me that New Zealand was really a very racist country, and she was determined to do everything she could as prime minister to change that

              Which countries are not racist lurcher?
              What is the difference between racism and ethnocentrism?

            • Corky

               /  July 23, 2018

              ”Corky got to ease off your hatred of the unknown and muslims, a member of your family will probably KILL YOU.”

              Where did I say I had a hatred of the unknown and Muslims. Turn your heat pump on. You can afford it with my money.

            • sorethumb

               /  July 23, 2018

              This video is in itself bigoted. It has an old white person migrant theme yet it is old white people who have seen their country change for the worse. What’s more we don’t know if the guy following the black guy around the supermarket was set up?

          • Corky

             /  July 23, 2018

            See my first post.

        • Griff

           /  July 23, 2018

          What always cracks me up when I read the islamophobic brigade is the memory of waiting for a Muslim fishing buddy to get home from prayers at the mosque
          Sitting reading his two preschool daughters their favorite golden book.
          The twelve days of Christmas.

        • Gezza

           /  July 23, 2018

          Gone through security at an airport?
          Never had to do that stuff once.
          Why do we have to do it now, do you think?
          Who are they most concerned about?

        • sorethumb

           /  July 23, 2018

          Homogenous societies have lower crime eg China and Japan.
          http://archive.boston.com/news/globe/ideas/articles/2007/08/05/the_downside_of_diversity/
          …………………
          Ethnocentrism has evolutionary roots.

          Multiculturalism doesn’t work if we accept that it has exceptions that throws doubt on the whole concept. That’s why it is so important that the is no Clash of Civilisations.

          There is plenty of evidence that Islam is problematic:

          There is no separation of Church and state.

          Religions with greater observance requirements on the daily lives are stronger that insipid ones, therefore they don’t fade away like our liberal Christian churches.

          Atlantic featured an article that showed that Isis follow the true Islam.

          • sorethumb

             /  July 23, 2018

            We are facing a situation where we have watery liberalism, dissolving in nihilism vacating itself for a non doubting Islam (or as they say “liberal society will disappear up it’s own backside)

        • “Never had any problem walking past the Mosque.”

          Be patient. They were all saying the same in Britain, Scandinavia and Europe ten years ago.

    • Griff

       /  July 23, 2018

      Number of Muslims killed in The war on terror?
      Somewhere between 1,000,000 and 4,500,000.
      Number of westerners killed?
      less than 10,000.

      Muslims have a lot more grounds to fear us then we do to fear them.

      • Corky

         /  July 23, 2018

        ‘Muslims have a lot more grounds to fear us then we do to fear them.’

        Really, tell that to the next boat load of illegal immigrants crossing from Libya. Brave people to be going into the lions den.

        • Griff

           /  July 23, 2018

          Just maybe they are fleeing from the result of American aggression in their homelands.

          • Corky

             /  July 23, 2018

            Yeah, right into the enemies hands. They are fleeing because Muslim countries suck. How do I know this? Because Muslims openly say so.

          • Alan Wilkinson

             /  July 23, 2018

            They are fleeing their fellow Muslims. They know them better than we do.

    • sorethumb

       /  July 23, 2018

      Noel, Griff and Lurcher think Islam fits under a liberal framework.

      • Griff

         /  July 23, 2018

        Atheism does not judge gods it finds no evidence for gods existing.
        When we get Muslims on here pushing their idiotic religion I will attack their world view just as emphatically as I would if we had Christians on here doing the same.

        As a liberal I believe all men are equal. I judge peploe on their behavior towards me not the religion an accident of birth gave them.

        Those Muslims I know personally are respectful, honest and try to maintain the precepts of their belief system without hypocrisy. Many of the Christians I know are dishonest hypocrites who think their god allows them to be disrespectful towards those who dont follow their belief system.

        Jesus was a liberal …..

        • Gezza

           /  July 23, 2018

          Jesus was a bludger who lived off other people & gave deluded followers hoping he was the Messiah some absolutely shit advice. Read your damn Bible. And watch this.

          This guy is a former Baptist Minister, so devout he wanted to be the best Christian Pastor he could possibly be & so went to Bible College to study the Bible, deepen his faith, and better serve his parishioners.

        • @Griff
          You really must learn to distinguish between Muslims and Islam. A senior Imam was once asked publicly why Islam orders the murder of apostates, and his reply was that if it did not, then all the Muslims would leave and there would be no Islam.

          I suspect he did not fully grasp the significance of what he said; but I do, and I think you should too.

