Open Forum – 11 November

This post is open to anyone to comment on any topic that isn’t spam, illegal or offensive. All Your NZ posts are open but this one is for you to raise topics that interest you, or you think may interest others.. 

If providing opinions on or summaries of other information also provide a link to that information. Bloggers are welcome to summarise and link to their posts. Comments worth more exposure may be repeated as posts. Comments from other forums can be repeated here, cut and paste is fine.

Your NZ is a mostly political and social issues blog but not limited to that, and views from anywhere on the political spectrum are welcome. Some ground rules:

  • If possible support arguments, news, points or opinions with links to sources and facts.
  • Please don’t post anything illegal, potentially defamatory or abusive.

FIRST TIME COMMENTERS: Due to abuse by a few, first comments under any ID will park in moderation until released (as soon as possible but it can sometimes take a while).

Sometimes comments will go into moderation or spam automatically due to mistyped ID, too many links (>4), or trigger text or other at risk criteria. If they pass muster they will be released as soon as possible (it can sometimes take hours).

Leave a comment

129 Comments

  1. Gezza

     /  11th November 2019

    One of several countries facing popular revolts at the moment. One down.

    Bolivian President Evo Morales said on Sunday he would resign after the military suggested he step down and allies resigned amid a fierce backlash to a disputed election last month.

    “I resign my post as president,” Morales said in a televised address, capping a day of fast-moving events in which several ministers and senior officials quit as support for Latin America’s longest-serving president crumbled.

    The commander of Bolivia’s armed forces earlier called on the embattled Morales to resign amid the growing furor over his disputed re-election.
    https://www.aljazeera.com/news/2019/11/bolivian-military-asks-morales-resign-ensure-stability-191110200759194.html

    Reply
    • Kitty Catkin

       /  11th November 2019

      He’d be a fool not to, under the circs.

      Reply
    • Corky

       /  11th November 2019

      I wise man. He would either end up dead or in hospital. That may still happen.

      Reply
      • Corky

         /  11th November 2019

        ”A”

        Reply
        • Gezza

           /  11th November 2019

          Those first two commas should be facing the other way. 😐

          Reply
          • Corky

             /  11th November 2019

            Becoming ‘picky’ again. Next thing you will be posting in Latin.😉

            Reply
            • Gezza

               /  11th November 2019

              Sorry Corks. Couldn’t resist it. 😎

            • Why are inconsequential typos notable? Is it a serious thing that affects something in context in the comment, or just a grammar scold?

            • Gezza

               /  12th November 2019

              @Ishmael

              God no. When it comes to typos on this forum, especially when I’m commenting via me iPad 2 – like now – I’ve probably got by far the highest daily average score of any regular here for typos. I seem to do all my best proof-reading AFTER I’ve blimmin posted.

              Every now & then I just like to see if I can prod Corky into going ballistic at me. It’s good for me blood pressure.

            • Corky

               /  12th November 2019

              Great setup. Pot the ball off the cush. That always gives me a cuckle. Sometimes I do a little setting up of my own.Unfortunately, I can’t muster the energy for such games; year after year. I guess I have too much to do.👍

            • Corky

               /  12th November 2019

              *Chuckle*

          • lurcher1948

             /  11th November 2019

            TAWA humour…,Gezza, have you survived the rain..ran in it Saturday/Sunday,dog agility soaked beyond belief….a HOT bath and wine made me feel better after our event

            Reply
            • Gezza

               /  11th November 2019

              Hiya Lurchy. Yep, survived the rain. Went out in it to me fence with a brolly a few times at its heaviest this morning to have a look at how high me stream was running. Wasn’t actually running all that high, but its always interesting to look at what debris goes whooshing by. The rain stopped here about 3 pm. A new couple of pooks came down the far bank from upstream, with a single pooklet, about a minth old.

              The adults got into a stoush with one of my pooks – probably Princess, as she fled, flying off downstream. Bluey would’ve put up more of a scrap, seeing it’s his territory & seeing they’ve just had triplets about 10 days ago, which they’re hiding from me now, so I don’t know how many have survived their first few days.

              Dog agility? With RED? Sounds like you weren’t in the money this time? At least it’s not been cold here with all the rain, but the lawns were just mowed the other day & need mowing again, & weeds are springing up everywhere.

              I blame the Greens.

            • Gezza

               /  11th November 2019

              * “month”

              (See how much better it looks when ya first pair of inverted commas are the RIGHT way round round, Corks?) 😉

            • Gezza

               /  11th November 2019

              (Just pretend that second “round” isn’t even there, Corks. That’s what I’m doing.) 😐

            • Corky

               /  11th November 2019

              Old timer..wine and hot baths will be distant memories for you if National wins the election.

              ”A” = 4A(””) Therefore, ”I wise man” = 4 A wise man.

              You need a IQ of over 140 to create that, Lurchy. 😊👍

              ps- that ain’t Tawa humour.

            • Kitty Catkin

               /  11th November 2019

              A IQ ?

              Nam risu inepto res, nulla ineptior est.

            • Kitty Catkin

               /  11th November 2019

              (Catullus)

    • Missy

       /  12th November 2019

      The take on this situation from one of the men currently campaigning to be the UK’s PM.

