Open Forum – Sunday

26 August 2018

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53 Comments

  1. Blazer

     /  August 26, 2018

    this ones for Trav…hows the cheek of Hansen..

    https://www.nzherald.co.nz/sport/news/article.cfm?c_id=4&objectid=12113673

  2. David

     /  August 26, 2018

    Damian Grant makes a contribution to the prison debate and one from personal experience its also one English,s research concluded and one we all pretty much know but one that Davis and Little wont go near. Shame really because their cowardice condems them to be ineffectual while probably putting the community at risk and not changing lives for the better.

    https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/crime/106531509/a04–damien-grant–

    • NOEL

       /  August 26, 2018

      Wondered where it going until I got to Family First and Lindsay Mitchell.
      Their research has found wanting msny times.
      I can understand it been attractive to David.
      https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/80508306/lobby-group-family-first-blames-unmarried-couples-for-child-poverty

      • David

         /  August 26, 2018

        Hows that Noel, I doubt I would agree with much family first have to say but wouldnt know as have no interest in them really. With a name like Noel I would imagine you have more in common with them as I would guess you are 70 plus, Lindsay Mitchell does some pretty good research.
        If 79% of a cohort are born in a non stable/traditional home environment and 50% of the prison population belong to that cohort it would be a bit dumb to ignore that as a factor. The problem with dismissing evidence because it doesnt suit your political beliefs condems you to not n=being able to find a solution.

  3. David

     /  August 26, 2018

    https://www.stuff.co.nz/the-press/news/106565614/Gunpoint-demand-to-hand-over-car

    Now this guy is on bail and will probably get home detention, its hard to say we lock too many people up.

    • Kitty Catkin

       /  August 26, 2018

      ‘HD’ is cheaper, so is good from that point of view. I also think that it could be deadly dull, worse than prison for some people !

      • Gezza

         /  August 26, 2018

        Some of them spice up the dullness by going places they’re not supposed to, at times they’re not allowed to, or by removing their ankle bracelets. I’ve read about some doing this from time to time. Then they get visited by nga pirihimana & hauled off to te Kooti & Te
        Kaiwhakawā remands them in custody. And then someone complains about them being remanded in custody. So … I dunno. What d’ya do?

        • Kitty Catkin

           /  August 26, 2018

          I dunno, either. Most probably don’t.

          As someone said, the ankle bracelets can’t be indestructible. Even if they were titanium, people would find a way.

          A girl in the Waikato was astonished to be visited with a ‘please explain’ when she hadn’t left the place….she’d been in a spa pool, with her ankle out of the water, but the spa pool did something that made it seem as if she wasn’t at the house.

          Microchipping ? But that could be cut out.

  4. lurcher1948

     /  August 26, 2018

    • Corky

       /  August 26, 2018

      GUILTY OF BETRAYAL AND SAVING THEIR OWN SKINS. DRAIN THAT SWAMP. SOMEONE NEEDS TO TELL THE AMUSED LADY SHE IS NOW SURPLUS TO REQUIREMENTS.

    • David

       /  August 26, 2018

      The Trump haters crack me up, Trump should be impeached for funneling money through his lawyer to effect the outcome of the election. Hilary and the DNC funneled 4.5 million through their law firm to pay Christopher Steele and Fusion GPS and Russian spies for an unverified dossier used to spy on the Trump campaign and discredit her opponent…that apparently is fine but what is the difference except Trump has probably been paying off porn stars for years and years.

      • Joe Bloggs

         /  August 26, 2018

        You need to find a new playbook. The old one’s worn out.

  5. lurcher1948

     /  August 26, 2018

    • Corky

       /  August 26, 2018

      BUT BEST OF ALL HILLS…IMAGINE WHAT THIS IS DOING TO HIS SUPPORT BASE.😎

  6. Gezza

     /  August 26, 2018

    Motueka community concerned about public display of gang patches
    Tim Newman 05:00, Aug 19 2018

    The Mongrel Mob Barbarians have set up shop in the top of the South Island for the first time – police reckon they are chasing the premium price methamphetamine sales gets there. But the small town of Motueka is banding together to stop the rise of gangs. First step is banning the patches, but there are meetings to come, figuring out what else should be done.

