US drone strikes in Somalia

So the US military is active Somalia still. They have been there a while.

From Gezza:

The reality:
https://www.aljazeera.com/indepth/opinion/trump-decree-killing-innocent-civilians-somalia-180114091717319.html
Trump’s new relaxed rules of engagement are killing civilians and breeding the next generation of anti-US fighters.

https://www.aljazeera.com/news/2018/11/hidden-toll-american-drones-yemen-civilian-deaths-181114081521898.html
Investigation by the Associated Press finds that more than 30 killed in drone attacks in 2018 were not al-Qaeda members.

https://www.aljazeera.com/news/2018/03/trump-deadly-drone-policy-ngos-180307204617166.html
US drone attacks in Iraq and Syria shot up 50 percent while civilian deaths rose 215 percent from 2016 to 2017.

https://www.aljazeera.com/mritems/imagecache/mbdxxlarge/mritems/Images/2014/2/12/20142121043484734_20.jpg
https://www.aljazeera.com/indepth/features/2014/02/risk-reporting-us-drone-strikes-2014212103345230764.html
Yemen researcher says he received a death threat after investigating deadly wedding-convoy attack.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Civilian_casualties_from_U.S._drone_strikes

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13 Comments

  1. Corky

     /  November 21, 2018

    The comment section makes for interesting reading.

    Reply
    • Gezza

       /  November 21, 2018

      😳

      So far yours is the only comment here? And it’s not very interesting. o_O

      Reply
  2. Conspiratoor

     /  November 21, 2018

    The reality. Really? That ‘next generation of anti-US fighters’ must be somwhere else wooping it up with their allottment of virgins

    https://www.pri.org/stories/2015-08-12/mogadishu-used-be-hell-now-its-coming-back-life

    Reply
    • Gezza

       /  November 21, 2018

      A lot of them will be very disappointed to discover:
      1. A lot of those virgins are blokes who blew themselves up because they couldn’t get a sheila
      2. They’re no use to the females they do find in Paradise because after blowing themselves to bits they can’t now find their wotsits.

      Reply
  3. Corky

     /  November 21, 2018

    Let’s hope our drones have those goodies under their wings. Just the thing to change the mind of an errant Korean fishing boat who refuses to leave our EEZ.

    Reply
  4. James

     /  November 21, 2018

    Very powerful and popular among American strategists (but also increasingly Australia, who’s is somewhat worrying) is the doctrine of Air Power. John Boyd (google him) was an early exponent of this doctrine, who theorised that using the OODA loop (also called Boyd cycle) with a combination of bombing key targets from the air would be a way to defeat an enemy without risking ground troops.

    Using air power (drones, cruise missiles, bombers and fighters) to kill leadership in particular, has been very popular more amongst Democrat presidents in the last 30 years than republicans – witness Clinton using cruise missiles to try and disrupt Al Qaeda and Obama’s massive use of drones all around the world. It’s a way that they think they can kill an enemy without risking US troops’ lives (no one wants a repeat of the criticism George W. Bush had).

    But the results speak for themselves. Ie, air power is clearly a very poor way, if not a completely counter-productive way, of killing an enemy. Only ground troops, especially highly trained and lethal infantry, supported by armour, artillery and air power, can seize and hold ground and defeat an enemy in that way. The French Intervention in Mali should be the template for how to defeat an Islamist regime in an African country.

    Reply
    • Griff.

       /  November 21, 2018

      Only ground troops, especially highly trained and lethal infantry, supported by armour, artillery and air power, can seize and hold ground and defeat an enemy in that way

      yip worked so well in .
      Korea
      Vietnam
      Afghanistan
      Iraq
      Oh wait
      Korea still at war.
      Vietnam lost.
      Afghanistan and Iraq years of occupation at huge cost and no end in sight.
      As soon as the USA leaves both will collapse into bigger cluster f’s than ever before.
      War what is it good for ?

      Reply
  5. James

     /  November 21, 2018

    Griff – you miss my point. Ground intervention in Mali, by the French only a few years ago, has worked extremely well.

    For your other shallow points – the UN ground forces intervention in Korea saved what is now South Korea. The communists had taken 90% of the south, and were pushed back almost to China before they intervened. The result was the status quo ante bellum – which was the UN aim, so success there.

    Regarding Vietnam, that actually reinforces my point – McNamara and various US presidents turned to air power to defeat the north, with predicatable results. Air power is a very flawed doctrine, and citing Vietnam backs up my argument, not your anti-war sentiment.

    Afghanistan and Iraq – my point can be extended to say that had the US followed the French example in Mali, these two theatres would be in a much better place. Ie, get in, kick butt, get out with the promise to come back in again and kick butt if Islamists come to power.

    So what is war good for – when well executed, it can be a successful extension of political aims, such as the defeat of the Nazi and Japanese empires. Or should we try and defeat ISIS with hugs and kindness like the NZ Greens want to?

    Reply
    • Gezza

       /  November 21, 2018

      Afghanistan and Iraq – my point can be extended to say that had the US followed the French example in Mali, these two theatres would be in a much better place. Ie, get in, kick butt, get out with the promise to come back in again and kick butt if Islamists come to power.

      This is actually not possible with these countries. They would have to flood the entire country with soldaten and keep them there. US troops would keep coming home in body bags & that would be the end of it. The combination of Islam, Arab, and other local cultures would ensure that any and every opportunity would be forever taken by people unafraid to die in the cause of seeking retributive vengeance and jihad against infidel invaders and unbelievers is too pervasive.

      This would inevitably cause many My Lai massacres (there were dozens of these in Vietnam, nobody talks about this but it is now well-established). Further adding – in the days of cellcams to US public insistence on pulling the troops out. They only can hide collateral damage & massacres for so long. It amazes me how Russia gets away with it – but the US can’t.

      Reply
      • Alan Wilkinson

         /  November 21, 2018

        Trade is a better political weapon than war. It wins hearts and minds rather than alienating them. However when the opponent physically attacks, you have to respond with force but it must be judicious. The Brits and Frogs understand that but the Yanks didn’t. Maybe they are learning.

        Reply
    • Griff.

       /  November 21, 2018

      Or should we try and defeat ISIS with hugs and kindness
      No we should isolate them as was done with Korea.
      The rise of Isis was a result on the attacks on the last group the Taliban and before that the militia the USA armed against Russia.The poplar western view of insurgent’s we fight against in the middle east ignores that such groups are a large percentage of the local population.
      Keep out and let them sink into festering tribal stone age culture if they want .
      Don’t bomb them into it and certainly dont occupy their land .
      And before we get 9/11.
      An attack financed and run by ‎Saudi’s does not give you just reason to invade other country’s .

      Reply
  6. High Flying Duck

     /  November 21, 2018

    The important thing to note here is that the PDT will be bereft on this post.
    How will we know who’s posts are good and who’s are not? HOW?

    Reply

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