      Reply
      • Corky

         /  12th November 2019

        Wow! Corbyn has probably read the tea leaves and knows he has all the time in the world to worry about inconsequentials during a time that should be demanding all his attention and resources.

        Reply
  2. Corky

     /  11th November 2019

    Hannah Tamaki made a good point when the hurt was applied by an interviewer*. She said words to the affect of ”as generalisation, New Zealanders pay their way overseas, but we have immigrants and refugees that don’t. Fair point. And she’s right about mosques. Mosques are centre points for Islam. They attract hate-preachers and and the disaffected, along with ordinary worshippers.

    * Peter Williams, Magic Radio.

    https://www.newshub.co.nz/home/politics/2019/11/hannah-tamaki-s-vision-nz-says-it-will-ban-the-construction-of-mosques-temples-and-other-foreign-buildings.html

    Reply
    • Blazer

       /  11th November 2019

      Mad Hannah’s Party….ban ‘foreign buildings’.
      Bet she doesn’t even realise Fletchers is majority…foreign owned.

      Reply
      • Corky

         /  11th November 2019

        Mad, no doubt..without a chance in hell. But Hannah also said her policy on immigration isn’t that much different to NZ First or Labour. Mosques are buildings, but the reality is they are places of worship..and not open to anyone as of right. This election may become a disappointment for your hate-filled soul, Blazer. You need to learn the art of being a patriot. That starts with not wanting people in our country who have beliefs diametrically opposed to our culture.

        Reply
        • Duker

           /  11th November 2019

          Fletchers isnt foreign control though. The management and all but 2 directors are Nzers. The largest shareholder is ACC, but other major blocks of shares are held through nominee companies as most large companies are.

          Reply
          • Blazer

             /  11th November 2019

            Fletcher Residential .

            Reply
          • Blazer

             /  11th November 2019

            ‘Currently, the OIA bill, which would ban non-residents from buying New Zealand homes, would also force foreign owners, which includes Fletchers, from retaining ownership of a property once it is built.’
            Stuff mar2018′

            Reply
            • Duker

               /  11th November 2019

              Fletchers got a group exemption over X number of years as they are locally domiciled and do what they say they will do. They buy bare land to develop into sections and build houses for onsale, its not a scam

            • Blazer

               /  11th November 2019

              why is Fletchers treated like a foreign entity if as you say it is majority NZ owned?

    • Gezza

       /  11th November 2019

      Hannah makes Pauline Hansen seem like an intellectual.

      Reply
      • Kitty Catkin

         /  11th November 2019

        She makes her seem like a reasonable and tolerant person with a good understanding of other cultures. The silly cow must have missed the fact that when violence happened in NZ mosques, it was mass murder OF Muslims by an Australian, not mass murder BY Muslims.

        Of course mosques are for Muslims. Churches are for Christians. Hindu and Sikh temples are for Hindus and Sikhs. Like all places of worship, people are welcome to visit them. I have been in several. They are private in the sense of not being open at all times, of course, as are churches.

        Does Hannah Tamaki want to stop Pasifika churches being built ?

        Reply
        • Kitty Catkin

           /  11th November 2019

          What she really seems to mean is that there is no room in NZ for anyone who doesn’t think as the bigoted fundies at Destiny do. No parallel cultures need apply.

          Reply
          • Kitty Catkin

             /  11th November 2019

            Hello, PDTs, that was quick. You must spend all day goggling at YNZ, finger poised to downtick….sad.

            Reply
          • duperez

             /  11th November 2019

            Of course it’s as reasonable for Hannah Tamaki to say she’d ban new “mosques, temples and other foreign buildings of worship” if elected as it would be for someone else to say they’d ban all religion if elected.

            Validity could be claimed for either call and both notions would attract advocacy from and support of some nut cases.

            Reply
    • lurcher1948

       /  11th November 2019

      * Corky,Peter Williams is the demi-god for knuckle-dragging thick OLD white rightwing males who like global warming denialism and casual racism….you like him dont you?????

      Reply
      • Corky

         /  11th November 2019

        Well, Lurchy. It was you who put me on to him. Best thing you ever did 4 me. It saved me from those two drongos on ZB – Simon Barnett and Phil Gifford. You old knuckle-dragger;you.

        Reply
        • Kitty Catkin

           /  11th November 2019

          Hannah T hasn’t heard of all the Kiwi crims who’ve been deported from Australia, I take it, or all the Kiwis who are living rough and on charity there.

          Reply
    • Duker

       /  11th November 2019

      And when has Hickey run a story that hasnt had some ‘little secret’…. The student thing is different from the work visas – which have got out of control, and are mostly exploited. Even my local diary has a visa brokers car parked outside often.
      I notice , like others in the media, he refuses to mention the Indian marriage process is racist as it makes an exception for India that doesnt apply for Africa, South America, Europe etc.

