Davidson and “women get a free pass” to use C word

There has been some criticising of Green co-leader Marama Davidson liking a tweet that uses the C word, but that has been defended, saying “Women get a free pass to use it especially in the context it was being used”.

Is this another example of different rules of acceptability of language for different groups of people?

Ironically, this began with a speech on free speech.

I’m sure if some people called her that there would be an uproar.

People have been slammed for liking tweets with no swear words in them – see National leader Simon Bridges accidentally ‘liked’ social media post mocking Clarke Gayford (although ‘Whaleoil’ has become a bit of a swear word these days).

Context does matter with speech. Davidson’s comment was directed at herself (more or less) and not at one specific person as abuse.

And social acceptance of swearing, especially by women and in public, has changed a lot over the last half century.

But ‘the real meaning of free speech’ surely must mean it is free for anyone to speak, not just some groups of people.

And it seems that increasingly there are attempts to have different rules about what can be said and who can speak on certain topics based on the group that a person belongs to (or is labelled as belonging to).

49 Comments

  1. David

     /  August 6, 2018

    Its a funny issue it gets used a lot by men but very rarely in front of women and I would guess its a few women trying to be edgy but its a fail from me, they look like try hards.

    • PartisanZ

       /  August 6, 2018

      Same with women doing pretty much anything in the ‘male domain’ eh David?

      • David

         /  August 6, 2018

        What the hell, how do you get sexism out of that.

  2. Geoffrey

     /  August 6, 2018

    Yes. I am very much afraid that the “free speech” monitors in this country are a very loud minority for whom the rules, that they are supposedly policing, do not apply.

  3. David

     /  August 6, 2018

    One thing that has struck me is the potty mouths of young women, worse than boys. My sons partner happily dropped the f bomb several times for no good reason in front of my mother in law, if my son had done that I would have bollocked him there and then. I have 2 mates with 16 and 17 year old daughters and both use the f word like a comma, truly appalling but apparently thy all talk like that, all nice kids from nice families at good schools.
    I just figured I am getting old or its just girls wanting to outdo boys like they do now in the drinking stakes.

    • PartisanZ

       /  August 6, 2018

      We liberated them!

      • PartisanZ

         /  August 6, 2018

        They liberated themselves … They liberated us … We liberated ourselves …

        Yes … We’re free! We can consume more liquor … younger … We can binge drink …

        Like we binge eat … and binge shop …

  4. Alan Wilkinson

     /  August 6, 2018

    Nobody gets a free pass on anything from everyone. You always have to play to your audience.

  5. Blazer

     /  August 6, 2018

    you can call a woman a cunt…just don’t call her a…slut!

    • Alan Wilkinson

       /  August 6, 2018

      I wouldn’t advise trying that on any of my female family. You would be unlikely to survive unscathed.

  6. Geoffrey Monks

     /  August 6, 2018

    I think “potty mouth” buttons it. Not grown up enough to be allowed out without trainer pants. I recall another MP who not so long ago felt that they was exempt the rules that apply to the rest of us. Same party, same gender, same bullet-proof ego. Pattern emerging?

  7. Comments on this on Reddit:
    Blackestwork: “Pete, why post your own blog? Bit of a cunt move.”

    Ianoftawa: “Given the frequency and multiplicity of material hnd posts there is absolutely no evidence that this is their own blog”

    Funny.

    • It’s an oddity that the genitalia are used as insults.

      Dick, twat, tit, cunt, balls and cock (as in a load of….), bollocks….all used as terms of abuse. But only the vernacular ones, so to speak, Nobody ever seems to use the anatomically correct ones in this way.

      It’s not just in English, of course. One of my lecturers still collapsed with mirth long after the event that she told us about where a woman who must have thought that the last letters of all French words were silent kept addressing the then ambassador as Monsieur le Con.

  8. Gezza

     /  August 6, 2018

    With swearing, these days there’s a race to the bottom by feminists & girls to catch up to boys & men & it’s catching on. It’s exacerbated & promoted by rap culture & “comedians”.

    • It has always happened, it’s just the words that change. Bloody used to be considered daring when women said it.

      All through history young people have shocked older ones with the then rude words. Then the words become mainstream and even ruder ones take their place.

      I don’t see why cunt is any ruder than vagina to describe that part of the anatomy. In The Canterbury Tales, the Wife of Bath, a successful businesswoman, talks freely in mixed company about hers. And she uses the word. It was ‘queynte’ then, the word that has, over the centuries, become cunt.

      • Pickled Possum

         /  August 6, 2018

        It’s a Germanic word meaning …. woman genitals
        or an unpleasant or stupid person.
        The outcome, someone is being Insulted and demeaned
        The word has been used since 1800
        Men invented the word to describe women they don’t like.
        To be called a See You Next Tuesday really is worse than MoFo

        • It was originally purely descriptive and not demeaning, as is obvious from its use in Old and Middle English texts like Chaucer. The Wife of Bath is proud of her ‘queynte’ and says that one of her husbands said that it was the best that he’d ever seen and that she told another that he was most unreasonable to want to keep it to himself.

          She is a well-off, respectable businesswoman on a pilgrimage, It was an unrefined era in some way !!!

          Shakespeare doesn’t use the actual word, but does have it in puns like ‘country’.

          It has been around since long before 1800, it was certainly not invented then, even if it had a derogatory meaning by then.