    The Mongrel Mob Barbarians was a chapter from the North Island’s East Coast, which is migrating south. ​

    Until recently, the area has remained relatively untouched by this gang,Tasman Police Detective Paul Borrell said. He believed the higher price for methamphetamine in the area had made it an attractive place for gangs to set up shop. “It could be driven by a lack of supply, or for some reason people are prepared to pay more. But from a criminal perspective, there’s more money to be made, it’s about $200 dearer on average than in other places,” Borrell said.

    During July, there were numerous sightings of people wearing Mongrel Mob insignia on High St in Motueka. “The unusual aspect with these guys is they’re on motorcycles … they’re quite visual, you see them around in their patches which is quite unusual, quite new to Nelson.”
    There were about five members in total along with some “hangers-on”, he said.

    But seeing patched members in the community raised alarm for the locals, so the community was fighting back. Richmond Police Senior Sergeant Mike Wardle said during the past few weeks, the incidences of people wearing gang patches in public had dropped off in Motueka – because businesses were banning the patch. “The community decided they didn’t like it, and started telling people if they come into their shops they can’t wear their gang patch … that seems to have stopped it,” Wardle said.


    Motueka Community Board chairman Brent Maru received about 20 concerned messages in the past month.

    The board was working with council and police to monitor the situation, although Maru had not heard anything about sightings in the past two or three weeks – which he said was “fantastic”. He credited a community-wide approach for turnaround.

    “It is a community issue; it’s not a police issue, it’s not a council issue,” he said. “It’s a collective responsibility.” The biggest issue for Maru was gang patches being worn in public.
    “In a town where I have a family, do I want to walk down town and see patched gang members? Absolutely not. “If I walk down town and don’t see patched members, are there still other people out there engaged in illegal activities? Absolutely – I just don’t know and they don’t stand out.”

    Tasman District Councillor Paul Hawkes had seen patched gang members walking around on more than one occasion.

    Tasman district councillor Paul Hawkes.

    “To me it’s a matter of perception, it’s intimidation. If they weren’t wearing their insignia, I doubt there would even be an issue. “That incites people to to get their heckles up right from the word go and feel intimidated.”

    Hawkes was open to meeting with the people in question, to clear up what their ambitions in Motueka were. “That would shut down any of the speculation and rumours. “Their intentions may be honourable, but with past experiences of gangs in other places there is always that criminal element.”

    Hawkes said while the situation needed to be addressed, it was taking the focus away from a more pressing issue. “Motueka is very rife with drugs at the moment, I’d rather take the focus away from gangs and put the focus on getting Motueka drug-free.

    “They’re the issue in Motueka, they’re the issue in New Zealand end of story. “If you could come up with a magic bullet where you can eliminate the drug scene, then you’ll eliminate most of the criminal activity.”
    More …
    https://www.stuff.co.nz/nelson-mail/news/106308880/motueka-community-concerned-about-public-display-of-gang-patches?rm=m
    ……………………………………………………………………

    Motueka’s ‘picked on’ Mobsters pack up and move out of town
    Tim Newman 11:28, Aug 25 2018

    Patched Mongrel Mob members seen in Motueka last month are not currently in the town, and business opposition helped to deter them, police say.

    Richmond station Acting Senior Sergeant Mike Wardle told the Motueka Community Board meeting on Tuesday Mob members had packed up and left, and had most recently been living in Nelson city. He said there had been no recent sightings of patched members, which he credited to Motueka businesses taking the initiative to not allow gang patches on their premises.

    “It’s offensive, but it’s not an offence. And one of the best ways of dealing with that, which I think the community did, was to say, ‘If you wear your gang patch, I’m going to trespass you from coming in here’.” Wardle said the situation had reached the point where the gang members came to the police, saying they felt they were being “picked on”.


    The Mongrel Mob have been around for nearly 60 years, with chapters all around New Zealand and even Australia.