      Reply
      • Gezza

         /  11th November 2019

        Yeah, it does, but there’s no ages-old tradition of arranged marriages in most of the countries in those continents. It’s not really a racist policy so much as a pragmatic one. In cases where people on visitors or work visas here meet & marry NZers, I’m pretty sure they will look at granting an extended visa to allow them to meet the 12 months living together requirement. Happened with my NZ cit former neighbour, who married a Chinese lady who was out here on a visitors visa.

        I’m pretty sure Residence Visas aren’t guaranteed at the end of the 12 months if the marriage isn’t assessed as being genuine & stable. They still have to satisfy INZ about that.

        Reply
        • Blazer

           /  11th November 2019

          why should it have to be an ‘ages old tradition’?
          One law for all.

          Reply
          • Gerrit

             /  11th November 2019

            One law for all (aka the Don Brash argument) is not an acceptable principle in New Zealand.

            Reply
          • Alan Wilkinson

             /  11th November 2019

            How is it not one law for all? Seems entirely pragmatic and reasonable to me.

            Reply
            • Blazer

               /  11th November 2019

              Lets just say you were single and went to the Phillipines Al.
              Met a woman there and wanted to marry her and her come to NZ.
              You would face a barrage of hurdles from INZ…as to how genuine your relationship was.
              Indian,arranged marriage of convenience=no problem.

            • Duker

               /  11th November 2019

              The current policy for partners married or otherwise, is exhaustive documents to prove you have been in a stable relationship for at least a year. This applies the same to Kiwis who meet someone while they are living offshore but apparently not for Indians who have citizenship here and get an ‘quickie arranged marriage’ back home in around a month and expect to come home with the new Mrs….maybe there are some Mr as well.
              Southern Europe ( Italy , Balkans Greece Turkey) used to be home to arranged marriages too, and they would either bring back the bride to Australia or the parents living in Australia would arrange the kids marriages.
              Doesnt every parent want their children to have happy and successful marriage, the idea that its with someone they only met the previous week is just unacceptable

            • Gezza

               /  11th November 2019

              Not every parent is married these days or expects their kids to get married. There’s no such thing as a Marriage Category Visitors or Residence Visa. Applicants can be married, in a civil union, or in a de facto relationship to get a residence visa under the Partnership Category. But they have to meet the “of age or have guardians’ consent”, “have met each other”, “genuine & stable relationship” & “living together for 12 months or more requirements” to get granted permanent residence.

              So, if any government wants to make it an explicit policy that nobody in any kind of relationship gets a visitors visa unless they have met those requirements first I guess they could do that – but I bet it would last for about 3-6 months before it got dumped because every MP ended up knocking on the Immigration Minister’s door demanding that the new policy be trashed because of all the Kiwi citizens & legal immigrants descending on their electorate offices, requesting intercession, & claiming that they, or their kids, were a special case.

          • Gezza

             /  11th November 2019

            Exactly. That’s probably why INZ seems to be in the grotney pudding. My neighbour married a Chinese wife after only a couple of dates & she got a temporary visa long enuf to comply with the “12 months together” rule. So, when Kiwi Indians Ranji or Meena marry an Indian Indian, they want to know why they can’t get one for their spouse too?

            From what I read somewhere on Stuff or The Herald the issue seems to be that INZ HQ issued an instruction to their staff that Visitors Visas weren’t supposed to be simply issued on production of a marriage certificate as though that was a policy; some INZ exec said they had to “look at each case on its merits”.

            At best, that suggests to me the via officer needed to first satisfy themselves the marriage was intended to genuine before they could issue or extend a Visitors Visa. At worst, it could suggest the instruction either said, or was taken to mean, Visitors Visas should be refused.

            There must be some reason – apart from standard bureaucratic denseness – why they did this. But so far I haven’t seen any senior INZ official stick their head above the parapet & say exactly why this instruction was issued in the first place.

            Reply
    • Gezza

       /  11th November 2019

      We are not treating our [guest workers] and workmates fairly, and we’re hurting our poorest in the process through short term and selfish thinking and governance.

      This ‘policy’, which is more a series of accidental and opportunistic decisions than a clearly debated or agreed policy, is effectively delusional and fraudulent.

      While I think Hickey is on the money with his observations that Ardern’s government has actually substantially increased the number of low paid temporary migrants to New Zealand, exactly the opposite to Labour’s & NZF’s pledges to cut it, my money is on this being an INZ typically incompetent bureaucratic policymaking & senior executive management cock up, not a carefully concocted government conspiracy.

      I bet they don’t have a farking clue what they’re doing.

      Reply
      • Gezza

         /  11th November 2019

        I take that back. See my comment & the relevant INZ instruction to staff (publicly available online to anyone) above.

        Reply
        • Kitty Catkin

           /  11th November 2019

          Arranged marriages are made by people who know the two people and the families. They make the match because they think that the people are compatible and the couple are not forced to agree. They meet and decide for themselves.

          Why some people can’t see the difference between this and a marriage of convenience is beyond me, unless they are being deliberately obtuse. A marriage of convenience is for financial or other gain and is in name only. Money usually changes hands and the couple part as soon as they can.

          An arranged marriage is like any other, intended to be for life. Not all are, but nor are all Western marriages.

          The Indian couple who live down the road had an arranged marriage (they had the final say as to whether it happened) and are great-grandparents.

