Farrar acts on ongoing attacks on Ardern

David Farrar has finally stepped in and done something about the ongoing and increasingly nasty abuse at Kiwiblog that has been directed at Jacinda Ardern, her partner and her baby.

Longknives:

By signing that ‘Migration Pact’ fraud Ardern has signed the Death Warrant of so many New Zealand women and children.

It will take a few years for Kiwis to wake up and actually realise what this vile woman has done but one thing is for sure- History will not remember her kindly.

No, that isn’t the comment that Farrar moderated. It was the reply to it from realityczech:

I hope the first victim is her wretched spoor of the cursed union. I’m sick of ordinary people paying the price of decisions made by an elite who are removed from the consequences. I want her disgusting brat to suffer hideously so she can know the pain she inflicted on millions of others.

Upticks 5, downticks 23

[DPF: You need to see a psychiatrist. That is also Strike 7 and a three month suspension]

Strike 7 means that ‘realityczech’ has been moderated before (they seem to have commented as Kea too) – their record:

  • RealityCzech – 1st strike 1/4/17, 2nd and 3rd strike – 3/2/18, 4th strike – 7/3/18, 5th strike – 19/5/18, 6th strike – 15/9/18, 7th strike – 02/01/19,

That’s just addressing the tip of a vitriolic iceberg, which continues on the moderated thread (some comments will have been posted before the ban).

Someone confronted the comment. Awww C-mon:

Fuck that’s more than a little OTT.

You need to chill the hell out and stop being a fucking cunt.

19 upticks, 3 downticks.

And as per normal an attack back from realityczech:

Here come the sleazy virtue signallers.

Tell ya what have it your way – Who’s kid do you volunteer, yours ?

3 upticks, 18 downticks.

It continued went on between the two.

There were also some abuse supporting comments from Longknives:

To be fair to realityczech- This Labour/Green Government are quite happy for my kids to become ‘Collateral Damage’…
So why should I give a fuck about Ardern’s kid?

15 upticks, 10 downticks.

And:

You do realise that Labour /Greens intend on closing ALL prisons and releasing ALL crims back into society? (Every rapist, murderer and child predator..)
And that Ardern’s puppet Andrew Little said he was prepared to accept ‘Collateral Damage’ when they do this??
Throw in the Migration Pact (Open fucking Borders!) and it is clear that Ardern and her lunatic Government are quite happy to play games and endanger my/your kid’s lives…

19 upticks, 4 downticks.

And:

I certainly don’t wish any harm on Ardern and Gayford’s kid.
I feel sorry for it though- As I’m sure one day it will realise it’s whole existence has been some kind of twisted publicity stunt to further it’s Mum’s career…

You will never convince me that Ardern and co wouldn’t celebrate the demise of one of my kids though- I honestly think they are that morally bankrupt and utterly ruthless in their ambition…(Look at how she cashed in on the death of that poor tourist girl..)

10 upticks, 3 downticks.

While Farrar is not directly responsible for comments from individuals at Kiwiblog, he is responsible for the overall tone prevalent on his blog, and he is responsible to ongoing hit to his own reputation because he allows high levels of vitriol, attack and personal abuse.

For as long as I’ve been aware of Kiwiblog (about ten years) it has been bad for virtually unrestrained abuse and attacks. I think it has been a major detriment to the site, and has continued to harm Farrar’s political reputation. While David Farrar paused to consider his blogging future when linked closely to Cameron Slater in Nicky Hager’s ‘Dirty Politics’, he carried on, and so did the toxic discussion forums.

It’s difficult to moderate any online forum (I know from my own wxperience), especially when managed by one person, and with the number of comments posted at Kiwiblog – often many hundreds per day.

Farrar has always largely kept a distance from Kiwiblog’s comments, favouring free speech. This is a laudable but ultimately lax approach – I and many others have found that you can’t rely on online commenters to act like responsible adults and to not abuse others and to not abuse forums where they are effectively guests.

Sadly shitting in other people’s online nests is very common – some people get way with as much nastiness as they can, and then push boundaries more. I guess some people just have nasty streaks. perhaps they get some sort of power thrill from attacking others. In some cases try to deliberately trash the reputation of blogs (as happened here in a major way in 2015).

