Open Forum – 21 November

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87 Comments

  1. Not surprising after his awful interview that drew more attention to his connection to Epstein, and to girls associated with Epstein.

    Reply
    • Corky

       /  21st November 2019

      Translation: He’s gone for good. Plenty of time for gin and tonics…and probably a large dose of depression as suddenly everybody he rings just happens to be unavailable.

      Reply
      • Blazer

         /  21st November 2019

        Fergie will be waiting to console him…legs I mean arms …open.

        Reply
        • Gezza

           /  21st November 2019

          Don’t be grubby Blazer. This is a family forum.

          Reply
          • Blazer

             /  21st November 2019

            very suitable for ‘randy Andy’ who was married to a toe sucking ginger,minger.

            Published in family daily’s all around the…world!

            Reply
            • Gezza

               /  21st November 2019

              Well, perhaps, but all done in the best possible … taste !

            • Kitty Catkin

               /  21st November 2019

              I doubt if crude and offensive words like minger will be in any family daily, or if they will make that gross remark about the Duchess of York.

              Minge is an extremely vulgar word for women’s pubic hair or genitals as Blazer must surely know at his age; it’s highly derogatory.

              To refer to a woman as that is disgusting sexism and totally unacceptable.

    • Duker

       /  21st November 2019

      “his awful interview that drew more attention to his connection to Epstein, ”
      Ummm he denied the main allegation as he was at a pizza express in Woking …not his normal eat out joint ( its not far from Sunninghill estate in Berkshire)
      From the transcript of the interview, it seems his staff looked up the records to ‘remind him of the date’ . And of course he would have had police minders around.
      Im not a fan of Him, but the facts so far, support him against a womans claims
      And the other story seems to be based on some claims that he didnt follow a scripted PR story of ‘Im sorry, deeply sorry , very deeply sorry

      Reply
      • Blazer

         /  21st November 2019

        so his arm is photo shopped around her iyo?

        And his contact/visits with Epstein are all plausible??

        Reply
        • Duker

           /  21st November 2019

          He hasnt denied the Epstein visits and connection. Its a particular person on a particular date that is false. She may not remember either something in 2001, but the journos needed a factoid…not to matter they will move on to others… a new one each day … PG loves that sort of drip.. drip. and yet more ‘revelations’.
          NZ media do too with all the click bait story… a new one every day. My god ,do they love reveals and revelations.
          Thats Ok if the aim is to shock and awe and sell papers
          The reverse when its the other side who are trumpeting something, then the tactic is pour sand in the gears and call it an ‘obsession’…..slow it all down…so it goes away.

          Trump is caught in that trap now and hes running out of sand . Andrew tried to play the game, doesnt use Twitter , but forgot hes the prey now and there are no rules

          Reply
          • Kitty Catkin

             /  21st November 2019

            Anyone with a computer can photoshop. Photos have been altered before and will again.

            Reply
            • Kitty Catkin

               /  21st November 2019

              I find it hard to believe that anyone doesn’t see that minge is a crude and sexist vulgarism; it’s on the same level as cunt and as offensive when it’s used to refer to a woman. Calling a woman by an obscene word like this is revolting, reducing her to her genitalia. As Blazer also made a crude reference to the Duchess of York opening her legs, I can only wonder why these disgusting posts haven’t been moderated and removed.

        • duperez

           /  21st November 2019

          Being in a photo with her and even having his arm being around her doesn’t mean he actually knows her.
          There you go, just proved I’m in the Donald Trump era.

          Reply
  2. Zedd

     /  21st November 2019

    Im sure the ‘Grand old Duke of York’ will get over this.. in short order :/ 😀

    Reply
    • Gezza

       /  21st November 2019

      Dunno. Hard to come back from this one. Being stood down from royal duities.

      Reply
      • Zedd

         /  21st November 2019

        yeah.. but I cant see him queuing up at the London dole office, to fill in a UB40

        Reply
        • Gezza

           /  21st November 2019

          He doesn’t seem to be short of a bob, although new business opportunities might slow down now. The thing is he’s tarred with the Epstein connection & that train wreck interview now. Wherever he goes in public he can expect to get asked awkward questions by reporters looking for salacious stories – they can feed off this for years.