          Reply
      • Duker

         /  11th November 2019

        “Ardern’s government has actually substantially increased the number of low paid temporary migrants to New Zealand,”

        How can that be ? The wage limit for working visa has been raised substantially, to more than $55K per year
        https://www.newzealandnow.govt.nz/move-to-nz/new-zealand-visa/work-visa/residence-work-visas
        The lower wage visas are only for recognised shortages of certain occupations.
        As there is an existing pipeline of people who here on multi year working visas , its not a tap you can turn on of off. Hickey misses that in his raw numbers which have totals rather than than new visas excluding carry overs from the previous years.

        Reply
        • Gezza

           /  11th November 2019

          Ah … good points. How much have they cut back the numbers of low skill visas by?

          Reply
        • Alan Wilkinson

           /  11th November 2019

          Hickey said temp and student are up, permanent residency down. Carry-overs can’t account for that increase unless the rate they expire has suddenly dropped. Also he shows charts of decisions which are new visas, not carried-over totals.

          Reply
          • Gezza

             /  11th November 2019

            What the chart doesn’t show is what kind – or category – of work visas they are.

            I tend to just roll my eyes when politicians complain about & tinker with immigration policies.

            For just about as long as I can remember every party in opposition complains about there being too many immigrants and people on work visas who shouldn’t be getting them for one reason or another, usually because it’s denying jibs to New Zealanders who don’t want to do them. While employers complain they need immigrants because Kiwis aren’t available, or aren’t applying for their jobs & they need workers or they’ll go bust.

            Then, when the Oppos become the government, they go thru a smoke & mirrors tinkering exercise that they claim with fanfare is solving that problem, only to end up eventually with the new Opposition making exactly the same complaint.

            BOHICA, it’s called. Bend Over – Here It Comes Again.

            Reply
          • Gezza

             /  11th November 2019

            Also he shows charts of decisions which are new visas, not carried-over totals.
            How do you know from that chart that they are new (i.e. first time) work visas and not “carry over” work visas? Visas are visas. If they get extended they get extended with a new visa.

            Reply
  3. Zedd

     /  11th November 2019

    kia ora to y’all..
    ‘pray for me, keepers of the gloom..; 🙂 😀

    Reply
  4. Corky

     /  11th November 2019

    I see the Maori Development Ministry is one of the worst offenders for staff accessing porn.
    Cher, my bro.

    Reply
  5. Missy

     /  12th November 2019

    Quick (or maybe not so quick) Election update:

    Last week Parliament formally dissolved for the election, and in the first few days there have already been some issues.

    Conservatives:
    * The main bungle from the Conservatives was controversy around Grenfell when Jacob Rees Mogg said in an interview last Monday that the people who stayed put (despite it having been official Fire Brigade policy in that building) showed a lack of common sense. This has been spun as everything from classist to racist. It was an unthinking comment said in hindsight, however, what was missed by JRM is that many of the tenants in Grenfell were immigrants with little or no English, so they essentially followed the official advice, some probably not wanting to go against what someone in authority told them to do, by the time it was realised that the stay put policy wasn’t going to work it was too late.
    * On Tuesday the Chairman, James Cleverley, was doing the media rounds (and answering a number of questions on these comments), during the morning whilst talking to a breakfast radio show Kay Burley on Sky News breakfast show was ’empty chairing’ him in an interview where she childishly asked questions and demanded answers of the empty chair. Kay Burley claimed that he was booked for her show and didn’t turn up as he didn’t want to answer the questions (despite answering a number of questions along the same lines on BBC radio, BBC breakfast, GMB, and a number of other radio talk shows). James Cleverley said he wasn’t booked for Sky. There is a lot of differing stories on this, but it appears it was a last minute verbally agreed to appearance and James Cleverley wasn’t told (Kay B says 10 Downing St told her that he would be on). A storm in a tea cup, but spun as the Tories being afraid to face the media

    Lib Dems:
    * The Lib Dems are fast becoming the most childish party in this election. Just after the election was announced ITV announced they would do a leaders debate with Johnson and Corbyn, Jo Swinson (LD leader) threw a hissy fit, accused them of being sexist and threatened to go to court to be included. All of this despite LD only having about 30 MPs (of which 1/3 were elected standing for different parties), and being about the 4th biggest party in Westminster. Over the weekend the BBC announced they too would only have Corbyn and Johnson for their leaders debate, prompting Jo Swinson to have another hissy fit and say she was taking them to court to be included in the debate.
    * Last week the Lib Dems unveiled their campaign bus with a nice picture of Jo Swinson on the side, and the wording saying Jo Swinson’s Liberal Democrats. That woman certainly appears to have a bit of an ego.

