“Either we build (finish) the Wall or we close the Border……”

This should really sort out trade and migration issues.

One could wonder whether international trade agreements mean anything with Trump as President (it doesn’t sound like he is in charge).

New Zealand may have dodged a bullet with Trump pulling the US out of the Trans-Pacific Partnership – I doubt that Trump has any idea about the concept of ‘partnership. or ‘agreement’.

 

78 Comments

  1. lurcher1948

     /  December 29, 2018

    Yes cutting off aid money is going to stop people coming,Trumps an economic genius,as you know one of his MANY failures was a casino….how can you bankrupt a money making machine, Trump the smartest brightest president the worlds ever seen and did i mention he knows all about treaties,MAGA

    • adamsmith1922

       /  December 29, 2018

      He is a despicable thing, masquerading as a human being, and totally unfit to even be a dog catcher – as that incoherent, false and deranged twitter rant above aptly demonstartes

      • kluelis

         /  December 29, 2018

        @adamsmith1922 Dog rangers do a great job you know.

      • Alan Wilkinson

         /  December 29, 2018

        As rants go, yours outdoes his by a wide margin. Funny you don’t see that.

        • adamsmith1922

           /  December 29, 2018

          Alan, your view, so be it. We will have to disagree.

  2. NOEL

     /  December 29, 2018

    He’s not completely inept. Gets a royality on every MAGA cap.

  3. lurcher1948

     /  December 29, 2018

    MAGA cap, making some Chinese sweat shop owner rich

  4. David

     /  December 29, 2018

    In 2013 every Dem voted for a wall, just saying.

    • Duker

       /  December 29, 2018

      Just stoopid, you mean. Gets some facts or get lost.
      “The Secure Fence Act of 2006, which was passed by a Republican Congress and signed by President George W. Bush, authorized about 700 miles of fencing along certain stretches of land between the border of the United States and Mexico.”
      https://www.politifact.com/truth-o-meter/statements/2017/apr/23/mick-mulvaney/fact-check-did-top-democrats-vote-border-wall-2006/

      Secure Fence Act Does that sound like Trumps Wall?

      • Alan Wilkinson

         /  December 29, 2018

        The present confrontation is just stupid politics you mean. Democrats don’t want to give Trump a wall and a win, that’s all.

        • Griff.

           /  December 29, 2018

          Ummm alan
          Fake news .
          The House, Senate and the presidency is still Republican at this time.

          • Alan Wilkinson

             /  December 29, 2018

            The Senate requires a majority the Republicans don’t have to pass the legislation. Do you think they should abolish the filibuster rules?

            • Griff.

               /  December 29, 2018

              The budget goes to both houses. It goes to the Senate with a special rule: it can pass with a majority and cannot be filibustered. Other legislation can be filibustered and requires 60 votes to end the filibuster.
              Reconciliation (United States Congress) – Wikipedia
              https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Reconciliation_(United_States_Congress)

            • Alan Wilkinson

               /  December 29, 2018

              My understanding is that the present Bill is subject to the filibuster. The Reconciliation rules are restrictive.

            • Duker

               /  December 29, 2018

              Budget bills have to start in House After next week when Democrats control house they arent going to allow the Republicans any moves on reconciliation ( what happened when GOP controlled both sides administratively to pass the Tax Cuts, then did it by moves that avoid filibuster)
              As there has been an election, it gets very tricky next year about legislation that has been voted on but not passed by both houses in same version. My assumption is that those bills ‘die’

            • Alan Wilkinson

               /  December 29, 2018

              Yes, the present Bill from the House which the Senate Republicans don’t have yhr 60 votes to pass will die when the new House takes over on 20 January I think. Then the Democrats will send up a new Bill that the Senate Republicans will modify and send back and the fight will go on until someone caves or the courts intervene somehow.

            • Duker

               /  December 29, 2018

              What has shut down some of the government is lack of a ‘continuing resolution’ from both houses signed by Trump.
              some departments have funding passed earlier this month
              https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Continuing_resolution

              The Senate passed a seven-week CR that runs through Feb. 8, 2019, the night of Dec. 19. The House passed an amended version of the bill, which included more than $5 billion for border wall construction, on Thursday, Dec. 20, by a vote of 217-185. The president has said he would not sign the measure without the border wall funds, but the measure is not expected to pass the Senate as amended by the House.

              Appropriations Watch FY2019
              http://www.crfb.org/blogs/appropriations-watch-fy-2019

        • Gezza

           /  December 29, 2018

          Democrats don’t want to give Trump a wall and a win, that’s all.
          Democrats don’t want to give Trump anything.

          Like the Republicans stymied Obama wherever they could, once they could.

          Only, with the Democrats, they know saying “No” to everything makes go full Twitter Tantrum, and over time they’ll be calculating folk will get sick of it & he’ll make lots of screw ups they can use at the next Presidential election.