          Prince Andrew: Who pays for his lavish lifestyle?
          https://www.nzherald.co.nz/lifestyle/news/article.cfm?c_id=6&objectid=12287029

          Reply
        • No, I can’t see it either.

          Once Charles ascends to the throne, Andrew will get a polite ‘Don’t come Monday’ note along with a discrete royal command that he absents himself from the UK and doesn’t return. Ever.

          Reply
          • Kitty Catkin

             /  21st November 2019

            I think not. ‘Don’t come Monday.’ is American, not English, and the Royal Family speak English. And discrete means broken up into pieces, not ‘discreet’, and is meaningless in this context.

            ‘Don’t come Monday.’ is also meaningless.

            Reply
            • Kitty Catkin

               /  21st November 2019

              He has stepped down, not been stood down; there is a big difference, like that between resigning and being sacked.

            • I really don’t care Kitty.

              It it were a serious error that make a comment completely out-of-whack (an Americanism, I believe), then it would be fair game. But these are minor errors in grammar and spelling that don’t affect the substance of my comment.

              So, if you want to exercise your pedantry gland, knock yourself out and work through it.

            • Corky

               /  21st November 2019

              Damn..when the whanau ..aren’t whanau. Happens in the best of families.

            • Kitty Catkin

               /  21st November 2019

              They are serious errors; they don’t make sense.

            • Gezza

               /  21st November 2019

              He has stepped down, not been stood down; there is a big difference, like that between resigning and being sacked.
              The word leaking from Palace insiders is that, although he’s her favourite child, his mum told him he has to step down.

          • Missy

             /  22nd November 2019

            “He has stepped down, not been stood down; there is a big difference, like that between resigning and being sacked.”

            Not exactly according to the Royal reporters. He was told by the Queen that he was being stood down, but was allowed to write a statement that he stepped down for pride. The latest is that it was at the request of Prince Charles, who told the Queen she had to stand him down for the good of the monarchy.

            This will please Charles, he has been (slowly) trying to scale back the monarchy for some time, and is apparently planning a scaled back Royal Family when he becomes King. It is expected that when Charles becomes King the main Royal representation will be himself and William and Harry, with no place for the others, and then as the children are old enough even Harry is expected to be sidelined in favour of George and Charlotte.

            Reply
            • While Kitty was busy being a grammar pedant, it’s emerged that Charles didn’t even wait to ascend to the throne to deal to Andrew.

              The Evening Standard confirms Andy was sacked by Charles. He was given the big heave-ho and awarded the DCM – Don’t Come Monday.

              https://www.standard.co.uk/news/uk/sack-andrew-to-save-the-monarchy-how-charles-advised-queen-over-brother-s-fate-a4292781.html

            • Corky

               /  22nd November 2019

              This all assumes Charles outlasts the Queen. By the looks of her she’s still firing on all 8 cylinders.

            • Kitty Catkin

               /  22nd November 2019

              I never believe what’s printed in tabloids as coming from ‘a source close to the palace’.

            • Missy

               /  22nd November 2019

              Kitty, its not just the tabloids, just about every news outlet is reporting that Charles was the one who urged the Queen to sack Andrew, or at the least that Charles was behind it.

              Anyone who has been following the Royals over the last few years will not have been surprised either, as it has been widely reported that Charles wants to slim down the monarchy.

            • Gezza

               /  22nd November 2019

              Well there’s no way Charles, I reckon, could MAKE Her Majesty do anything. She’s a woman of steely resolve. But she obviously knows her successor’s counsel at this time in her life must carry considerable weight.

            • Corky

               /  22nd November 2019

              Yes, there will come a time when Charles is the power behind the throne. It’s obvious, if the media is correct, that Charles already has some influence on the Queen.

  3. Gezza

     /  21st November 2019

    “The New Zealand Herald’s focus on premium, quality journalism is paying dividends, with soaring digital and print readership.

    And the Herald’s magazines – including Travel, Canvas, Viva, TimeOut and BeWell – are also enjoying strong growth.

    The New Zealand Herald’s average daily newspaper readership is 465,000, an increase of 12,000 people on the same period last year, according to Nielsen readership results released today.