One ban is not going to fix Farrar’s problem. He is either going to have to try and clean up his mess – that wouldn’t be easy, online abusers seem to get a sense of entitlement to use forums to abuse, and can get worse if any attempt is made to restrict them. I used to confront abuse at Kiwiblog and with virtually no moderation it usually only escalated the abuse.

Kiwiblog has some very good comments and very interesting commenters participate there. But all the good is badly tainted by the rampant and largely unrestrained abuse.

This affects Farrar’s reputation. He must know this and seems to just accept it. I have seen no indication that he cares about it.

But it also impacts on the National Party by association. Farrar has been closely associated with National for a long time. From his disclosure statement:

Since I joined Young Nationals in 1986, I have been affiliated to, and a member of, the National Party.

As a volunteer, I established National’s initial Internet presence in 1996 and have held various roles in the party up until 2005, including Deputy Regional Chair. I have three times been a temporary contractor to National HQ, helping out with the campaign in 1999, and also between staff appointments – in 2004 and 2007 for a total of ten months. I still help National HQ from time to time on data and IT issues.

I worked in Parliament for almost eight years from July 1996 to March 2004. I initially worked as a media advisor to Ministerial Services when Jim Bolger was Prime Minister. I then had the rare privilege of working in the Prime Minister’s Office for Jenny Shipley, and in the Office of the Leader of the Opposition for Jenny Shipley, Bill English and Don Brash.

I am a Director  of  Group Ltd and Curia Market Research Ltd.

Clients who have used Curia publicly are the New Zealand National Party, The Parliamentary Office of the National Party Leader…

This is well known.

National don’t have any responsibility for Kiwiblog, which is Farrar’s personal blog. There is no indication to me that National have any connection with the ongoing abuses and attacks on Ardern and her family. But they are tainted by association. I would be extremely surprised if the party or their Parliamentary offices have any direct connection to personal and political attacks at Kiwiblog.

But Farrar continues to leave them open to accusations due to his hands off aiding and abetting of nasty political attacks.

And the abusive environment also deters people from participating, as demonstrated by this comment at Kiwiblog earlier yesterday from SGA:

It seems to me that lots of the posters on KB have moved to the left.

I can’t say I have noticed that, Viking2. For myself, I enjoyed Kiwiblog a lot more before the last election. Nowadays, I seem to scroll over increasing amounts of content-free bitterness and name calling to find anything worth reading. But maybe that’s just me

Upticks 21, downticks 5.

realityczech, a prolific commenter, responded to that:

You don’t notice it, because you don’t like freedom of speech.

Us liberals do notice it and you are far from being a liberal.

Upticks 3, downticks 16.

The ticks for and against those comments indicate that most don’t like the nasty and abusive tone that a small minority persist with, largely unrestrained by Farrar. In effect Farrar is favouring a few over the preferences of many. That’s what unfettered free speech tends to do.

Farrar can choose to run his blog however he likes. He is an astute political operator – but he seems to have a blind spot to the damage the abusive forums at Kiwiblog have on his reputation and on National.

57 Comments

  1. Alan Wilkinson

     /  January 3, 2019

    Blog commenting seems like alcohol in lowering inhibitions for some. Anonymity is an enabler for this.

    • Blazer

       /  January 3, 2019

      very Trumpanzee mentality posters there…Al.

    • Joe Bloggs

       /  January 3, 2019

      Posting comments under your own name hasn’t restrained your own abusive attitudes, Alan, so I call bullshit on your comment.

      • Alan Wilkinson

         /  January 3, 2019

        Where have I abused anyone who didn’t comprehensively deserve it, Joe? Until you do, I call b.s. on your comment.

        • Blazer

           /  January 3, 2019

          ‘who didn’t comprehensively deserve it, ‘….what rationALe.! 😉

          • Alan Wilkinson

             /  January 3, 2019

            I’m referring to the likes of MBS and his Saudi murderous thugs, B.

  2. Griff.

     /  January 3, 2019

    DPF has been informed by more than one commentor that Kea KrisX and realty check are the same person. Be mindfull Pete she is/will turn up here with the trolling to cause discord.

    When I left KB I had an email conversation with DPF pointing out his blog was destined to become an empty echochamber.
    I think I was right reading it now.
    Most of the liberal commentors who offer informed opinions have left or now seldom
    comment .
    Very little debate happens in the comments it is mostly full of personal attacks on the left

    • I’m quite familiar with attacks from Kea/realityczech.