          I don’t think it’s petulance on their part, Alan. I think it’s strategy.

          • Gezza

             /  December 29, 2018

            *makes Trump go

          • Alan Wilkinson

             /  December 29, 2018

            Of course it is strategy but it is stupid politics that harms the country.

            • Gezza

               /  December 29, 2018

              Trump is the epitome of someone playing stupid politics that harms the country. He made the campaign a shit fight and he hasn’t stopped since he got to the Oval Office. He’s an entertainer who loves the limelight. The rest of it is focus groups, gut feelings, abusing friends, sucking up to enemies and brain explosions. Chaos aplenty to be expected.

            • Gezza

               /  December 29, 2018

              * Sorry – forgot Fox News.

            • Alan Wilkinson

               /  December 29, 2018

              No, Trump just gave a voice to the Deplorables that the political elite want to ignore contemptuously.

            • Gezza

               /  December 29, 2018

              He just extended appealing to the lowest common denominator from The Apprentice to the country. He’s trying to run the country like it’s a bigger version of The Apprentice. But he hasn’t figured out he’s not in complete charge of everything there like he is on that show.

            • Alan Wilkinson

               /  December 29, 2018

              I think he figured that out long ago. You just don’t like what he decided to do about it.

            • Gezza

               /  December 29, 2018

              He hasn’t decided to do anything about it. He’s just doing what he always does. Try to bullshit, browbeat and bully his way through. But in his business and on The Apprentice everybody has to suck up to him & do as he says. As POTUS, they don’t. He can’t adjust.

            • Gezza

               /  December 29, 2018

              He’s a showoff & a showman. He likes to pull stunts as distractions. Especially he likes to get an admiring audience on tv by going somewhere and saying what they want to hear whenever he’s just done something stupid and getting blowback. What do you think that unplanned trip to Iraq was?

            • Alan Wilkinson

               /  December 29, 2018

              He does like firing people though.

            • Gezza

               /  December 29, 2018

              I’ll say. He gets all pissed off when he finds out sometimes he can’t. He’s a wanker Al.

            • Alan Wilkinson

               /  December 29, 2018

              Was it really unplanned? Seems to have been pretty well timed. He likes to be spontaneous though. Contrasts with Obama who likes to appear always to be doing the right thing, well scripted and proper.

            • Alan Wilkinson

               /  December 29, 2018

              I don’t care if he is a wanker so long as he does a good job. So far he seems to be shaking up stuff that needed shaking up and that no-one else would have done.

            • Gezza

               /  December 29, 2018

              He likes to be spontaneous though.
              Yesss. Especially when he’s in the shit or wants to big note.

              So far he seems to be shaking up stuff that needed shaking up and that no-one else would have done.
              So far he’s shaken up all sorts of stuff that didn’t need shaking up and he’s not shaking up stuff that he should be shaking up – like MBS & the Saudis.

            • Gezza

               /  December 29, 2018

              “Trump’s speech to the troops at a hangar at Al Asad Air Base, Iraq particularly struck a nerve with Former four-star general Barry McCaffrey, who was awarded three Purple Heart medals, two Distinguished Service Crosses, and two Silver Stars, who described Trump’s visit as “embarrassing” and “entirely inappropriate” in a Thursday interview with MSNBC..

              Last week, Trump announced he would withdraw the roughly 2000 US troops from Syria, citing the highly disputed claim that the Islamic State group had been “defeated”.

              Following the backlash from many national-security experts, Trump suggested he was open to using Iraq as a staging point for another intervention in Syria, “if we wanted to do something”.

              McCaffrey also criticised Trump, who did not meet with Prime Minister Adil Abdul-Mahdi during the trip, for snubbing the leader of Iraq.

              “The whole notion of going into Iraq and not genuflecting … the Iraqis is simply outrageous,” McCaffrey said. “And announcing we’re going to use it as the site from which we’ll conduct combat operations in other nations, I mean, it’s just inciting Iraqi sovereignty concerns.

              He also criticised one of Trump’s falsehoods about the military: the claim that US troops received their first pay raise “in more than 10 years” under his administration.

              “It’s not a lie if you believe it,” McCaffrey said, quoting “Seinfeld” character George Costanza. “The troops all should have known it was complete nonsense, but they were sort of excited the commander in chief was there, and they were willing to blow by it.”
              https://www.stuff.co.nz/world/americas/109655900/decorated-former-us-general-calls-donald-trumps-iraq-visit-embarrassing

            • Gezza

               /  December 29, 2018

              November 22, and he does it Christmas night, to a hangar at an air base? And doesn’t even seek proper approval from the Iraqi government, just barges in and insults them? Come off the grass Al. You’re embarrassing yourself.

            • Griff.

               /  December 30, 2018

              It is not grass
              its orange floured kool aid.