    At the same time, the Herald’s overall digital audience numbers are also soaring. In October, the NZ Herald’s monthly unique audience reached 1.824 million.”
    https://www.nzherald.co.nz/business/news/article.cfm?c_id=3&objectid=12287106
    … … … …

    How does Stuff.co’s online readership compare? I thought I read somewhere the other day it’s in frint.

    Reply
    • Duker

       /  21st November 2019

      Now thats Fake news. Monthly unique audience ? What even is that .
      That they promote the Herald on facebook and get 1.5 mill ‘feeds’ , doesnt even mean the FB crowd look even further but just scroll past
      Whats the monthly subscribers , you know follow the money!

      Reply
      • Kitty Catkin

         /  21st November 2019

        That could be true about the Herald, but it’s potentially misleading. If people look up five stories a month, that makes the number of readers much smaller than that claimed.

        Reply
        • duperez

           /  21st November 2019

          I don’t know how they work the numbers out. I suppose Mike Hosking will be spending hours a day clicking on his own Herald pieces.

          Reply
  4. President Trump’s impeachment inquiry has been, well, peachy today.

    Ambassador Sondland seems to have had a fit of memory, testifying that a clear understanding existed among top administration officials that Trump sought to extort Ukraine’s government for personal political gain: ““Was there a quid pro quo? As I testified previously … the answer is yes. Everyone knew. It was no secret.”

    Everyone being Trump, Giuliani, Pence, Mulvany, Pompeo (no wonder he’s resigning), Perry (no wonder he resigned)…

    Then Pentagon Ukraine expert Laura Cooper testified that Ukraine met all of legal corruption elimination thresholds months before Trump froze the military aid. In brief, Trump’s motivation couldn’t have been corruption because he put the hold on the military aid to Ukraine months after it had cleared a congressionally mandated corruption review.

    What a swamp Trump has created in Washington.

    Reply
    • and part of the issue with what Trump has created in Washington is that his entire political infrastructure is constructed around keeping his narcissistic delusions intact.

      Reply
    • Gezza

       /  21st November 2019

      Pompeo resigning? That was news to me. We’ll have to wait & see whether it’s fake news now, I guess.

      “November 19, 2019

      Secretary of State Mike Pompeo has told three prominent Republicans in recent weeks that he plans to resign from the Trump Administration to run for the U.S. Senate from Kansas in next year’s elections. The problem: how to get out in one piece.

      Pompeo’s plan had been to remain at the State Department until early spring next year, the three Republicans tell TIME, but recent developments, including the House impeachment inquiry, are hurting him politically and straining his relationship with Trump.

      So Pompeo is rethinking his calendar, say the top Republicans, one who served in the Trump Administration, another who remains in government, and a third who served in several high-ranking posts and is active in GOP politics. The timing of Pompeo’s resignation now will be decided by his ability to navigate the smoothest possible exit from the administration, the three Republicans say.

      There is no indication whether Pompeo has discussed his plans with President Trump. Rumors of a Pompeo Senate campaign have circulated for months, and while Pompeo has said repeatedly that he has no intention of running, he has not ruled out a race. Pompeo aides previously have denied he was planning to step down. They declined to comment on the record for this story.”
      … … …

      Trump hasn’t created a swamp in Washington, it already was one. Imo, he’s created a sewer in the White House & parts of the Beltway, though. As well as chaos in the Pentagon.

      Reply
      • Duker

         /  21st November 2019

        Nikki Haley is polishing her resume as we speak ….shes going full on Trumpanzee

        Reply
      • Gezza, I agree that there has long been a swamp in Washington, figuratively as well as literally. But the swamp that Trump has created is uniquely his own.

        I like your analogy of a sewer system, too – everything is connected to everyone in vile and nasty ways that the swamp metaphor doesn’t quite portray… 🙂 Either way, it would be entertaining to watch if it didn’t involve the chaos that Trump has created everywhere.

        As for Nikki Haley, I don’t rate her. She’s a loyal foot-soldier with a poker face, but the history books will remember her as a key player in Trump’s campaign to undermine universal human rights and international bodies.

        Reply
    • Gezza

       /  21st November 2019

      Well, maybe they will decline it. But there’s quite a distinct difference between the two situations that you’ve posted about & the reason why the donation from Destiny Church was refused by Rainbow Youth

      See if you can work out what it is?