      Going by the number of comments at KB it is far from an empty echo chamber, but it has become increasingly dominated by a small number of active abusers. Sad to see, but it’s DPF’s choice.

      DPF’s problem is that with the sanitisation of Whale Oil Kiwiblog is the only major right leaning forum where abuse is largely unrestrained, so it will have attracted the worst, adding to a long entrenched culture of abuse. It won’t be easy to clean up, even if DPF chooses to try. The occasional ban for the worst excesses is not going to change things there.

      • Maggy Wassilieff

         /  January 3, 2019

        but it has become increasingly dominated by a small number of active abusers.

        Some of you have been much longer observers and contributors to Kiwiblog than I have.
        However, it strikes me that there has always been foul abuse aplenty on that blog.
        I was unfamiliar with blogs when I first started commenting there, at first infrequently.
        It didn’t take me long to be sucker /coward punched though.
        I didn’t even realise there was a complaints process to begin with, until one of my abusers accused me of making a complaint to Farrar.

        Well, anyway…. Here I am a few years later, still being harassed and abused by one odd chap on Kiwiblog, who seems to have a fascination with my underwear.

        Perhaps it is safer for our communities that these abusers are inside venting against an old woman on a blog than venturing out in public with all their anger, frustration and inadequacies.

        For me, the humour and background information I glean on the comments is worth wading through the cesspool and having crap thrown at me.

        • With experience it’s usually easy enough to skim comments looking for the commenters worth reading.

          But if the abusers aren’t challenged they think that it is acceptable behaviour. The problem I found at KB (like The Standard) is that if you challenge abusers they tend to turn on you and target you. That lead to unrestrained abuse at KB, worse in a way than at The Standard, but at The Standard the pile ons and abuse can be actively aided and abetted by moderators, which in a way is a worse look for a blog.

          • Maggy Wassilieff

             /  January 3, 2019

            You can challenge what your abusers write without personally attacking them.

            At first I wondered what the hell was happening at Kiwiblog when no-one challenged the obvious personal (and often sexual) abuse I was getting.

            Perhaps other folks get a kick out of reading nasty invective; perhaps other folks didn’t read the nasty comments (lots occurred late at night).

            But most readers at KB want to play with a straight bat. Over time it becomes apparent who is abusing and harassing others. The abusers do themselves no favours when they want to put a serious message across… most readers downtick them, even when they write something decent.

            Blogsites are a type of hospitality establishment.
            Some sites have strict entry codes and tight behaviour requirements…. That suits some people and their blog hosts.

            Farrar’s site is like a popular drinking hole…sometimes nasty abusive folks turn up and try to spoil the bonhomie and decent conversation therein. It’s still the most popular political blog around though.

            • Griff.

               /  January 3, 2019

              I would give a fuck.
              But the person who you are talking about gets untold abuse daily including being labeled a child abuser and worse.
              Your complaint is nothing but the concern trolling that I expect from you.

        • Blazer

           /  January 3, 2019

          ‘who seems to have a fascination with my underwear.’

          I guess telling him you don’t wear any…wouldn’t..help.

          • Maggy Wassilieff

             /  January 3, 2019

            I tried that one…
            But as I am 65, and don’t suffer from “saggy Little tits” (one of the abuses I received on KB from Griff), I discovered life unrestrained was rather painful.

            • Gezza

               /  January 3, 2019

              Going to be interesting to see what B comes up with next ! 😬

            • Kitty Catkin

               /  January 3, 2019

              65 is not OLD, Maggy.

              You could have said that you had to have your undies specially made because it was easier than finding knickers in 10XL and bras with R cups.

            • Maggy Wassilieff

               /  January 3, 2019

              @Kitty Catkin

              I usually try and respond to the first piece of personal abuse with a bit of humorous deflection, but if it’s persistent, nasty and sexual, I’m over it.

              Some folks get a kick out of trying to degrade females and seem to have little awareness of how they come across to other viewers.

        • sorethumb

           /  January 3, 2019

          I got the feeling Stephieboy was a psychologist at a hospital (from a comment).

    • Griff – do you feel able to talk about ‘personal attacks’ given your track record on KB and here of frequently attacking the man or woman when Global Warming is discussed? Really?