      • Duker

         /  December 29, 2018

        2013 ?
        https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Border_Security,_Economic_Opportunity,_and_Immigration_Modernization_Act_of_2013
        Which was passed by Senate but not in House , so didnt become law.

        No wall either , just better fence . Up to that time border fencing in some remote areas wouldnt prevent cows crossing.

      • David

         /  December 29, 2018

        Easy there fella

      • Pink David

         /  December 29, 2018

        “Secure Fence Act Does that sound like Trumps Wall?”

        Yes, it does. If you want to disappear down the ‘fence is not a wall’ rabbit hole, feel free.

        • Duker

           /  December 29, 2018

          Fence ?

          This is ‘vehicle fence’
          ‘Obama says the border fence is ‘now basically complete’
          ‘Department of Homeland Security officials told us they have finished 649 out of 652 miles of fencing (99.5 percent), which includes 299 miles of vehicle barriers and 350 miles of pedestrian fence.’
          https://www.politifact.com/truth-o-meter/statements/2011/may/16/barack-obama/obama-says-border-fence-now-basically-complete/

          Trump has said thats not enough and wants his ‘wall’ – which seem to be more like Slats 15 ft high and very close together

          Some rabbit hole if Trump wants to shut down government over it.

          • Pink David

             /  December 29, 2018

            “Slats 15 ft high and very close together”

            Sounds like a fence.

            • Duker

               /  December 29, 2018

              my ‘slats’ are fence, trumps slats are a wall. the real issue is that trump cant accept the fences and walls existing of various kinds arent enough of a ‘barrier’.
              reality is that most drugs are smuggled through ports and most illegal migrants arrive at airports and either overstay or claim asylum.

            • lurcher1948

               /  December 29, 2018

              Donald’s wall from the Mexican point of view, you build it, they will climb it

            • Pink David

               /  December 29, 2018

              You do realise comics like this simply reinforce the view of a majority of American’s that there needs to be better security on the boarder don’t you? It’s not many who believe there should be no boarder.

            • Pink David

               /  December 29, 2018

              “my ‘slats’ are fence, trumps slats are a wall.”

              Down the rabbit hole you go, once the fence-wall is built, we will see what it looks like.

  5. George

     /  December 29, 2018

    Americans want America for Americans. Shock horror.

    • Kitty Catkin

       /  December 29, 2018

      People like Mrs Trump and her family, you mean ?

      • Corky

         /  December 29, 2018

        I think he meant generically.

        • Kitty Catkin

           /  December 29, 2018

          Generic is not usually used of people.

          • Corky

             /  December 29, 2018

            That may be so, but the intent is quite clear. Any reasonable person will understand.

            • Kitty Catkin

               /  December 29, 2018

              The definition of what reasonable is being yours, I suppose…ergo, anyone who thinks it’s nonsense must be unreasonable. This is false logic.

            • Corky

               /  December 29, 2018

              And the insinuation of ”nonsense” being yours. Hence my use of the word ”reasonable,’ the ability of the human organism to extrapolate data that isn’t present, or is incorrect.

            • phantom snowflake

               /  December 29, 2018

              Corky: I notice your attempts to label yourself as “reasonable”, “rational”, “logical” etc. but I’m just not buying it. Your comments are often very emotionally loaded; particularly so when you are denigrating Muslims, Maori, Pacific Islanders or, hell, any minority at all. Contempt, revulsion or loathing, for example, are hardly “reasonable” or “rational”. Your comments are as much driven by your “Feelz” as are anyone else’s here. Own it.

            • Corky

               /  December 29, 2018

              ”Your comments are often very emotionally loaded; particularly so when you are denigrating Muslims, Maori, Pacific Islanders or, hell, any minority at all.”

              True..that’s because the facts back me up. I find it disturbing and annoying other people ignore the facts because truth and honesty aren’t the major driver in their comments. They disingenuously try to be ‘balanced’ in their arguments.

              However, you have tackled the wrong person. Have you anything to say about Kitty… especially her comments on Open Forum yesterday?

              Maybe you need to ‘own’ that?

            • phantom snowflake

               /  December 29, 2018

              Whatabout Kitty?!” Yeah, nah…

            • Corky

               /  December 29, 2018

              Exactly.

  6. This hasn’t aged well: Donald Trump suggesting in 2013 that President Barack Obama should have been fired for a government shutdown

    “Well, if you say who gets fired, it always has to be the top. I mean, problems start from the top and they have to get solved from the top. And the president’s the leader. And he’s got to get everybody in a room. And he’s got to lead.”

    Link follows

  7. duperez

     /  December 29, 2018

    Okay, everyone knows there are issues, problems to be solved.

    Trump though is like the middle of the night zb callers I sometimes hear. Ignore the history of how the problems came to be, throw in some superficial simplistic meanderings including solutions, all pretty much unrelated to logistics, chuck in some prejudices, mix all that with disregard of all humans involved at whatever level, on whichever side of the fence, and let it go.