    More …
    https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/106530603/motuekas-picked-on-mobsters-pack-up-and-move-out-of-town

    • Corky

       /  August 26, 2018

      They’ll be back. A tactical retreat until they consider their options. Maybe they could do drug runs from Nelson to service the wider area. However, they have a problem..white gangs. There are some pubs in this area, and down the West Coast, that make it quite clear Maoris aren’t welcome. So the Mob have a problem. South Auckland this area ain’t.

      • Gezza

         /  August 26, 2018

        Which pubs?

        • lurcher1948

           /  August 26, 2018

          The ones in his mind

        • Corky

           /  August 26, 2018

          I wouldn’t have a clue. My bros told me about it. It’s not the pub per se, just the regulars. What I was told is they approach and say they don’t want trouble…but could you please finish your drink and leave. Yes, I was told they said ‘please.’ However, the people who told me this are real scrappers, they knew these folk were serious. They left.

          I also read of a similar incident a while back from an Islander guy who was politely asked to finish his drink and leave.

          Nothing that wouldn’t happen to ‘whitey’ in certain South Auckland pubs. The only difference is they don’t say please.

          • Gezza

             /  August 26, 2018

            Ok, lets work this through a bit. You said:

            There are some pubs in this area, and down the West Coast, that make it quite clear Maoris aren’t welcome

            So, were they doing a pub crawl? How many pubs had they been to, & what sort of state were they in, by then?

            What were your bros wearing? Did they have patches?

          • Corky

             /  August 26, 2018

            Look, I know little about it. It was just a passing conversation the bros recounted. They were laughing at the use of the word ‘please’. I took it they were talking about Nelson or Westport. That’s the areas they were in. The conversation was sparked by a newsclip showing a news crew getting abused while trying to film in an South Auckland public bar.

            I do remember ribbing them and saying it’s not like them to turn down a fight. They said ‘you try taking on the whole #^&*%$@ pub.

            • Gezza

               /  August 26, 2018

              So it might just be one pub, and you don’t know what they might have done or said before they got that request?

            • Corky

               /  August 26, 2018

              Correct. I wouldn’t have remembered the conversation if I hadn’t read about the Island guy having a similar problem. Of course that was nearly 15 years ago. Things may have changed, but I doubt it. You may remember the warm reception the Mob got down Pete’s way.
              If you think about, Motueka used a similar ”white out” strategy to get rid of undesirable ‘darkies.’😄

      • Gezza

         /  August 26, 2018

        What struck me as interesting was this:
        [Tasman district councillor Paul – the white liberal guy] Hawkes was open to meeting with the people in question, to clear up what their ambitions in Motueka were. “That would shut down any of the speculation and rumours. “Their intentions may be honourable, but with past experiences of gangs in other places there is always that criminal element.”
        Dreaming.

        Motueka Community Board chairman Brent Maru knew the score:
        “It is a community issue; it’s not a police issue, it’s not a council issue,” he said. “It’s a collective responsibility. The biggest issue for Maru was gang patches being worn in public.
        “In a town where I have a family, do I want to walk down town and see patched gang members? Absolutely not.”
        Onya bro.

        • Corky

           /  August 26, 2018

          Good to see a bro ready to take on a bro.

          • Gezza

             /  August 26, 2018

            No that’s a straight up Maori bloke who might be a bro but he’s also a mate who’s no fool & he’s ready to take on the Mobstas.

        • Kitty Catkin

           /  August 26, 2018

          I don’t think that he was dreaming at all. I saw it as saying innocent until proved guilty; give people the benefit of the doubt, but he was aware that the criminal element was likely to be there, given that these are gang members. If they can show that it’s not, good.

          A gang member sans patch is still a gang member, of course.

          Motueka isn’t getting rid of people based on skin colour, just not wanting gangs with patches in the town centre.