      • lurcher1948

         /  July 23, 2018

        Now that’s a silly comment

        • sorethumb

           /  July 23, 2018

          Why? You think Muslims entering a country fit within it’s liberal ethos (and I mean above a certain percentage point)
          Yes they aren’t all the same, but…. it is still an illiberal religion.

  2. Griff

     /  July 23, 2018

    Conservatives Big on Fear, Brain Study Finds

    Peering inside the brain with MRI scans, researchers at University College London found that self-described conservative students had a larger amygdala than liberals. The amygdala is an almond-shaped structure deep in the brain that is active during states of fear and anxiety. Liberals had more gray matter at least in the anterior cingulate cortex, a region of the brain that helps people cope with complexity.

    The conservative party is big on national defense and magnifies our perception of threat, whether of foreign aggressors, immigrants, terrorists, or invading ideologies like Communism. To a conservative, the world really is a frightening place.

    Given that their brains are so different, it is hardly surprising that liberals and conservatives should spend so much time talking across each other and never achieving real dialog or consensus.

    https://www.psychologytoday.com/us/blog/the-human-beast/201104/conservatives-big-fear-brain-study-finds

    • High Flying Duck

       /  July 23, 2018

      2 minutes on twitter provides a pretty robust rebuttal of those conclusions.
      Chicken Little is definitely a creature of the left, where the sky is always falling.

      • Blazer

         /  July 23, 2018

        whereas the right are all fitted out in rose coloured spectacles….’on the cusp of something special’,’a brighter future’….believe it…or…not!

        • High Flying Duck

           /  July 23, 2018

          Optimism goes a long way Blazer. You should try it some time.

          • Blazer

             /  July 23, 2018

            LIKE UM….’BUSINESS CONFIDENCE IS…DOWN’!

            • High Flying Duck

               /  July 23, 2018

              It’s down because Labour got in – and the sky is falling.

            • Blazer

               /  July 23, 2018

              make up your mind…!..some brighter future’!

        • sorethumb

           /  July 23, 2018

          Conservatives are not less intelligent. What’s more they are better judges of human nature.

          • Gezza

             /  July 23, 2018

            These days Liberals are mostly young people who are very well off, educated in soft subjects, & live in areas that don’t have any problems beyond the occasional boyfriend-stealer or snooty neighbour.

            Older Liberals in politics are often now actually conservatives who yes, are better judges of human nature because they are older, & so know how to appeal to & easily manipulate leftists & young Liberals to further their political careers.

    • Corky

       /  July 23, 2018

      ”Conservatives Big on Fear, Brain Study Finds”

      Maybe a finely honed sense of survival. Going by the posts on this blog, literals have none. That explains why they have to live on other peoples money.

      • Corky

         /  July 23, 2018

        *liberals*

      • Blazer

         /  July 23, 2018

        Capitalism is a ponzi scheme that relies on ‘other people’s money’…along with creating it out of..thin air and charging interest.

    • sorethumb

       /  July 23, 2018

      Posted Apr 19, 2011

  3. Gezza

     /  July 23, 2018

    Pink David said yesterday in a comment on my Post on Southern & Molyneux in Melbourne that he thought these two were primarily opportunists, agreeing with me that they are both making their names & fortunes out of riding the wave.

    I’ve been looking for the right word to describe what I thought was motivating them most for a few days & opportunism captures it pretty nicely.

    They are very much both riding the waves of:
    * anti-Islamism
    * anti-feminism
    * White Pride

    There are some closely related topics that are “hot button” issues for peploe (thanks Griff, I really like this word) in the part of the political spectrum I’d describe as conservative+liberal+alt right+far right.

    They include:
    * anti-multiculturalism
    * nationalism
    * racism (including “scientific racism” – the current vehicle is IQ is race-based)
    * White Power/Black Power/Yellow Power – or the fear of it
    * anti-leftism/anti-liberalism
    * anti-weirdos demanding special recognition (currently up to 70 self-described gender benders)
    * anti-snowflakeism (covers a range of ‘sins’ but generally applies, it seems to all limp-wristed leftists or liberals who are FOR or not opposed to any or all of things the Conservative+ lot is AGAINST)
    * anti-welfarism (nobody should get welfare: food stamps & soup kitchens until the losers get a job or get murdered by another hobo or urban hood – most prominent in the US)
    * anti-Welfare Statism ( don’t mind a little bit of state charity assistance to the deserving widows & spinsters of the parish, & veterans – but screw everybody else: get a night cleaner or job in Walmart, McDonalds or Starbucks)
    * Patriarchialism (men are the best providers: they earn more because they work longer & harder & in more difficult jobs)