    Labour:
    * Labour kicked off their social media campaign talking about the NHS (as usual) and (again as usual) claiming the Conservatives were planning to sell it off. Last week one of the medical associations and a number of NHS trusts took them to task (and to a degree the Conservatives) and asked the parties not to politicise the NHS for the campaign. The Conservatives have eased up on using the NHS for campaigning, Labour however have not listened to those actually in the NHS and continue to peddle their propaganda about it.
    * Whilst it looked like the first few days of the campaign would go well for Labour it did not last. Up to 12 Labour Party candidates and potential MPs are now being investigated for comments made, both in public and on social media. A couple have been forced to stand down for anti-semitic comments, others are being investigated for anti-semitism and misogyny. Meanwhile, a front bench Labour MP is being investigated after it emerged at the weekend that during a bus trip back from Cheltenham races he changed the words of Hey Jude to Hey Jews and was singing it all the way to London. The bus not only had other Labour MPs on board, but also a couple of journalists – obviously they were holding onto this story for the right moment.
    * As usual in November Corbyn’s commitment to the UK’s armed forces is coming into question. Whilst he happily poses and talks to veterans after the service on Remembrance Day many wonder how sincere he is. Corbyn has supported the prosecutions of veterans from both the Iraq and Northern Ireland conflicts (despite speaking out agains the prosecution of IRA bombers and terrorists), and on Saturday night he missed the Festival of Remembrance again which is seen as not only a snub to the Veterans, but also to the Queen. These actions don’t go down well with many.
    * And today Corbyn stood up for Evo Morales, and called his resignation as a military coup.

    Reply
    • Missy

       /  12th November 2019

      Further to the above, Nigel Farage has announced the Brexit Party will not target Conservative held seats, and will therefore be standing down their candidates in 317 constituencies.

      He may have had some internal pressure applied, as some of his candidates recognised that if they stood there was the potential they would split the vote and therefore allow the possibility of either a hung Parliament, or a Labour Government, risking Brexit altogether. Some Brexit Party candidates in strong Tory Leave seats had already stood down as candidates throwing their support behind the Conservatives.

      Farage has said they will now target Labour Leave seats and try to get Brexit candidates elected.

      Reply
      • Gezza

         /  12th November 2019

        This constant anti-semitism theme that seems to now run thru elements of UK Labour is puzzling. I don’t recall it being an issue with them in days gone by. Do you know what’s behind it & where it’s coming from?

        It would be the death knell of a party in NZ.

        Reply
        • Blazer

           /  12th November 2019

          What evidence can you produce re this theme’?

          Reply
        • Missy

           /  13th November 2019

          I think the Wikipedia article you linked to sums a lot of it up, however, my understanding is it has become worse – or maybe more overt – since Corbyn became leader.

          There are two most probable reasons for the rise of anti-Semitism in the Labour Party.

          1. The increased number of extreme left activists that joined, creating the grass roots organisation Momentum. Amongst some of those that have joined Labour since Corbyn’s election as leader are a number of former Socialist Worker Party members, and it has been suggested that the SWP was institutionally anti-semitic. A number of people from a number of Pro Palestinian groups have also joined.

          2. Corbyn’s fundamental failure at leadership. It has been suggested by some on social media that one of the problems is not so much a growth in anti-semitism in Labour but because of weak leadership it isn’t being dealt with, and the more that Corbyn lacks leadership on the issue the more overt the anti-semitism becomes.

          Reply
          • Blazer

             /  13th November 2019

            what a load of drivel.
            Manufactured outrage to undermine a socialist ‘threat’.

            Reply
            • Missy

               /  13th November 2019

              Of course it is all manufactured outrage, that is why there have been numerous police investigations, some arrests, and why the Equality and Human Rights Commission are investigating Labour for institutional Anti-Semitism.

              It is also why Jeremy Corbyn admitted earlier this year there was a problem with widespread anti-semitism in Labour, and why a number of Jewish MPs and activists have been the target of racial abuse.

              Nope, no anti-semitism in UK Labour at all, it has been manufactured for political purposes completely.

            • Corky

               /  14th November 2019

              Corbyn is also a terrorist sympathiser. And now he wants to tax the rich.
              When are you socialists going to learn, Blazer?

  6. Corky

     /  12th November 2019

    Those who have shopped in overseas fresh food markets know this article is fairly spot on.
    Our problem to start with is we don’t have a consistent sub tropical.climate. That limits the variety of produce available. We also don’t have a history of cuisine that’s been past down through the centuries. And of course, much of our productive land is being built on.

    https://www.stuff.co.nz/travel/kiwi-traveller/117249510/travellers-say-hell-expensive-healthy-food-in-new-zealand-is-making-them-fat

    Reply
    • Blazer

       /  12th November 2019

      NZ has a temperate climate and ample water.Ideal conditions for growing a wide range of produce.
      NZ has plenty of arable land.
      With a population of around 5 million ,it is not densely populated or built out.
      Corky to the corner with a dunce hat.

      Reply
      • Corky

         /  12th November 2019

        You lack of horticultural knowledge isn’t astounding, Blazer. I also surmise by your comments that you have never shopped in an overseas ( especially tropical) market where the variety and colour of produce is endless. Our Farmers Markets are pale imitations.

        I guess those nasty growers are trying to make a buck. Oh, hold on, the supermarkets are screwing them out of the market.

        I pass the dunce hat to you. Wear it with pride.and the certainty that you deserve it.