  7. lurcher1948

     /  August 26, 2018

  8. Patzcuaro

     /  August 26, 2018

    “What became more clear this week is that Trump’s campaign was aided by many more surreptitious acts violating federal law than we realized – and that Trump himself is now clearly implicated in aiding at least on.”

    https://www.nzherald.co.nz/world/news/article.cfm?c_id=2&objectid=12113714

    • David

       /  August 26, 2018

      Trump paying off a porn star would have made zero difference if known, no one voted for Trump because he is a moral character, he has been shagging porn stars etc for decades.
      The Democrats were warned they were attempts at hacking their server as were the Republicans and the difference was the Republicans took steps and Podesta had his password as password.
      There is no evidence of any collusion between Trump and Russian hackers. Typical piece of crap writing from the highly partisan washington post. Hilary was a terrible candidate, she never campaigned in key states and she was widely seen as a courrupt low energy liar except by the coastal media.

  9. Corky

     /  August 26, 2018

    Nutjob or honest Christian? And does this show how closely Islam and Christianity are related should Christians live their faith as do Muslims? Personally, as repugnant as this chap is, I reckon he’s way more ethical than those Christian ministers who don’t believe in life after death or the Resurrection. If you don’t believe, leave the church and find someone else to pay your living expenses…get a job.

    It’s also interesting to note I recently talked about security around the White House. I stated a protester holding an offensive placard starting with Tick Toc would be fully investigated by the Secret Service. I was told I was wrong – the protester was breaking no laws. The pastor in this video was paid a visit by the Secret Service for praying that Obama would be assassinated. Praying as far as I know is also not against the law..nor was he praying out side the White House as far as I know.

    • Kitty Catkin

       /  August 26, 2018

      The protestors were not making death threats. That’s the difference.

      • Corky

         /  August 26, 2018

        Tick Tock is usually associated with a clock, or timing device..attached to a bomb. No matter what the protester was thinking, or had written on his placard, the Secret Service would have investigated him.

        Also this pastor was not making death threats.

        • Kitty Catkin

           /  August 26, 2018

          If you say so. I can’t be bothered having this pointless discussion. If you think that the Secret Service has nothing better to do than investigate every one of the millions of Trump protestors, no amount of reason will convince you that they haven’t or that people are not investigated when they are acting lawfully. Have it your own way, though.

          The protestors were women.

        • Gezza

           /  August 26, 2018

          OK, so, firstly tick tock is associated with a clock – they symbolism is that his time is nearly up to be impeached. Not a bomb. So the female protester is simply using offensive language to tell Trump he’s going down – not up, in smoke.

          (Only a retarded bomb-maker would use a ticking type clock nowadays anyway.)

          The other problem with this pastor is that presumably some members of his congregation may be as deluded as he is and thus he may prompt one or more of them to start killing gays because he argues Jaweh tells them to do this. Similarly, publicly praying for Obama to be assassinated might also inspire some fruit loop in his congregation to go and do it thinking they are doing God’s work.

          So it’s not surprising the man was paid a visit by the Secret Service. What’s more surprising is that he’s still at large – if he is still at large and not under guard in some secure psychiatric facility by now – which is where he probably should be.

          Personally, as repugnant as this chap is, I reckon he’s way more ethical than those Christian ministers who don’t believe in life after death or the Resurrection. If you don’t believe, leave the church and find someone else to pay your living expenses…get a job.
          Whatever. What does it matter how much or how little of this whole load of Bible nonsense some fools believe? If some mug is prepared to pay someone to be their pastor, that’s their choice. If they don’t like it, they can leave the congregation or kick the beggar out.

          • Corky

             /  August 26, 2018

            Just a couple of points, I could do more but I have a vampire movie to watch:

            ”OK, so, firstly tick tock is associated with a clock – the symbolism is that his time is nearly up to be impeached. Not a bomb.”

            Correct. However, that’s a chance the Secret Service can’t take. From what I have read cameras around the White House constantly use facial recognition to
            scan for suspect people. Anything out of the ordinary is always investigated as the pastor found out. That placard would be a red flag in my opinion.

            ”(Only a retarded bomb-maker would use a ticking type clock nowadays anyway.)”

            Correct again. But who knows. The Secret Service don’t? Mercury switches and clocks and a tin of swelling lentils still make effective triggers.

            ”So the female protester is simply using offensive language to tell Trump he’s going down.”