    All or most of the above seem to be mixed with at least some of what one or both of them believe (the state should fund the military, the courts – maybe law enforcement: that’s it. After that, it’s guns for all, every homosapien for themselves, start your own business, invest in the markets, get rich – everybody can – mum stays home if she has kids, so marry a man who can afford you until you can either go back to work or he’ll keep you & pay out handsomely if he gets a new model – get a pre-up if you need to. Oh yes, you can also keep & change toyboys if you’re a wealthy female – but get a pre-nup: the rejects will want a payout too.)

    The Go To Guru for most of the other online Conservative+ folk who publicly advocate for one or more of this diverse collection of ‘anti’s above is Jordan Peterson. He doesn’t publicly advocate ALL these positions, but one way or another the factual psychological & sociological data underpinning things he says & is making his fame & fortune off seems to be able to linked to it.

    These folk are all doing very nicely, thanks – dominating the internet & air waves.

    • Gezza

       /  July 23, 2018

      Would the wanker who downticked that mind posting & explaining their reasons so I can carefully consider those before ripping them to shreds in the nicest possible way? 😳

      • Corky

         /  July 23, 2018

        Probably a Rightie have a bad latte day.

        • Gezza

           /  July 23, 2018

          Fux wrong with them Corks? Should be bloody working, not cruising bloody blogsites downticking the intelligentsia.

    • sorethumb

       /  July 23, 2018

      I turned off Molyneaux on one of his posts (libertarianism – from memory). I think there is a type of person who is no nonsense, not scared of anyone or any thing, starts a shoe shop at 11 years old and is retired at 30 who thinks everyone should be like that. When I was young I had a bad role model (single parent – father. As my sister said “we brought him up”) and severe social phobia. A father is accumulated wisdom on how to cope past back down the line etc.
      ……
      having said that though the issues are world views and paradigms. One paradigm is that society needs to run organically and for that you need real disincentives for bads and individual responsibility: your child your responsibility v’s working for families [“the pig is the gentleman who pays the rent”]
      We act as though we are a rich country [2% own 80% of the wealth – just need to spread it around type thinking]. Yesterday I posted a Think Tank report to the effect that a 30B blowout thanks to mass migration in UK could threaten pensions etc.

    • NOEL

       /  July 23, 2018

      Gotta chuckle over her wearing as “It’s ok to be white” shirt.
      Wonder if she is aware of the origin?

      “It’s Okay to Be White” is a slogan launched on 4chan as a “proof of concept” to demonstrate that signs with the phrase posted in public places would be accused of promoting racism and white supremacy.

  4. Corky

     /  July 23, 2018

    ”There was an item last night on Sunday on road rage which showed extraordinary and violent reactions to relatively minor incidents on roads.”

    A middlclass Brazilian Jujitsu instructor who could lock any man up on the mat. But in the real world with a violent Polynesian thug coming his way didn’t know how to react.

    He thought they would go through the traffic lights; park, and exchange details. He thought wrong. He should have wound up his window and locked the car door for starters.

    • Gezza

       /  July 23, 2018

      Which segment was it? I’ll check it out on TVNZ On Demand.

    • sorethumb

       /  July 23, 2018

      Women who got head smacked was throwing nails. He was driving slowly though.

  5. sorethumb

     /  July 23, 2018

    [5:37]

    • sorethumb

       /  July 23, 2018

      “if people read that on Twitter and the Internet. Calling for genocide, they are gonna freak out”
      Rastus
      “”Ohhh! Cry baby, cry baby”. “I’m not calling for the slaughter of white people. At least not for now!”

      • sorethumb

         /  July 23, 2018

        3 down ticks? That’s the problem don’t know why>

  6. sorethumb

     /  July 23, 2018

    Cultural Evolution and Conservative Thought

    But the truth is that nobody has any business to destroy a social institution until he has really seen it as a historical institution. If he knows how it arose, and what purposes it was supposed to serve, he may really be able to say that they were bad purposes, or that they have since become bad purposes, or that they are purposes which are no longer served. But if he simply stares at the thing as a senseless monstrosity that has somehow sprung up in his path, it is he and not the traditionalist who is suffering from an illusion. We might even say that he is seeing things in a nightmare. — G.K Chesterton, The Thing, 1929

    https://areomagazine.com/2018/07/16/cultural-evolution-and-conservative-thought/

  7. sorethumb

     /  July 23, 2018

  8. Gezza

     /  July 23, 2018

    There are two main issues with Islam. Only ONE of them is Islamic terrorist attacks in Western Countries.