        Reply
        • Blazer

           /  12th November 2019

          been to many markets abroad Corky.
          Tropical and sub tropical produce is grown in countries with higher ave temperatures-to state the obvious!
          Start planting,Durian,Pawpaw,Mangos and Papaya…you could corner the..market!

          🙂

          Reply
          • Corky

             /  12th November 2019

            ”Tropical and sub tropical produce is grown in countries with higher ave temperatures-to state the obvious!”

            That’s where your lack of knowledge comes to the fore ( and maybe a few porkies). These regions can also grow types of produce we grow.😊

            Reply
            • Gezza

               /  12th November 2019

              Those who have shopped in overseas fresh food markets know this article is fairly spot on.

              In a lot of overseas fresh food markets the sellers are the growers and/or they are small-time traders scratching out a very basic living on the tiny profits they make, with a standard of living that would be at or below the poverty line in NZ.

              Many overseas countries have long histories of small town living & integrated small farmer markets, which we have moved away from. Our small towns are too small & have been in decline since the neolib changes shifted us to a more corporate capitalist economy.

              And in places like France & some EU countries, the market traders are likely a bit better off, being able to ask slightly higher prices than in, say, Asia, because, like in the US, their produce is subsidised by their governments. We could be like them maybe & use some of your tax to subsidise healthy food prices – but I doubt you would approve of this?

            • Gezza

               /  12th November 2019

              Forgot to mention the other obvious one. In industrialised countries with larger populations you also simply get economies of scale.

            • Corky

               /  12th November 2019

              Those are good points, but it doesn’t take away from the fact our climate, comparison wise, only supports a small number of crops. Many of those can only be produced for a regulated/limited market.

              The little producer who supplies overseas markets, is what makes the food cheaper, and way more varied. There’s little compliance cost.

              Also, much of our land isn’t good horticultural land. Or it’s badly aspected, and not easily assesable.

            • Blazer

               /  12th November 2019

              It supports a large number of crops…probably more than can be grown naturally anywhere in the world.

    • Alan Wilkinson

       /  12th November 2019

      A lot of contradictory opinions in that article. There seem to be a lot of other things much more expensive than healthy food to me.

      Reply
      • Kitty Catkin

         /  13th November 2019

        I agree; it’s a filler and an opinion piece. Much depends on where people buy the fruit and veg. I bought tomatoes today for $1.50 a kg.

        I have been in markets in a number of countries, and they are not all as good as Corky seems to imagine. I wonder how many he’s actually been to.

        Reply
        • Kitty Catkin

           /  13th November 2019

          It’s pointless not to compare like with like; comparing a market in a Third World country with one in NZ is meaningless.

          Reply
  7. Zedd

     /  12th November 2019

    11-11-11-19 ‘Lest I nearly forgot’ 🙂

    Reply
    • Corky

       /  12th November 2019

      What you forgot was your credit card… oooo oooo oooo oooo

      Reply
    • Kitty Catkin

       /  13th November 2019

      No, that’s not what 11-11-11 means.

      The armistice for World War I (1914-1918) was signed at 11am on 11 November 1918. Anyone who’s heard of this war would know that.

      Lest We Forget is a commonly used and well known expression in this context.

      Reply
  8. Gezza

     /  12th November 2019

    Sums up two of our managers in my last six years in the Public Service.

    Reply
  9. Gezza

     /  13th November 2019

    Born to parents blooded in a seemingly persistent cycle of war, the Baby Boomers didn’t do too badly.

    The world in the 1940s, 1950s and 1960s was class-ridden, racist, sexist, sexually and socially conservative, and it’s infrastructure needed a lot of investing in. It’s so much better today on so many fronts, yet Baby Boomer is a term most commonly used as an insult. It’s a generation blamed for its mistakes, not thanked for its successes, here and overseas.

    But the language of intergenerational fairness obscures just as much as it illuminates. Political language always does this. That’s the point of it.

    It tars a whole group with the same brush, and so doing unifies those using the language: Millennials are the lazy generation, greens are socialists in disguise, all beneficiaries are potential cheats, farmers are animal abusers, men are to women what bicycles are to fish, all baby boomers only care about keeping their tax rates low and the prices of their houses up.

    Baby Boomers weren’t a sociopathic generation. They were our mums and dads, grandpas and grandmas. They fixed some things the previous generation had stuffed up, and made mistakes that need fixing by their successors, but they also did many, many good things.

    So thank you Baby Boomers. You were human. You tried. You succeeded. You failed. Oh, and don’t be too free spending our inheritances, because we will be expecting you to pass it on to us. Thanks in advance for that.

    https://www.stuff.co.nz/business/117334248/give-baby-boomers-their-dues

    Well, not all of the baby boomers have much of an an inheritsnce to leave you, but most of you should get a reasonably tidy sum. If you behave yourselves, show some respect, & don’t bite the hand that fed you 😎

    Reply
  10. Gezza

     /  13th November 2019

    Hello, Jacinda? Um … The Bumbling Jihadi, Mark Taylor, may yet be turning up at one of our consulates for a travel document. Any instructions?