      Reply
      • Corky

         /  21st November 2019

        The point is even given the media coverage, this money will probably be accepted. Yes , there is a difference in both situations…but the philosophical underpinnings of both situations is the same. This is a problem Libertarians run into frequently -pragmatism over a coherent philosophical underpinning towards life’s situations/experiences.

        Reply
        • Gezza

           /  21st November 2019

          Yes , there is a difference in both situations…but the philosophical underpinnings of both situations is the same.

          No, they aren’t. Do some more thinks. Dive a bit deeper this time. You’re skimming the surface so you’re missing it.

          Reply
          • Duker

             /  21st November 2019

            Isnt it really about a Vegan cafe getting some free publicity.. in advertising and news ( which have collided here) its called a ‘reason to purchase’ and ‘a hook’ respectively

            Reply
          • Gezza

             /  21st November 2019

            For the café, yes. Also they’re having a chuckle at spending Folau’s money on some of his target sinners at the same time, but Corks thinks he’s tumbled some Liberals displaying hypocrisy or some kind of philosophical incongruity, it seems.

            Reply
            • Kitty Catkin

               /  21st November 2019

              There is no connection between the two stories.

              One was a donation from Tamaki Church, which was refused for obvious reasons.

              One was the proceeds from a cafe for a particular time and which the recipients would have known were coming. Two of the diners happened to be the Folaus who could well not have realised this. The money was from the caff, not the Folaus personally.

            • Kitty Catkin

               /  21st November 2019

              Cork is reading far too much into this.

            • Corky

               /  21st November 2019

              I will work off the cush on this one. Please remember my use of the word ” probably,” is essential to my comments being cogent. However, I’m prepared to argue the hypothetical – that the money has been accepted.

            • Gezza

               /  21st November 2019

              That Folau’s money has been accepted? Well, yes, it should be.
              There’s no reason for them not to accept it, for the reason Kitty has explained.

            • Corky

               /  21st November 2019

              ”Two of the diners happened to be the Folaus who could well not have realised this.”

              But the cafe was aware. And I would assume the cafe knew Rainbow Youth would have rejected the Tamaki’s previous offer of a donation.

              Also the cafe knew what the Folaus stood for, yet did not tell them. They took their money then gloated.

            • Corky

               /  21st November 2019

              “We don’t turn anyone away at Gorilla Kitchen, because we love everyone, not just animals,” the caption reads.”

              Well, if they love everyone, where is the respect for their clients privacy?Lack of morality if you ask me. Have they done this to other patrons? Probably not. That’s a lack of consistent philosophical approach to their business and attitudes towards people. Why was animals mentioned?

            • Gezza

               /  21st November 2019

              Ah, yes, now I see your point. This is my take.

              Back to your original question. The Folaus shouldn’t get their money back. They paid for & consumed what they ordered.

              Rainbow Youth need not be principle-bound to refuse the donation. The cafe is donating it to Rainbow Youth, not the Folaus. Unlike Destiny Church the cafe has no history of Biblical anti-gay stances, & it is not likely to cause suspicion its donation is no more than a political stunt.

              As for – if they love everyone, where is their respect for their customers’ privacy? I think that’s a good point. It’s not really very nice to publicly mock the Folaus & use rhem to advertise the LGBTWXYZ cause & their cafe at the same time. So I’ve gone off them a bit now.

              I don’t know why animals were mentioned. It’s just a reporter’s quote, so we have no context. Might have been something to do with the cafe’s name, or they run a pet-friendly cafe (dogs allowed), or something.

  5. Gezza

     /  21st November 2019

    After electing the first African American one, is the USA now ready for its first gay President?

    https://www.stuff.co.nz/world/americas/117600678/mayor-pete-takes-the-lead-in-crucial-race-for-the-white-house

    Frankly, I doubt it. I reckon this will be a woke step too far for many liberals at the conservative end of their spectrum, who’d never openly say so, but who just wouldn’t vote for a gay President.

    One shudders at the thought of how ugly the social media campaigning would get from the Christian fundamentalist Republicans & their attack dogs.