    By far the most of the terrorist attacks on inoffensive innocent people in the West

    (ignoring those ‘offensive people’ who, Jesus Bloody Christ, have simply ‘insulted the Prophet (Rot His Soul)’ & obviously had to die because according to the Quran & Hadith – Muhummad, the perfect Muslim who is a model for all, including women, said so)

    have been clearly motivated by – and even stated by the perpetrators to be – because Western military personnel are:

    1) Killing Muslims in the Middle East, Pakistan & Afghanistan, and / or
    2) Interfering, or just present, in the Middle East – & are infidels who shouldn’t be there

    The way to eliminate this particular threat is for Western countries to just get their military the hell out of the damn place & let them sort their affairs out in their own way. Like the way European countries did to get to where their societies are today. It’s been a bloody ruff ride – so let’s not kid ourselves anybody else can go from Mediaeval savagery to sweetness & light (?) via any other route because we are going to MAKE them.

    Look where Bush, Cheney, Rumsfeld & Blair got de whol’ dam worl’ wid dat idea!

    Left alone they will come out in the end with whatever works for them & their societies will be run by the most suitable people for their current cultural environment who come out on top.

    As an excellent example of how this would work, this 2minute news item was shown on Aljaz tv last night:

    For more detail if required
    https://www.aljazeera.com/news/2018/07/blast-heard-kabul-airport-exiled-vp-dostrum-returns-180722123819595.html

    The situation is Syria is that Assad has already utterly won. Every rebel & suspected rebel will be tortured & killed & populations who lived under rebel rule will now be terrorised: opposition will quickly be eliminated completely. It will cost mega billions to rebuild the place: entire cities with former populations of millions are now just endless square kilometres of bombed out buildings & rubble. It looks like WW2 Germany at the surrender.

    There have been riots & massive protests going on in Basra, & Other Southern Iraqi townd & cities in the last week due to the poverty & lack of jobs because of real & perceived corruption – & there are Court-ordered post-Election recounts supposed to be happening in various places because of electoral frauds. Killings, disappearances, & terrorising of local Sunni populations by Shiite militia in formerly ISIS dominated areas are reported to be commonplace, as forecast. Any Sunni, man, woman or child, could be, and probably is, an ISIS terrorist or sympathiser, as far as they are concerned.

    Allah alone knows WTF is going in on in Libya & who controls what. And Allah doesn’t even bloody exist, as everybody but the Muslims knows – but wimps & Christians are too bloody scared to show & tell them! (Especially when they point out that Allah agrees with the awful stuff we don’t like when they misnamed him Jaweh – & show them where, in the Bible.)

    Yemen is a basket case. Iran & Saudi Arabia will have sort that one out between them. ISIS is still in there too. The Saudis have proven to be both vicious & incompetent to date, given their military superority. Crown Prince MBS is in charge, which probably explains it. The Houthi / Iranian Shiite opposition forces are probably just as bad.

    The Palestinians are stuffed. Israel is officially now its own version of an apartheid state & the recent Zionist declaration of this, to legalise the longstanding Arab dispossessions, expulsions, IDF executions of resistors, & the continual seizure of more of their land & their ultimate ghettoisation into Gaza (historically partly Phillistine territory anyway) & bludgeoning of them into modern day slaves, submission, or exile, will most likely proceed apace. Trump will make Palestians an offer they can’t refuse, & they will, & with US support & UN uselessness the takeover job of ancient Israel & Judah will soon be complete – even if it takes Israel first signing up to a deal they then ignore as usual. The US won’t care altho they may mouth platitudes. It will continue to arm the IDF. Israel is basically really now its biggest base in the ME, not Qatar, in the most important way of keeping Islamic countries at bay. No Arab country wants to touch this place – one thing Muhummad & Muslims fear & respect is a better motivated, stronger, & successful Military conqueror.

    The West should get their military out of the Midfle East (Corporates & Missionaries can take their own risks) shut up telling them what to do (they say its none of our damn infidel business – unless they’re losing) & calmly just buy any oil they need from whoever owns it at the time.

    Until the Arabs, in their own time, outgrow their religion & their misogynistic, really truly Patriarchal, still pretty barbarous, culture & customs – no good will come of our interfering, however well-or otherwise-intentioned some Corporations, confused Christians, & dodgy Western arms dealing politicians pretend to be.