      • Personal attacks are often in the eye of the beholder. I generally try to avoid them, but was accused of one at The Standard a couple of days ago – for describing a comment as stupid. The comment was from Psycho Milt who said something to the effect of questioning me criticising Ardern because I hadn’t criticised Key for a similar thing. I actually criticised key for many things, but it’s a nonsense trying to discredit a criticism on the basis of vague assertions about past lack of criticisms.

        I think it was Robert, which was quite ironic – he seems totally oblivious to his own abuses, unless he thinks that he is justified in abusing people but is super sensitive to any criticism in return.

        • Its interesting that MAggie has commented on this thread – Griff has been pretty nasty to her over the years on KB threads.

          In addition I’ve seen Griff just divert into calling people stupid and more when discussing AGW – oops they don’t call it that anymore for some reason its just GW now…
          I read that Standard thread… it was highly amusing. Comrades don’t like non-comrades Pete, and their sniping at the other is highly comical given the ‘values’ they espouse…..

        • Chuck Bird

           /  January 3, 2019

          Pete, there is a big difference between calling someone a cunt or a cocksucker. This is the abuse I have got for the sin of supporting Peters in 2017 although I am now an active member of the National Party.

          One wonders the sort of mentality gets some sort of sense importance by attacking someone anonymously.

          • lurcher1948

             /  January 3, 2019

            Chuck how do you find time to post here as you are always on ZB abusing the PM Jacinda Ardern and the COL, im impressed with your work ethic,or lack of.

          • lurcher1948

             /  January 3, 2019

            I downticked you Chuck…dont like your politics

            • Chuck Bird

               /  January 3, 2019

              lurcher, there is a big difference between criticizing Ardern including her claim to have told a political lie and her role in the coverup of what happened at the Labour Youth Camp and commenting about her teeth.

              It is okay criticizing someone because you do not like their politics. However, I agree with Pete regarding personal abuse on the blog and KB.

              Do you agree with the abuse on KB or does it depend on who it is directed at.

        • Personal attacks are often in the eye of the beholder. I generally try to avoid them, but was accused of one at The Standard a couple of days ago – for describing a comment as stupid.

          Just trying to help you towards the realisation that bleating about how people on The Standard abuse you instead of addressing the substance of your comments isn’t compatible with your habit of dismissing other people’s comments as “stupid.” I see we’re still a long way from that destination…

          • Alan Wilkinson

             /  January 3, 2019

            Nothing wrong with calling a stupid comment stupid so long as you don’t publicly conclude the author is too.

            Normal people respond with evidence the comment wasn’t stupid but stupid people and Lefties respond with abuse.

  3. lurcher1948

     /  January 3, 2019

    A good subject PG ,I emailed the PM about a particularly libelous post on his GD and emailed David Farrar pointing it out.The excuse of a blog owner not knowing of libelous posts is wiped if its pointed out to them.
    As an aside why do they on Kiwi Blog [deleted, don’t repeat unsubstantiated rumours/smears here – PG]

  4. Yes the KB GD thread in particular is a vitriol channel. kea/whatevanameKeagoesbytoday and a few others are pretty extreme.
    But it is a tenet of free speech that its better to let the loons have a place to shout and expose their views rather than lurking in the shadows getting ever more bitter and twisted till they explode and do something truly reprehensible i the real world…
    DPF acts on the report function in his comments threads and sorts things out when raised to him.
    Leave the KB forum alone

    • lurcher1948

       /  January 3, 2019

      Do you think the poster called IGM would pass muster with PG,I DONT THINK SO

    • lurcher1948

       /  January 3, 2019

      dave1924,you still believe in the tooth fairy?? asking for a friend

      • Whats you point Lurch? I don’t care what people say – there are libel laws to deal with the worse abuses but free speech as a principle is important and allowing loons to rant in online forums is a good safety valve…..we see it here as well … not looking at anyone specific of course…

        • duperez

           /  January 3, 2019

          Allowing the loons to rant is fine. Some of the contributors on Kiwiblog are surely the supreme writers of parody in the country. Unintentionally of course. They’re all a bit pile of chicken shit complaining about the truckload chicken shit coming in and fouling the air.

  5. The Consultant

     /  January 3, 2019

    But it also impacts on the National Party by association. Farrar has been closely associated with National for a long time.