    When it’s the zb geniuses though it’s as relevant as the crap falling out of cheap Christmas crackers. When it’s the President of the USA it’s slightly different.

    • Alan Wilkinson

       /  December 29, 2018

      The audience is the same.

    • Duker

       /  December 29, 2018

      ZB late night callers or Wellington bureaucrats high class bullshit- it would surprise you how often the caller are right.
      If the online census came up before it happened , Im sure the callers would have said it would be a dud – and they were right.

  8. The Consultant

     /  December 29, 2018

    The sort of legal immigration the US can do with, Cpl. Ronil Singh:

    Police Officer Singh was a 33 year old husband and father in Newman, California. As his boss said:

    Officer Singh is the shining example of what immigration in America should be. This is a young man who immigrated here legally. It was his dream to come to America. It was his dream to be a police officer — and he worked hard to achieve that goal.

    I say “was” because he was gunned down and killed by an illegal immigrant, who should not have been in the US, and which the California policy of Sanctuary Cities protects from having US Immigration (ICE) arresting and deporting under immigration laws passed by the US Congress with overwhelming bipartisan support a few years ago.

    Of course the Democrat Party has changed pretty radically in the last few years, on this and other issues, hence the pushback against enforcing the Federal laws by Democrat Mayors and Governors.

    • Duker

       /  December 29, 2018

      trump has been hard on legal migration as well , rolling back the rules for things such as chain migration and the us process of ‘random’ green cards. plus his stop on migration from muslim countries ( he finally got around the courts on that by his 3rd re writing of his executive order by including Venezuela!)

      newman city and surrounding stanilaus county california isnt a democratic sanctuary city- sort of defeats that arguement – non ?

      • Gezza

         /  December 29, 2018

        New Zealand rolled back the rules on migration on family reunion grounds some years back because they were too loose and there were too many immigrants getting in on family relationship grounds rather than being selected for their qualifications, skills and experience.

  9. The Consultant

     /  December 29, 2018

  10. The Consultant

     /  December 29, 2018

    Not fake news if you’re watching him say it. And the point is that Schumer actually said key words and phrases that are now verbotten in 2018 Democrat world:
    – “illegal immigrants” (there’s now no such thing, even Schumer now uses the weasel word “undocumented”, depending on his audience)
    – “illegal immigration is wrong”
    – Border “fences” are ok. I’ll leave it to Schumer supporters to parse “wall” and “fence”.

    In any case, the whole thing shows that Schumer speaks out of both sides of his mouth on the issue, as Democrats have since at least 1986, when they suckered Reagan and the GOP into signing on to an amnesty for 2-3 million illegal immigrants with the assurance that from then on they’d be real super tough on illegal immigramts crossing the US-Mexico border so that an amnesty would never again be necessary.

    There are now anywhere between 10-15 million illegal immigrants in the US and the following…

    … must quickly register their presence with the United States Government— and submit to a rigorous process of converting to legal status…

    … is simply a cover because Schumer knows the Democrats can’t call it an “amnesty” again, even though this is effectively the same thing. “Must register quickly”, or what? ICE will deport them – from sanctuary cities? “A rigorous process”!!!!! Sure. Deal!!

    An even bigger tissue of lies than the 1986 bullshit. Trump should make an announcement that he’ll select a border point and get every illegal immigrant to become a member of the Republican Party, then we’d see some border security enforcement from Schumer and company.

    • Alan Wilkinson

       /  December 29, 2018

      Half a million illegal immigrants per year. 1,500 per day. Makes little sense. If NZ had 5000 per year we would be up in arms.

      • Duker

         /  December 29, 2018

        numbers caught coming across border from Mexico?

        as for illegals who make it , 65% are those who arrive legally but overstay their visa. I remember a cousin who was kicked out of US for exactly that reason
        ‘The CMS report, written by Robert Warren, a former director of the U.S. Immigration and Naturalization Service’s statistics division, says 65 percent of net arrivals — those joining the undocumented population — from 2008 to 2015 were visa overstays.’

        so that 1500 per day , say 1000 per day arrive at airports and just dont leave. Not such an issue when you look at it like that.
        500 per day . Of course US has 50 million arrivals pr year.
        In NZ terms that would be 22 per day

        • Duker

           /  December 29, 2018

          looks like that leaky fence from 10 years or so ago did its job. Trumps $5 bill for the wall hes asking for is only a downpayment. Could be as much as 5x that for a full wall.

          • Pink David

             /  December 29, 2018

            The numbers are for those ‘caught ‘, you cannot judge effectiveness without the numbers who are getting through. It’s quite possible that the leaky fence is very leaky indeed, and from 10 years ago, they simply stopped catching people…..

  1. CPTPP has taken effect | Your NZ