    Well, that’s where I’m at in my current thinking, based on my own observations.

    I now await hundreds of upticks – but I can handle it if I don’t get them because I’ve had counselling.

    • Alan Wilkinson

       /  July 23, 2018

      Gave you one, because you need to be rationed for your own good.

      • Gezza

         /  July 23, 2018

        That’s weird. My counsellor said I need to be rational for my own good.

    • sorethumb

       /  July 23, 2018

      There are two main issues with Islam. Only ONE of them is Islamic terrorist attacks in Western Countries.
      ………..
      The bigger issue is simply that you replace nihilism with a strong Islamic culture. If anything Popper’s Tolerance Paradox applies to that. It isn’t the individual but the culture.

      Immigration will change us anyhow. The Chinese do not believe in welfare. They believe in the family/clan system (and that) being “10 times more efficient”.
      ………………………………
      The issue with “hate speech” is that it is counter narrative speech. We have seen that where the MSM will not admit that there are racial differences in average IQ. They have chosen sides in a prejudicial way. That is where the line is drawn and they will not report anything from the dark side (true or false). We need some way of testing the MSM: make them respond to certain topics with experts on the other side (not Don Brash).

      • sorethumb

         /  July 23, 2018

        The fact that we have a compromised media is indicative that things aren’t going well for multiculturalism.

      • Gezza

         /  July 23, 2018

        The issue with “hate speech” is that it is counter narrative speech. We have seen that where the MSM will not admit that there are racial differences in average IQ.

        Average IQ? The reason for that it is that it’s not actually true of average IQ or in any way
        relevant to anything that matters. Environment, culture, education & personal development & competence are what matters.

        • sorethumb

           /  July 23, 2018

          We have seen that where the MSM will not countenance that there may be racial differences in average IQ. In fact they hold to a liberal consensus that there isn’t.
          ……………………..
          The reason for that it is that it’s not actually true of average IQ or in any way
          relevant to anything that matters. Environment, culture, education & personal development & competence are what matters.

          There are meta analyses which say there are. That’s what Peterson and Molyneaux base that on.
          IQ is inherited, suggests twin study
          https://www.newscientist.com/article/dn1520-iq-is-inherited-suggests-twin-study/
          They have studied identical twins separated at birth.

          • Gezza

             /  July 23, 2018

            Look, thumbsta, I accept that you are a racist & so this is very important to you. But I assure you that it’s not in the least important or even of interest to non-racists, who are by far the majority of educated, intelligent people, imo.

            The other factors I mention are all far, far more important in measuring overal intelligence including social intelligence and just success in life, than ethnicity & ancestry. I could go further into this but I don’t want to wadte any more time & energy on it.

            Just to give you a quick example IQ testing was done on the whole 4th form cohort to determine which classes we went into. Only the top 3rd were streamed into the Science & Languages forms. I have no idea what my IQ test result was, not interested, but I was obviously among the top 3rd.

            The other 2/3rds did General & Commercial studies.

            The brighest kid in my class, by far, was a redhead, bit of a loner, but would socialise if required. Very calm, collected, top marks in every subject, no enemies, never picked on, basically just out on his own performance-wise, did his homework, focussed on his future plans, Never said what they were. Ended up flying Skyhawks. Dunno what he did after that but the odds are whatever it was he’ll be successful & content.

            Some that I did keep in touch with ended up as lawyers, accountants, a pharmacist, programmers & later IT experts (computers were just kicking off then) a GP, a Bank Branch Manager. Some eventually took over the family farm. Some just faded into obscurity. Like me. Too arty & a dreamer at school.

            But the ones I really noticed were a few of the dummies in the “lower IQ” set, who were streamed into General & Commercial. Quite a few got jobs in banks, or goverment departments or mines or meat works etc, but many of the others ended up as Managers, a General Manager, & various tradies (like electricians, & plumbers) who started their own businesses & grew them & made a fucking fortune. They engaged people with high IQ’s as advisers to help them do this but only when they needed them.

            • sorethumb

               /  July 23, 2018

              Gezza / July 23, 2018
              Look, thumbsta, I accept that you are a racist & so this is very important to you.
              ………………………………………………………………….
              What makes me a racist Gezza? I have read about it and formed an opinion? Is it my cognitive ability that made me come to that conclusion or did my racism make me come to that conclusion?