    As you have pointed out, PG, the KB forums have been “abusive” for a long time. I recall that from quite early on, as KB gathered steam around 2005, there were Lefty commentators who were sure that the unveiling to the general public of so many National voters as “racist”, “sexist”, “ist’s” of all sorts, supporters of rape culture, haters of The Poor and The Brown, and so forth, would hurt National in both the short and long term.

    And then John Key came along for three terms.

    It’s quite true that KB has become a doppleganger of what The Standard was from 2007 to 2016, when the hatered, vitriol and abuse fired at John Key raged on that forum. Now it’s sauce for the goose: Labour has a popular, telegenic leader who plays much the same cards as Key – and the KB folk hate it.

    Of course, as the old saying has it, the fighting is ever greater and nastier when the differences are tiny, and between Labour and National now they’re very tiny indeed.

    • Duker

       /  January 3, 2019

      Farrar isnt as ‘free speech’ as you think. His friends in the national party caucus have ‘unkind’ comments about them moderated very heavily. Other Mps not so much.

      The other way Farrar operates is to delete comments , even if with links for ‘ancient posts’ as people complain to him that google ranks information in kiwiblog very highly and they would rather ‘rewrite their own history’. I assume those favoured move mostly in national party circles

      • The Consultant

         /  January 3, 2019

        Well he certainly has refused to address the whole Chinese connections that the likes of Croaking Cassandra have been hammering for a while now. Little or no mention of Jian Yang and the associations with Yikun Zhang. Normally I’d say “to be fair”, that DPF has also not talked much about Labour’s equivalent, Raymond Huo, but the very fact that he has not highlighted that MP’s approach to China, (as with Yang, there is zero criticism of China from the MP), actually makes it all the more smellier.

        And not a lot of debate around the whole conflict between the current government approach to China and that of it’s own “Five Eyes” institution, the GCSB.

        I’ve always understood DPF as a National guy, he’s been quite clear about that, and the most effective propaganda is always to simply talk about what you want and ignore what you don’t want talked about – “framing the narrative” as the journos put it. But this China business and the money and MP connections to National (and Labour) are all just too much for me.

        And this is really a classic example: Pete George, as has always been his wont, worries about the “nasty” consequences of DPF’s free speech approach on KB, but I’m a hell of a lot more concerned about his silence on the issue of China’s involvement with National and Labour.

        • Duker

           /  January 3, 2019

          Farrar famously shut down comments on his blog for a period around the time Don Brashs emails were leaked. It was later revealed, Farrar, had a side job as national caucus email administrator during the time – probably continued from the time he was full time in beehive.
          In reality has has continued to work for national on other projects and not just his business doing polling. I understand hes heavily involved in the software side of the census data to help national in re drawing boundaries ( the software is the US republicans use for gerrymandering, but NZ doesnt have one party in complete control. but its gives national a definite advatage as they can draw alternate maps and steer boundary changes in their direction – why else would Te Puke be included in Rotorua but Kawerau is not ? ( kawerau is closer )

          • The Consultant

             /  January 3, 2019

            … the software is the US republicans use for gerrymandering…

            I could show court cases where the Democrats were slammed for gerrymandering, or Democrat controlled House seats showing the same, but of course you would not be interested.

            Anyway, I’m sure that DPF and National will not be able to get away with it here while under the relentless gaze of the giant Cycloptic eye in your forehead.

            • Duker

               /  January 3, 2019

              Of course the democrats have ‘done it too’. Broadly speaking some in the GOP went out to use the post 2010 census redistricting to grab as many seats as possible in as many states where they were closest to capturing total political power.
              Democrats were not really nationally organised on this , didnt have the ‘Redmap’ project and its gerrymandering software ‘mapitude’ written.
              https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/REDMAP
              ‘The strategy was focused on swing blue states like Pennsylvania, Ohio, Michigan, North Carolina, and Wisconsin where there was a Democratic majority but which they could swing towards Republican with appropriate redistricting. The project was launched in 2010 and estimated to have cost the Republican party around US$30 million.[2]’

              having given you some facts, no need to read my mind on what I might think.

              It can only work so far , as the recent ‘anti Trump’ swing in the House nationwide saw Dems win about 40 seats with 53.4% of the total vote against the GOP 44.8%- which is 60.7 mill votes against 50.9 mill.

              the idea that giving a nudge to favour one side of the other has turned into a mapping exercise where street by street and block by block is evaluated to create seats that wander all over the countryside.