    Reply
    • Duker

       /  21st November 2019

      IOWA ?. No chance that being the lead in that tiny state matters any more. Once it gave a candidate momentum ahead of the pack and that led to money. Online fundraising blew that all away.
      Its not that Buttegieg is gay , its that the sum of his experience is Mayor of South Bend. Reagan had been an actor but had been California governor too. Trump had no experience at all , but the democrats dont work that way. But who knows, that may have been just the beginning of a trend

      Reply
  6. Gezza

     /  21st November 2019

    Some Rotorua CBD retailers have had enough. Constant screaming, fighting and even staff being assaulted on their doorstep has become the daily norm. More than 10 inner-city business owners met with the council yesterday to share their stories and find a remedy for the issue that is “destroying” the CBD. Caroline Fleming reports.

    Being punched in the face and having a gun pulled on them are just some of the “horror stories” retailers have been experiencing in the CBD.

    These incidents were two of the many tales brought up at Rotorua Lakes Council yesterday with a number of inner-city business …

    To continue reading this article and to support great journalism
    Subscribe now and get 50% off for the first 8 weeks

    https://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=12286784

    Place sounds like the Wild West.

    Reply
  7. Corky

     /  21st November 2019

    Usual suspects, usual response. Until corporal punishment is reinstated, this type of attack will grow worse. It has already cost a student his life. Of course, CP won’t be reintroduced.
    It would be a backward step according to many. Much better to see a student receive a life threatening beating than take action with something these ferals would understand – a fucking good hiding.

    https://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=12287015

    Reply
    • Gezza

       /  21st November 2019

      The Herald should have identified the school.

      Reply
      • Corky

         /  21st November 2019

        Agreed. That the principal isn’t front footing this speaks volumes. I believe, and with good previous experience of these situations, that school staff also fear for their safety. Some parents are not scared to beat a teacher for disrespecting( in their drug addled minds) their
        children. Many of these assaults never make the headlines.

        Reply
        • Gezza

           /  22nd November 2019

          The Herald seems to be inconsistent & I’m now curious why. They’ve identified the schools whose pupils organised & participated the Mission Bay brawl. Why not this school.

          There were occasional fist fights (that always attracted a circle of baying onlookers calling “fight! fight!”) at my boys-only private secondary school.

          I even got into one myself with a classmate who threw a ball at me in the handball courts that hit the wall near my head, when I had my John Lennon specs on – glass lenses those days. I saw red & ran the length of the court & clocked him one with a haymaker. We both ended up bloodied in a circle of cheering onlookers when a teacher broke it up & we each got the obligatory six of the best.

          But those fights always stayed a fist fight and/or an amateur wrestle until one kid gave up or or went down & stayed down or others just broke it up. They were pretty rare. And always punished – although it sometimes meant an innocent victim of bullying by an arsehole got strapped.

          What we see now, though, on a regular basis, courtesy of the msm publishing cellcam videos from other kids, are incredibly vicious assaults, often involving more than one assailant, that include kicks to the head or body that continue. I find them deeply disturbing & to me they do indicate that some very nasty kids are probably terrorising some schools.

          Reply
          • Corky

             /  22nd November 2019

            Yep..nothing wrong with a ‘dooks up’ scrap like you had. But as you say, this stuff is going beyond a simple fist fight. Maybe the school is exclusive, and has some clout with important people? I don’t know.

            Reply
            • Gezza

               /  22nd November 2019

              It was a stupid overreaction on my part but he was Irish ancestry too so once he rebounded from the whack in the head it was all red feckin rage & flying punches & we had no show of our higher thought processes kicking in.

        • Kitty Catkin

           /  22nd November 2019

          There may not be evidence of the school’s identity; I believe that I know where it is, as the uniform and buildings look familiar, but that’s not proof.

          Reply
          • Gezza

             /  22nd November 2019

            Kitty ! Did you not see :

            The high school has not responded to multiple requests for comment by the Herald. ?

            The school has clearly been identified to The Herald.

            Reply
    • Gezza

       /  22nd November 2019

      “An educator who has been bitten, hit and scratched is not surprised that the past five years have seen nearly 5000 incidents of students physically assaulting school staff.

      And the effects of alcohol and drugs on children is contributing to the problem, the associate education minister says.

      Between 2014 and 2018, there were at least 4871 incidents across the country which saw students stood down, suspended, excluded or expelled for assaulting school staff.”