              My interest in evolutionary psychology started when I read 20th Century Blues in Time Magazine and I became aware of miss-match theory: modern life versus our ancestral environment. In the past we lived for generations amongst our own people (aunts, uncles cousins) and close to nature. That is the antithesis of what is happening today where we are all interchangeable units. People and place mean nothing. It is not the cognitive factor I am interested in as much as the social nature, It just so happens that an accurate picture involves long periods apart. I’m arguing for a true picture of humanity not a convenient blank slate. To me the unique characteristics of various populations are part of that story.

            • Gezza

               /  July 23, 2018

              What makes me a racist Gezza?

              I don’t know the answer to that, thumbsta. As I said, not interested any more.

            • sorethumb

               /  July 23, 2018

              hit and run Gezza

            • Gezza

               /  July 23, 2018

              Retired undefeated, thumbsta. Never even took a hit.

  9. sophie

     /  July 23, 2018

    I don’t agree with everything these 2 have to say but I HIGHLY recommend Lauren’s video which has just been released on YouTube called ‘Farmlands.’ The western media has published very little of what is going on in South Africa at the moment.

    I will give you a few statistics – unemployment is around 40%, the murder rate is well over 10 times higher than it was under apartheid. Many farming families have been targeted for appalling murders (including torture, rapes etc) which is implicitly state supported. The crimes are not investigated or published usually.

    Infrastruture is failing with power outages and the water crisis due to the govt instituting strict policies of whites only being able to fill 8% of jobs leading to technical jobs being unfilled. The government has now passed laws saying farmland will be taken from farmers with no compensation, many whites cannot access any hospitals or welfare as they are not allowed to based on race. Leading politicians chant songs at rallies about killing the Boer and ‘Bring me my machete’.

    Genocide watch, an international NGO, has placed South Africa on watch due to their concerns that a genocide against whites could occur soon. Please go watch Farmlands and share with others. The mainstream media is not covering this and the issues are real and scary.

    • sorethumb

       /  July 23, 2018

      That video “China saved my life” is on the same topic, Sophie.

  10. sorethumb

     /  July 23, 2018

    We are burning the midnight oil to stand up for freedom of speech
    Our legal team of seven, plus additional helpers from our group, were in the office all weekend working on the case. This job has been made more difficult because Phil Goff and the Council’s lawyers seem to be getting ready to throw everything they have at us. They know that we have limited funds, and limited time. They’ve made no attempt to seek common ground, or to narrow the issues so the court can focus on the important issues of principle. Instead of replying to the open letter we sent urging Councillors to avoid the expense and reconsider the Mayor’s decision, they appear to be objecting to our public funding of this public-interest litigation.

    As an example of what could turn out to be underhand tactics, Mr Goff’s lawyers flagged in Court last week that they may have concerns about the “litigation funding”. We’re worried that they could be foreshadowing a claim that you don’t have the right to be funding it, and have it struck out.

    We are advised the Council doesn’t have a leg to stand on. We think it’s just another example of them trying to throw up red herrings and consume our resources. They must know that these things require our lawyers to divert from the key issues.

    Of course, Mayor Phil Goff uses your ratepayer money to defend his actions but is apparently open to opposing you using your own money to challenge him.

    You can read our statement to media, calling on Phil Goff to abandon this objection here: http://www.voxy.co.nz/politics/5/316532

    Human Rights Commission want to appear – but what way will they go?
    At one of the hearings last week, the Human Rights Commission said that they want to ‘intervene’ in this case and have engaged their own QC to make submissions

    Of course, we hope they are going to come down on the side of freedom – a fundamental human right in liberal democracies – but this is the same Human Rights Commission who have been lobbying the Government to create ‘hate speech’ laws to criminalise ‘disharmonious’ speech. The Commission has not been in contact with us so we are naturally concerned that we may soon be not only battling the might of ratepayer-funded lawyers, but also another taxpayer-funded outfit!

  11. sorethumb

     /  July 23, 2018

    Social scientists say conservative political views can be fuelled by fear.
    A new study suggests that making people feel safe from harm can change their stance on hot-button social issues.
    https://www.businessinsider.com.au/how-to-turn-conservatives-liberal-john-bargh-psychology-2017-10

    Could help explain why celebs and University professors are so liberal: the big bad bogey-man won’t get them (elites don’t suffer the consequences of the Utopian dream)

    • sorethumb

       /  July 23, 2018

      and liberals can be made more conservative (house prices in Auckland)

  1. ‘Hate speech’ – hateful expressions, or knowingly stirring up hate — Your NZ – NZ Conservative Coalition