Open Forum – Friday

14 September 2018

Forum

This post is open to anyone to comment on any topic that isn’t spam, illegal or offensive. All Your NZ posts are open but this one is for you to raise topics that interest you. 

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20 Comments

  1. Reply
    • Corky

       /  September 14, 2018

      ”Walking backwards into the future.”

      I really despair for this country and our future. The only reason to look backwards is for prosperity or revisiting past mistakes to ensure they aren’t repeated. Forging a path into the future demands a constant supply of fresh energy..not stale energy locked for eternity in an unchanging mold.

      Reply
  2. Corky

     /  September 14, 2018

    White snowflake told how idiotic she is by a bro.

    ” Statistically, I am more likely to be shot by another black male than anyone else.”

    She didn’t know how to handle that. The disbelief is palpable. The black guy continued to make many pertinent points.

    Reply
  3. lurcher1948

     /  September 14, 2018

    ROLL UP ROLL UP, Andrew Dickens is running a lets rip labor to bits show, give him a phone call,NZME will love you

    Reply
    • Gezza

       /  September 14, 2018

      What time were you on destroying their bs Lurchy? I’ll see if can find it. Do they post clips of their hosts’ sessions like RNZ?

      Reply
  4. Mefrostate

     /  September 14, 2018

    Some questions I’ve been pondering/discussing with friends:

    a) On a scale of 0 to 10, how much of a meritocracy is New Zealand? (alternatively: Which is the most meritocratic country in the world, and why?)

    b) What are the top 3 policy changes that New Zealand could make that would make it most meritocratic?

    Keen to hear what people in here think.

    Reply
    • High Flying Duck

       /  September 14, 2018

      Would we want to live in a Meritocracy? Who decides the “merit”?
      Meritocracy is the enemy of Democracy, which is far from perfect but probably a better system over all.

      This Guardian writer is not a fan:

      https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2017/mar/20/meritocracy-inequality-theresa-may-donald-trump

      Reply
      • Mefrostate

         /  September 14, 2018

        I don’t think this writer is actually opposed to the concept of meritocracy. I think they’re opposed to the way in which meritocracy is deployed as a political device in order to preserve privilege (by-definition this is anti-meritocratic).

        “Who decides the ‘merit’?” I’m with Alan in it being best decided by society as a whole, through markets, clients, customers and voters.

        “Would we want to live in a Meritocracy?” I say yes, because then those at the top would have truly got there through their own talent and effort, and by maximising the production of value, even those at the bottom will quickly become better off.

        Reply
    • Alan Wilkinson

       /  September 14, 2018

      Merit is best judged by clients and customers but not all merit can be assessed that way. That leaves a need for arbitrary weighting and scaling of different measures so only subjective ranks can be produced.

      Reply
      • Mefrostate

         /  September 14, 2018

        I broadly agree, although perhaps there’s some overlap there between the concepts of merit and value.

        I’m more interested in a broad sense of merit whereby an individual’s overall success in life is determined, to the greatest extent possible, by their own efforts rather than by luck, privilege or power.

        Reply
        • Alan Wilkinson

           /  September 14, 2018

          Which country do successful people want to emigrate to and unsuccessful want to leave?

          Reply
          • Mefrostate

             /  September 14, 2018

            Make your point..

            Reply
            • Alan Wilkinson

               /  September 14, 2018

              It was a genuine question to which I don’t have an answer. When Aus booms NZ could qualify as unskilled NZers cross the ditch but generally the unsuccessful either can’t or don’t want to leave the countries to which successful aspire. That suggests those that reward merit are also fairly generous to those who lack it.

            • Mefrostate

               /  September 14, 2018

              I’m not sure that skilled migration patterns are a meaningful measure of meritocracy. NZers moving to Aus are often just chasing the spoils of a mining boom; that doesn’t mean that Aus is more meritocratic. Actually the opposite: mineral wealth is hardly generated by individual merit.

            • Alan Wilkinson

               /  September 15, 2018

              That was actually my point. The unskilled should be motivated to flow from a more merit oriented economy to a lesser one while the skilled should flow in the opposite direction.

            • Gezza

               /  September 15, 2018

              The problem with a meritocracy “whereby an individual’s overall success in life is determined, to the greatest extent possible, by their own efforts rather than by luck, privilege or power” is that there is a large spread of:

              1.) abilities, across the whole board of factors that code for success in any given society
              2) effort that people will put into achieving success
              3) determining what success means to different people.

              For example, I now only want to put in the minimum of effort to succeed at being content & happy and not knowingly hurting anyone who doesn’t need to be hurt.

              And even those things can vary over time. In my working life and prior to my wife’s death I put massive amounts of effort into achieving success – which amounted to working my way up to earning the highest income I could get in my field of employment, so as to own my home outright and get as much financial security as possible, because the need for such security is such a strong component of my personality.

  5. robertguyton

     /  September 14, 2018

    Calling a spade a spade (with special mention of PDB! Famous!)

    https://www.neighbourly.co.nz/e-edition/nz-gardener/33945

    Reply
  6. High Flying Duck

     /  September 14, 2018

    Tax payers dollars at work. If it isn’t committees and working groups is fine dining at “forums” and “Summits”. Hipkins trakes Little’s $1.5m and doubles down!

    “The Government spent more than $3 million for two education summits in May.

    Education Minister Chris Hipkins revealed the cost today of two two-day summits in May – one in Auckland and one in Christchurch.

    Hipkins released a Cabinet paper reporting back on the “conversation” with New Zealanders about making the education system fit for the future and for the needs of all.”

    https://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=12125217

    Reply

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