          Now it’s usually used of men; I don’t know when that happened. In the c20, I would guess.

  9. Blazer

     /  August 6, 2018

    expletives are just ‘….noises’…frequent use of words considered ‘potty mouth’ renders them impotent.

    • Gezza

       /  August 6, 2018

      Never has.

      • Blazer

         /  August 6, 2018

        people get desensitised…even bugger was frowned upon…once…and darn was borderline.

        • Gezza

           /  August 6, 2018

          Bugger off.

          • Blazer

             /  August 6, 2018

            don’t be a ‘Sam Hunt’.

          • Gezza

             /  August 6, 2018

            They haven’t been desentised. Some words – like bugger – have been given a context in which there’s a use of them that’s just no longer equated with what it means and come to have another. But the original swear word, used in the original crude usually sexual meaning to demean or get attention or shock or offend is still as offensive as ever.

            • Blazer

               /  August 6, 2018

              so I guess on that basis, ‘cunt’ can morph into a term of endearment.

            • Gezza

               /  August 6, 2018

              Yes it can. In some contexts.

          • Gezza

             /  August 6, 2018

            Let me illustrate.
            You are a prize twat. Bet you can’t even get it up. No wonder you can’t get any cunt, floppy cock.
            Now that is going to offend the fuck out of a lot of people.

            • In one of Robert Browning’s poems, the word twat appears (‘cowls and twats’) . He seems to have thought that it meant something else.

              You’d think that someone would have told him, or discreetly changed it later rather than making him look absurd,

            • Blazer

               /  August 6, 2018

              mind your coarse ..language…you cork soaker.

            • Gezza

               /  August 6, 2018

              Why? I would with normal people but you’re desensitised to those words so that shouldn’t offend you.

            • Blazer

               /  August 6, 2018

              you did not illustrate any context at all.
              You just took the opportunity to use all the expletives..you know.

            • Gezza

               /  August 6, 2018

              PG just deleted the illustrative context I just posted because it would be too offensive to you & him & others.

            • Gezza

               /  August 6, 2018

              And even you draw the line at calling people cocksuckers here but you do it with cork soaker & know people know what you mean.

            • Alan Wilkinson

               /  August 6, 2018

              @G, never wrestle with a pig …

            • Gezza

               /  August 6, 2018

              @Al. I don’t usually.

            • The rude words are still there.

            • Pickled Possum

               /  August 6, 2018

              Really!!!! See what happens when you use bad talk.
              The rude words get etched in your mind.
              It’s alright Miss, the rude words have gone away now.

              @Al ???? wrestle pig … and get some lipstick???? 😎

              Women can do whatever they want within the law
              So suck it up cry babies!!

  10. sorethumb

     /  August 6, 2018

    The Greens have always got a freepass

    Consider the following Parliamentary speech from the Green List MP, Catherine Delahunty. Responding to criticism of legislation establishing Crown/Tainui “co-management” over the Waikato River, Delahunty declared:

    I was not going to take a call on the Waikato-Tainui Raupatu Claims (Waikato River) Settlement Bill, but sometimes the rhetoric around one is overwhelming. I am very excited that we are moving into a more sophisticated era under Te Tiriti o Waitangi, and we are moving beyond the limited concept of conservative Pakeha that one man, one vote is the only manifestation of democracy possible in Aotearoa. I stand as a Pakeha, proud to live with Te Tiriti o Waitangi as our founding document, and absolutely committed to finding new ways through the colonisation effects of the past. Only people who do not understand what colonisation means would say that this is not a step forward, and that the co-management that is being proposed is not an incredibly positive model for Pakeha, for tangata Tiriti, for tauiwi katoa as well as for Maori.

    Had an Act MP publicly suggested that his party was moving beyond the “limited concept” that “one man, one vote is the only manifestation of democracy possible in Aotearoa” it would have been headline news. Act – unlike the Greens – is taken seriously by journalists, and so are the statements of its representatives.

    http://bowalleyroad.blogspot.com/2010/05/taking-greens-seriously.html

  11. Geoffrey

     /  August 6, 2018

    The glee with which many of the commentators above have indulged in repetitive use of the word that sparked this discussion, plus many more that are equally socially offensive, says it all really. It is rather as though they have seized an opportunity to be naughty knowing that there will be no comeuppance.

    In direct response to Kitty… just because a word has been coined does not justify its free appropriation as means to insult, shock or demean another. Having said that, there are many obvious circumstances where recourse to an expletive to reinforce a point or to demonstrate strong feeling is appropriate. And that, I believe is the nub of the matter: appropriateness.

    The individual (I use that word to avoid the son in person and man in human) who started this discussion sought to shock and was being naughty. Mayhap they will find that their silly provocation will attract the painful censuring that such unseemly behaviour from an MP deserves.

  12. Geoffrey Monks

     /  August 6, 2018

    Hubeing perhaps..

    • Hupersonbeing ? 😀 A member of hupersonkind.

    • Have you read the very funny Politically Correct Bedtime Stories ? Modern retellings of old stories made PC….and absurd.

      • Geoffrey Monks

         /  August 6, 2018

        No but looking at some of the twaddle that the forefront of correctness drops on us, do I need to?

        • Kitty Catkin

           /  August 6, 2018

          I would, honestly. They are a cruelly funny send-up of PCness. Girl becomes something like prewomyn 😀

  13. Geoffrey Monks

     /  August 6, 2018

    Sold

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