              Farrar does this for National in NZ seats and it works – Taupo seat goes from Cambridge to Turangi, Rangiteiki seat goes from Shannon to Taumaranui. Taranaki is chopped into 3 electorates (safe for national), with Whanganui seat including Stratford and going up the outskirts of Opunake.
              gone is the community of interest required by the legislation.

      • sorethumb

         /  January 3, 2019

        flipper (5,225 comments) says:
        October 30th, 2014 at 9:48 am
        In a free society migration is a right. Of course a nation State has the right to restrict inward numbers (but not of citizens returning home), and to determine rules.
        But as a casual observer, there is no problem in NZ. Idiots like hj, with his perpetual warbling (screeching, actually) on the subject, piss me and many others off in a very big way. It is not difficult, even for hj and his few winniepoo disciples (like Mark), to ascertain the fact NZ’s net migration objective is 40,000-50,000 pa (about 1% of current population pa) – a target that it seems hard to achieve.
        What hj and his winniepoo party echoes always omit to say, is that their bald net migration figures include NZ citizens returning. Esoteric links to dubious “studies” (aka fail mark Phud bullshit) are irrelevant, and, like emaciated Nicky and his hargerisms, are regarded by the great unwashed as “Move on. Nothing to see here.” So hj, switch channels, and move on.
        Vote: 5  7 You need to be logged in to vote
        http://www.kiwiblog.co.nz/2014/10/general_debate_30_october_2014.html

        flipper
        Notwithstanding his term as Prime Minister, Jimmy Bolger reached his level of competence when he was chair of King Country Federated Farmers. And, having spent several weekends at Jim and Joan’s Te Kuiti farm, that belief was always confirmed. I always came away shaking my head. But he was a pretty good shit stirring orator in those days, and a good political plotter when he and Joan teamed up with Bill and Rosa Birch.
        But Jimmy’s knowledge of the world’s varied economic policies was always ZIP. He relied on Bill Birch ( an engineer or surveyor as I recall) , and as we know, Bill relied far too heavily on the CIA’s errant forecasts of world oil production and prices rather than those of the major oil companies…… and the “little” ones like Todd Oil.
        (A mix of eras, but the view/policies did not change. SMPs for sheep would still be in effect if he had had his way, but Richardson outflanked both Bolger and Birch)
        http://www.kiwiblog.co.nz/2017/04/bolgers_views.html#comments

  6. kluelis

     /  January 3, 2019

    To be fair since David Lange’s Labour led Governmemt of 1984 Labour and National have become essentially one and the same. Labour shifted to the right economically and National shifted to the left socially. The correction now means NZ has no real political divisions so debate is about minor details and fake posturing and riling one self up about essentially nothing because the older generation in particular were accustomed to confrontational hard line politics. Now that NZ has become deeply gentrified most folk are in cruise mode.With little or nothing to concern Kiwis now days politics is more a sport an entertainment for the politically debate minded to enjoy some gladiatorial fun at the coliseum online. Like rugby is an outlet for physical excesses political blogs are games for fans to cheer on their team in faux battles against other political commentators. At the end of each days play every one goes home and relaxes in comfort enjoying a wine or two. Gentlemen start your engines, let’s get ready to rumble and let the games begin. All jolly good fun.

    • Pink David

       /  January 3, 2019

      “Now that NZ has become deeply gentrified most folk are in cruise mode”

      Yes, most people are doing quite well, and there isn’t much reason for them to demand a revolution.

      • kluelis

         /  January 3, 2019

        Yes so as there is no need to change the government Labour can stay in power for the next 8 years

  7. Than

     /  January 3, 2019

    Just speaking for myself, I prefer DPFs light-handed moderation approach. Some nastiness and personal attacks are hardly the end of the world (although admittedly I’ve never been particularly targetted for it).

    Regarding KiwiBlog affecting National’s reputation, I would doubt that just because political blogs (even a big one like KB) are simply too obscure. The number of readers is small, and mostly consists of partisans who already have a firm opinion on National one way or the other. Plus some level of nastiness is almost inevitable on any online forum, and I’m not sure I agree KiwiBlog is particularly worse than other major blogs. Certainly The Standard is at least as bad (or was the last time I visited).