      More…
      https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/education/117563222/number-of-students-disciplined-for-assaulting-school-staff-not-surprising

      Reply
      • Kitty Catkin

         /  22nd November 2019

        Anyone who knows the Waikato school uniforms will know which school it is; I would make a hefty bet that I do.I used to teach there.

        I don’t know of any schools where corporal punishment consisted of a ‘fucking good hiding’; that would be assault. Nor can I see how beating someone up will achieve anything except continuing the cycle of violence. Children from violent homes tend to go on to be violent themselves, violence begets violence.

        Institutionalised violence is unlikely to stop other violence.

        Reply
        • Kitty Catkin

           /  22nd November 2019

          If there’s any evidence that being violent to people means that they will never be violent themselves, I’d be glad to hear it.

          Reply
          • Gezza

             /  22nd November 2019

            I have no doubt that the physical punishment & shit you got in for fighting at our boys only school stopped a lot more fights than would otherwise have happened with a bunch of testosterone-fuelled adolescent males with super-sensitive competitive male egos to protect.

            I only got into my scrap because the testoserone & anger kicked in big time & then there was no way I could walk away when he fought back.

            Reply
  8. Gezza

     /  22nd November 2019

    Aljazeera tv breaking news: Israel Attorney General announcing live on tv that Bibi Netanyahu has been indicted on charges of bribery, fraud & breach of trust.

    This comes ahead of a possible 3rd election because no party has been able to form a government.

    Reply
  9. Blazer

     /  22nd November 2019

    ‘ A dodgy application is a dodgy application. If you made false declarations or failed to disclose relevant information on a loan application or a claim to IRD it would still be actionable whether it succeeded or not’

    I do wonder about the repercussions however when it is on record that a sitting M.P knowingly filed a dodgy application to reside in NZ,and no action has been taken!

    Reply
  10. Corky

     /  22nd November 2019

    Mikey cleans up and grows his audience, even in Northland. Apparently the only people not listening to him in Northland are the Harawirias and Parti. Both parties are fanatical in my opinion.

    Mikey also cleaned up on his blood tests. So he should. He partakes of cutting edge supplementation.

    https://www.nzherald.co.nz/business/news/article.cfm?c_id=3&objectid=12287139

    Reply
    • Blazer

       /  22nd November 2019

      you forgot to mention Marcus Lush got an award.About the only one of the line up worth ..listening to.
      Woodham,Barnett,Hosking=3 stooges.

      Reply
  11. Corky

     /  22nd November 2019

    According to HDA, Jacinda told more porkies yesterday at the police graduation ceremony.
    Asked why she wouldn’t be interviewed with Winston, she said she always does stand-alone interviews. That is a blatant fib as reporters have dug up at least three files of her being interviewed with Peters.

    Reply
    • Gezza

       /  22nd November 2019

      My theory is that all national leaders have now been inspired to tell blatant lies, easily disproved, by Donald Trump.

      Reply
      • Corky

         /  22nd November 2019

        Eh? Pigeon English please.

        Reply
        • Gezza

           /  23rd November 2019

          Hmm. Yes. Could have been worded better.

          My hypothesis is that Donald Trump, the world’s most famous pathological liar, and one of its worst, because his lies are so easily disproved, has somehow now managed to inspire other countries’ leaders to tell lies which are easily disproved.

          HDPA isn’t the only one to pick up Ardern telling that porky that she only does stand-alone interviews/press conferences. 1News (the night she made that claim) showed her doing 2 or 3 joint press spots, with Winston there. In one, I think she asked him to comment on something.

          Reply
  12. Gezza

     /  24th November 2019

    Gang researcher and criminologist Dr Carl Bradley said gang PR is not new.

    Other Mongrel Mob chapters and Black Power use spokespeople, most notably Denis O’Reilly and Eugene Ryder for the latter, and Fatupaito and Dennis Makalio for their respective Mongrel Mob chapters.

    He says people will always be sceptical of anything they do, and the PR battle is not about recruitment, as numbers have been on the rise since 2011, but about who owns the narrative.

    “The state likes to control information, it’s part of how the state operates, and here you’ve got a group within the state challenging that… no doubt about it, there’s a mutual antagonism.

    “The police official line is, I’d say, antagonistic towards anything that any of the gangs try to do from a positive perspective.”