            Who is this female protester you speak of? Do you mean the person who looks like a balding man?

            OK …one more before the fangs come out.

            ”Whatever. What does it matter how much or how little of this whole load of Bible nonsense some fools believe?”

            It matters because that giggling congregation laughing at exterminating gays probably hold important jobs in the community. Add to that Muslims immigration, and you might just get the feeling your scientific reasoning is losing ground to irrationalism as some commentators believe.

            • Gezza

               /  August 26, 2018

              Correct. However, that’s a chance the Secret Service can’t take. From what I have read cameras around the White House constantly use facial recognition to scan for suspect people.
              These days they could just check in with Mueller if they want to find suspect people around the White House.

              Anything out of the ordinary is always investigated as the pastor found out. That placard would be a red flag in my opinion.
              Actually I see it’s not a female – at least I hope not. He’s balding. And he’s got the placard facing the wrong way round – so if they can even see the tosser they are probably just wondering why he’s holding up a blank sign and thinking he’s probably just intellectually sub-optimal.

              “(Only a retarded bomb-maker would use a ticking type clock nowadays anyway.)”
              Correct again. But who knows. The Secret Service don’t? Mercury switches and clocks and a tin of swelling lentils still make effective triggers.

              Does he look like he had a tin of swelling lentils on him? Maybe IN him. I think he’s so far away they wouldn’t even bother looking at him, tbh. In any case, obviously a person waving a blank sign at them is not likely to be much of a threat.

              ”So the female protester is simply using offensive language to tell Trump he’s going down.” Who is this female protester you speak of? Do you mean the person who looks like a balding man?
              Kitty unintentionally put me crook there. You can have a win on this one.

            • Corky

               /  August 27, 2018

              ”Kitty unintentionally put me crook there. You can have a win on this one.”

              I was more interested in seeing what I may have missed.

            • Gezza

               /  August 27, 2018

              Oh, ok. Did you notice the sign was facing backwards?

  10. Corky

     /  August 26, 2018

    I see the Mayor of London has a new puppy. But he’s a Muslim..what’sup? Taqiya and misdirection?

    If these articles are correct, the ignorance shown by some members of the Muslim community is astounding. Worse, it’s a window into a third world mentality that wants to impose itself on a first world Western nation.

    https://www.animalsinislam.com/islam-animal-rights/dogs/

    https://www.thoughtco.com/dogs-in-islam-2004392

    • Kitty Catkin

       /  August 26, 2018

      Animals have never been mistreated in the UK before, of course. They may have to set up animal shelters (Battersea would be a good place) and have an organisation to prevent animal cruelty. SPCA (Society for Prevention of Cruelty to Animals) would be a good name for this.

  11. Corky

     /  August 26, 2018

    Oh, Boy. This is how it’s done. Look into the eyes of this guy.

    • Kitty Catkin

       /  August 26, 2018

      Isn’t he the nutty extremist who has been widely condemned for hate speech and incitement and is now in prison ?

      • Gezza

         /  August 26, 2018

        No. I don’t think so. He’s an Egyptian cleric. I haven’t found anything with a google search suggesting he’s been locked up.

        • Kitty Catkin

           /  August 27, 2018

          Someone called that has, it may be someone else with the same name.

          We don’t know, of course, that he really was saying that. Only someone who knows the language would know. It sounded a bit contrived.

  12. lurcher1948

     /  August 26, 2018

    A real man has died and an orange coward,who suffered(BONE SPURS) the coward POTUS 45 who NEVER SERVED due to a lack of a back bone abused him due to McCains Vietnam war service, RIP hero.., trump will pass soon and the world will cheer
    .https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2015/jul/18/donald-trump-john-mccain-vietnam-iowa-republicans

    • Kitty Catkin

       /  August 26, 2018

      3 showed TOMOTUS (orange man of…..) saying that about how McCain wasn’t a hero because he was captured.

      I knew that TOMOTUS couldn’t go because he had sore feet. Having no backbone would have been a handicap, too, and I wonder why he hasn’t mentioned that disability. No heart, either, and no guts, No wonder he couldn’t go.