    • The problem for National (Kiwiblog) and Labour (The Standard) is that the bad behaviour is used to attack the party by association.

      And a problem for politics/democracy in general is that abusive forums put more people off participating.

      It’s hard to measure whether Kiwiblog is worse than The Standard – abuse at KB is generally worse but it is also more open, there’s a more subtle insidious approach often taken at TS – and it is aided by one sided moderation, and promoted by the master moderator, which arguably reflects more poorly on the blog.

      • The Consultant

         /  January 3, 2019

        The problem for National (Kiwiblog) and Labour (The Standard) is that the bad behaviour is used to attack the party by association

        And the result has been…..Key’s National in power for three popular terms and Adern’s Labour-Green could win at least two, so it would not appear that such attacks by implication or association have had any practical effect on the vast majority of voters whatsoever.

        Perhaps it’s just like the days when people got upset about TV shows “with sex and violence”, or the shallow pointlessness of professional wrestling, daytime talk shows, gladiator bouts in the arena. Now it’s blog forums that people get prissy and censorious about.

        Or maybe political blogs are just irrelevant to politics as those other examples?

  8. duperez

     /  January 3, 2019

    The Consultant has Jacinda Ardern “a popular, telegenic leader.” Some contributor on Kiwiblog incurs the wrath of Farrar for a much lesser opinion.

    In some places I think the ‘popular, telegenic’ translates to ‘shallow, vacuous.’ Ardern doesn’t fit the bill of what a PM is meant to be like. Someone who looks like that and sounds like that doesn’t have what’s needed to be a Prime Minister, our Prime Minister.

    Extreme views are to be expected about her, and her in the role, but there’s a wall of constant low-level denigration. The ‘slip of a girl’ should be at home looking after the baby. And married at that. Political enmity is a handy shield for simple jealousy too.

    The shallow and vacuous and jealous will continue unrestrained and unmoderated and the simpleton, hardly educated, incapable girl will continue with the realities of her life and job. Jobs with more substance than simply being popular and telegenic. And she might possibly handle them with some aplomb.

    • PDB

       /  January 3, 2019

      This is no new phenomenon – John Key got it worst from he left & even the MSM were quick to promote an artist depicting a dead John Key. Imagine if something similar was done by some artist of Ardern. Kiwiblog seems to now be home to many of the worst/ most abusive ejected from Whaleoil.

      Unfortunately there are extremists in all forms of life that actually only serve to dilute/ hijack the real debate between people with more considered opinions. In this case of a PM who was on record of never ever wanting the job, being thrust into running for it because her party were desperate, getting appointed PM via negotiations with Winston, and struggling with the job in her first year whilst successfully keeping a very high MSM profile that many would argue is simply diversionary.

      • Blazer

         /  January 3, 2019

        art for arts ..sake.

        • Corky

           /  January 3, 2019

          Know the painting; forgot the artist – Paul Cadmus?

      • duperez

         /  January 3, 2019

        ‘Keeping a very high MSM profile that many would argue is simply diversionary’?

        Who is doing that, Ardern herself?

        • PDB

           /  January 3, 2019

          That’s what her many spin doctors are for – doing a good job of it too.

  9. lurcher1948

     /  January 3, 2019

    No Kiwiblog,GD today so far,Farrar might be doing a reevaluation

  10. lurcher1948

     /  January 3, 2019

    Hell PG you are getting the boot put in from both sides of the fence,but i think you run a fair blog….lurcher
    Robert Guyton 2
    3 January 2019 at 10:49 am
    Pete George @ Your NZ:
    “It’s hard to measure whether Kiwiblog is worse than The Standard – abuse at KB is generally worse but it is also more open, there’s a more subtle insidious approach often taken at TS – and it is aided by one sided moderation, and promoted by the master moderator, which arguably reflects more poorly on the blog.”

    https://yournz.org/2019/01/03/farrar-acts-on-ongoing-attacks-on-ardern/#comment-336562

    Why do we allow George to comment here?
    His views seem poisonous.

    This poster was from The Standard

  11. sorethumb

     /  January 3, 2019

    I notice a shift in attitudes to immigration on Kiwiblog. Some of them visit Croaking Cassandra.
    At the top of the pecking chain is the MSM still and Cameron Slater’s “media Party” moniker isn’t far off.