    Each gang chapter is run autonomously by respective presidents, so what happens in the Waikato mob is not what is happening in others.

    The Waikato chapter’s move away from the national table may indicate a slow progression away from the traditional brand, or even the evolution of a new gang, he says.

    When you’ve got plenty of money to employ a PR sheila & organise PR stunts, why not?

    I’m with the police view on these PR stunts. You want to start a community improvement group? Start a community improvement group. Don’t try & confuse the public & your membership with this good gang / bad gang, good gangsta / bad gangsta bullshit.

    A reformed gansta is an ex-gangsta. No farkin gang patch, & proud of it. That’s how you know a reformed gangsta, imo.

    https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/117379741/waikato-mongrel-mobs-gangster-bark-refined-for-public-consumption

    Reply
  13. Blazer

     /  24th November 2019

    Awaiting the results of the Serious Fraud Offices investigations into National Party fundraising.
    Will be interesting to se if commentators and the media in general whip themselves into a frenzy comparable with the present one regarding NZF.

    Reply
    • Gezza

       /  24th November 2019

      If it finds anything untiward, you bet they will ! Quality dining for the media, that would be ! TV1 & TV3 reporters would need incontinence pants as they breathlessly reported on it.

      But if there’s nothing illegal uncovered it will get a brief mention & quickly die away on telly. Might be a few articles that continue on how easily legally rortable the current system seems to be.

      Reply
  14. something to keep an eye on:

    “The CEO of Ukraine’s state gas company, Naftogaz, is ready to give evidence in a U.S. federal investigation that is reportedly probing the business dealings of Rudy Giuliani, the CEO said in an exclusive interview on Friday.

    “I will with a high likelihood be invited to testify in this case,” Naftogaz CEO Andriy Kobolyev told TIME, citing his lawyers and contacts in the U.S. “If I am called, I would be willing to come and testify,” Kobolyev added.

    Federal prosecutors are investigating Giuliani for possible campaign finance violations and illegal lobbying, according to reports published in the past week by Bloomberg and the Wall Street Journal, both of which cited unnamed U.S. officials and sources familiar with the matter.

    These reports claimed that the investigation stems from a federal case against two of Giuliani’s associates, Igor Fruman and Lev Parnas, who were indicted last month for allegedly violating campaign finance laws.”

    https://time.com/5737518/ukraine-naftogaz-ceo-preparing-giuliani-probe-testimony/

    Reply
    • and something else worth keeping as a watching brief. Nunes, eh? Lordy, I hope there are tapes 🙂

      “A lawyer for an indicted associate of Rudy Giuliani told CNN that his client is willing to tell Congress about meetings the top Republican on the House Intelligence Committee had in Vienna last year with a former Ukrainian prosecutor to discuss digging up dirt on Joe Biden.

      The attorney, Joseph A. Bondy, represents Lev Parnas, the recently indicted Soviet-born American who worked with Giuliani to push claims of Democratic corruption in Ukraine. Bondy said that Parnas was told directly by the former Ukrainian official that he met last year in Vienna with Rep. Devin Nunes.

      “Mr. Parnas learned from former Ukrainian Prosecutor General Victor Shokin that Nunes had met with Shokin in Vienna last December,” said Bondy.

      Shokin was ousted from his position in 2016 after pressure from Western leaders, including then-vice president Biden, over concerns that Shokin was not pursuing corruption cases.”

      https://edition.cnn.com/2019/11/22/politics/nunes-vienna-trip-ukrainian-prosecutor-biden/index.html

      These allegations belong with the FBI, where they already are, with investigators whose subpoena power actually works. That’s the thing about liars… once you know they’re lying to you, you’re better off, for your own safety, assuming they might be lying every time they tell you something.

      Reply
  15. Gezza

     /  24th November 2019

    There was no coming back for that man with the machete in Tauranga who took the 3 kids hostage & had it at the chest of one of the two children he still had when the AOS had to go in after 15 hours on medical advice about their probable physical condition.

    In the witness video shown in the 1News update of them breaking in, up a ladder, I counted one shot after he was told to drop it, then 10 more in rapid fire, quick succession.

    Now one of them has to go home & tell his missus: “Dammit, I had to kill a man today”.

    Reply

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