    Turkey will continue to deport captured ISIL members whether home countries ‘take them or not’, president Erdogan warns.
    https://www.aljazeera.com/news/2019/11/erdogan-isil-fighter-trapped-greece-problem-191112143449668.html

    Reply
    • Gezza

       /  13th November 2019

      Jacinda: “Hi Gezza. Um … Talk to Winston. He’s our … ah … Foreign Minister.”

      Reply
  11. Gezza

     /  13th November 2019

    Winston: “He’ll be wanting a passport. Talk to Tracy Martin. I’m busy.”

    Reply
  12. Gezza

     /  13th November 2019

    New immigration procedure for arranged marriages

    “[Immigration Minister] Lees Galloway has announced the new rules & system for arranged marriages. The new process clarifies:

    • Those who have a culturally arranged marriage to a New Zealand resident or citizen can apply for a culturally arranged visitor’s visa. [Only a bureaucrat or a reporter with really bad English skills could come up with that description or title]

    • The visitor’s visa will have strict assessment criteria attached to it to ensure only legitimate arranged marriages are approved and to stop so called mail-order brides and other potential rorts

    • Once the partner has been living in New Zealand with their spouse they can begin the process to apply for a partnership visa while proving the legitimate nature of their nuptials.

    Lees-Galloway said today that those who had partnership visas declined since May will be contacted by Immigration New Zealand in the next two weeks and their cases will be reassessed.

    Those who meet the new criteria will have reapplication fees waived.”

    https://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=12284119
    … … … …
    Or in other words, go back to doing what you were doing before, only this time they don’t have to apply for a partnership residence visa until they actually qualify for one.

    Reply
    • Blazer

       /  13th November 2019

      and the test for…’only legitimate arranged marriages are approved’.

      All white NZ citizens are excluded I venture.

      Reply
      • Gezza

         /  13th November 2019

        🤔 Don’t think albinos would be ruled out.

        An immigration officer must be satisfied that the marriage ceremony genuinely occurred and followed an identified cultural tradition, and there is a genuine intent to live together,” Lees-Galloway said.

        Reading the article might be a good idea, B? 😐

        Reply
        • Blazer

           /  13th November 2019

          did…’followed an identified cultural tradition’ is the excusion clause.

          Reply
          • Gezza

             /  13th November 2019

            Well, yes, because in pretty well all Western societies even shotgun marriages demanded by enraged parents of pregnant teenage girls have largely ceased & would even probably be prosecutable under law.

            Arranged marriages amongst royalty also seem to have gone by the wayside; the Windsors have developec a very unfortunate habit of marrying commoners. And look what’s happened with some of those – although most would probably have met the 12 months together requirement.

            You can bet your boots though that if any European NZer ends up in an arranged marriage with anybody else in a European country (like, I dunno, a European gypsy) where such arrangements might be culturally normal, & they apply to INZ to comecto NZ to live, INZ will,be required to put them through the same process.

            It’s not like you to be so culturally insensitive, B? o_O

            Reply
            • Blazer

               /  13th November 2019

              Do not accept this special provision for Indians and their sub continent culture at all.
              ‘Some Indian savage (the Subcontinent, not Americas) said that it was his culture to burn widows, and that that should be respected. The British empire builder agreed, but said (I’m paraphrasing) “It’s my culture to shoot cowardly widow-burners. If you insist upon engaging in your cultural traditions, I will insist upon engaging upon mine.” Anon.

            • Gezza

               /  14th November 2019

              Very strange quote, but a typical Blazer, accusatory slur – this time slurring a whole ethnic group. Nobody from India is applying to INZ to burn widows. Not only is it now illegal in India it is illegal here, as it should.

          • Blazer

             /  14th November 2019

            ‘cultural tradition’ as a reason/excuse opens a huge can of worms…look at Gt Britain and the muslim aggravations based on the same.

            Reply
            • Gezza

               /  14th November 2019

              Absolutely it does – and likely wiil. This is the problem with governments like ours & PMs like like Jacinda publicly insisting that we must be a multi-cultural society.

            • Blazer

               /  14th November 2019

              so do you think the provisions to allow arranged marriages by Indians preferential treatment…a good or necessary one?

            • Gezza

               /  14th November 2019

              Yes & No. I do not believe in multiculturalism. I believe in assimilation.

              Arranged martiages are not New Zealand culture. I believe culturally arranged marriages should not qualify someone for residence. Only people in genuine marriages or partnerships which meet the standard rules & evidence should be approved for permanent residence.

              This change may be aimed at facilitating the entry of Indians in particular but of necessity allows someone from anywhere whose arranged marriage doesn’t meet those rules to be given a visitors visa to enable them to come to NZ, find out, and prove whether the marriage meets those requirements.

              If the couple have consented to the match & know that if it doesn’t work out the would-be migrant could required to go home – hopefully at the expense of their sponsor – I don’t mind. I’ve seen no evidenve the faulire rate of these marriages is higher than those entered into by lovestruck hormonal young Kiwis.

            • Blazer

               /  14th November 2019

              @Gezza…assume they expunge this rather drastic cultural tradition as the airplane lifts off from Dehi airport…SMH’
              ‘Bride-burning, as this type of crime is most commonly referred to, accounts for the death of at least one woman every hour in India, more than 8000 women a year.
              “We also call it dowry death,” says Donna Fernandes, the founder of Vimochana, a women’s rights organisation established in Bangalore in 1975 with the aim of preventing violent against women.
              “The husband’s family believes they have not received enough money for their son at the time of the wedding, perhaps because they are of a higher caste or some such reason, and that’s when the harassment starts.”
              Often, says Fernandes, the husband’s family begin pressuring the wife’s family right after the wedding.

              “They start asking for cash, or gold, or consumer goods like washing machines or televisions. Whatever it is they believe is owed to them or was promised to them, luxury goods that they can get the bride’s family to pay for.”

            • Gezza

               /  14th November 2019

              @ Blazer

              Are you saying:

              1. Payment of dowry is illegal in NZ?

              2. Bride-burning is legal in india?

              3. Bride burning of Indian regularly happens in NZ?

              4. All NZ Indians who have had arranged marriages were pressued into them & there was no free consent by both parties?

              5. All Indian marriages involve the risk of the bride being burned or a widow burning herself on her dead husband’s funeral pyre?

            • Blazer

               /  14th November 2019

              @Gezza…no..I’m not saying those things.

            • Gezza

               /  14th November 2019

              I will say, however, that there seems to be a glaring omission in the policy requirements that must be met to qualify for a residence on partnership grounds & that it should be rectified.

              I see no requirement that the visa officer must be satisfied that the marriage been agreed to with the free consent of both parties. That should be a mandatory criterion as it is OUR culture.

            • Gezza

               /  14th November 2019

              @Gezza…no..I’m not saying those things.

              Then what is your purpose in posting those excerpts?

            • Blazer

               /  14th November 2019

              @Gezza…the purpose is to expand the boundaries of looking at cultural sensitivities ,the human nature aspect and whether or not it manifests itself ,regardless of where it is practiced.
              The excerpts are from the Sydney Morning Herald.

            • Gezza

               /  14th November 2019

              @ Blazer

              Ah. Thank you for the unnecessary education. There would I think be few people in NZ who are unaware of these abhorrent old cultural practices that are illegal now even in India as well as New Zealand & would be prosecutable here.

              So in fact, after thinking about it, you actually have no objection to residence being granted to spouses in genuine arranged marriages where both parties freely consent & are aware that if it does not endure post-arrival for the required time, the sponsored spouse may be required to leave NZ?

            • Blazer

               /  14th November 2019

              No I want ALL marriages of convenience to meet the same criteria Indian or not.
              I do note the good point you make about ..both parties and free consent.
              Labour are pandering to a very influential Indian donor base.

            • Gezza

               /  14th November 2019

              Labour are pandering to a very influential Indian donor base.

              Maybe they are, but all parties blatantly pander to their donor or voter bases.

              This apparent lack of a requirement for evidence of free consent is a major hiole in the policy, imo. But typical of government policy wonks being too isolated from reality & being university qualified but not having front line experience.

              My bet is that INZ is also woefully underfunded with not enuf appropriately properly trained seconded New Zealand visa officers in enuf places overseas.

  13. Gezza

     /  13th November 2019

    Stuff.co, today.

    1. Who knew you need to get a churchgoers licence to attend church? 😳

    2. One hopes the officers concerned will be charged with assault & drummed out of the force. 😠

    Reply
  14. Corky

     /  13th November 2019

    ”I have been in markets in a number of countries, and they are not all as good as Corky seems to imagine.”

    No shit, Sherlock!!! This from someone who has been on a benefit for 30 plus years. How did it get overseas to these markets? In the wheel-wells of airliners?😊👌😁

    Reply
  15. Gezza

     /  14th November 2019

    https://www.stuff.co.nz/life-style/food-wine/117358684/tip-tops-boysenberry-ripple-scoops-supreme-ice-cream-award–again

    This is an outrage. 😡 Tip Top Hokey Pokey should have won. There should be a judicial review.

    Reply
  16. Gezza

     /  14th November 2019

    Bizarre. How much more routine information the police give out are the gangs now in control of?

    “In the past 12 months, there has been an increased presence of Mongrel Mob members in New Plymouth, which has resulted in rising gang tensions.

    The risk of a possible turf war was the reasoning behind a recent decision by police national headquarters to withhold information related to gang membership numbers in Taranaki.

    In a response to an Official Information Act request made by Stuff/Taranaki Daily News, it decided against releasing the information to “prevent the possibility of disclosure leading to the provocation of inter-gang rivalry and an increase in serious offending”.”

    Reply
  17. Gezza

     /  14th November 2019

    Tikanga could be appropriate for posthumous appeals law?

    Posted – https://yournz.org/2019/11/15/tikanga-could-be-appropriate-for-posthumous-appeals-law/

    Reply

Leave a Reply

Fill in your details below or click an icon to log in:

WordPress.com Logo

You are commenting using your WordPress.com account. Log Out /  Change )

Google photo

You are commenting using your Google account. Log Out /  Change )

Twitter picture

You are commenting using your Twitter account. Log Out /  Change )

Facebook photo

You are commenting using your Facebook account. Log Out /  Change )

Connecting to %s