US versus Iran continues

Donald trump may be trying to defuse the escalating situation between the US and Iran in Iraq.

Reuters: Trump says U.S. does not have to use military against Iran

President Donald Trump said on Wednesday the United States did not necessarily have to use its military power against Iran, in an apparent attempt to defuse a crisis over the American killing of Iranian military commander Qassem Soleimani.

The crash of a Ukranian airliner in Iran has added to the tensions.

No survivors after Ukrainian Boeing plane with 176 aboard crashes in Iran

A Ukrainian airliner crashed shortly after take-off from Tehran on Wednesday, bursting into flames and killing all 176 people on board.

Among the victims were 82 Iranians, 63 Canadians, 11 Ukrainians, 10 Swedes, three Germans and three Britons, Ukrainian Foreign Minister Vadym Prystaiko said.

It was the Kiev-based carrier’s first fatal crash, and it said it was doing everything possible to establish the cause.

Ukraine will send a team of experts to Iran later on Wednesday to investigate the crash, President Volodymyr Zelenskiy said in the Ukrainian capital.

“Our priority is to establish the truth and those responsible for this terrible catastrophe,” he said.

Asked at a briefing in Kiev whether the plane could have been hit by a missile, Ukrainian Prime Minister Oleksiy Honcharuk cautioned against speculation until the results of the investigation were known.

Safety experts say airliner accidents rarely have a single cause and that it typically takes months of investigation to understand all the factors behind them.

In Paris, the maker of the plane’s engines, French-U.S. firm CFM – co-owned by General Electric and France’s Safran – said speculation regarding the cause was premature.

U.S. calls for complete cooperation with any probe into cause of Iran crash

U.S. Secretary of State Mike Pompeo said on Wednesday the United States was calling for complete cooperation with any investigation into the cause of the crash of a Ukrainian airliner in Iran.

In a statement, Pompeo said the United States was prepared to offer Ukraine all possible assistance after the crash of the Ukraine International Airlines Boeing 737, which burst into flames shortly after takeoff from Tehran on Wednesday, killing all 176 people aboard.

The plane crashed hours after Iran launched missiles at bases housing U.S. forces in Iraq, and officials have cautioned that speculation about what happened was premature.

There have been wider effects of the tot for tat attacks.

Airlines re-route or cancel flights around Iraq, Iran after missile strike on U.S. troops

Major airlines canceled Iran and Iraq flights on Wednesday and re-routed others away from both countries’ airspace, following an Iranian missile strike on United States-led forces in Iraq.

On the Iranian missile attacks:

Trump says no U.S. casualties, Iran appears to be standing down

U.S. President Donald Trump said on Wednesday there were no American casualties in the Iranian strikes on military bases housing U.S. troops in Iraq and that Tehran appeared to be standing down.

“No Americans were harmed in last night’s attack by the Iranian regime. We suffered no casualties,” Trump said in a White House address. “Our great American forces are prepared for anything. Iran appears to be standing down.”

Iran believed to have deliberately missed U.S. forces in Iraq strikes: sources

Iran is believed to have deliberately avoided U.S. military casualties during retaliatory missile strikes on bases housing American troops in Iraq, following the U.S. killing of an Iranian general, according to U.S. and European government sources familiar with intelligence assessments.

USA Today: US knew Iranian missiles were coming ahead of strike

The U.S. military had advance warning of Iran’s missile assault on two Iraqi bases housing U.S. forces, attacks that prompted new economic sanctions Wednesday from President Donald Trump.

The missiles targeted al Assad air base in Iraq’s western Anbar province and another base in Erbil in Iraq’s semi-autonomous Kurdish region. The extent of damage to the bases was not immediately clear, but early-warning defense systems gave U.S. forces advance knowledge that missiles had been launched, according to a U.S. official speaking to USA TODAY on the condition of anonymity.

The advance warning explains no casualties. I would expect the US to be monitoring and detecting missiles, but they can’t have known in advance what the exact targets would be.

CNN, citing an Arab diplomatic source, reported that Iran notified Iraq in advance and that Iraqi officials then tipped U.S. troops before the attack began. A U.S. defense official also told CNN that Iraqis were told by Iran to stay away from certain bases.

The militaries of Finland and Lithuania, which had personnel at one of the targeted bases, said they also received information about an imminent attack and had time to take shelter or leave the base.

It sounds like it was a symbolic counter attack.

Trump has given a national address on the situation. Highlights from Reuters: Trump addresses Iran situation

ATTACK ON MILITARY BASES

“I’m pleased to inform you the American people should be extremely grateful and happy. No Americans were harmed in last night’s attack by the Iranian regime. We suffered no casualties. All of our soldiers are safe and only minimal damage was sustained at our military bases.

“Our great American forces are prepared for anything. Iran appears to be standing down, which is a good thing for all parties concerned and a very good thing for the world.”

U.S. STRENGTH

“Our missiles are big, powerful, accurate, lethal and fast. Under construction are many hypersonic missiles. The fact that we have this great military and equipment, however, does not mean we have to use it. We do not want to use it. American strength, both military and economic, is the best deterrent.”

SANCTIONS

“As we continue to evaluate options in response to Iranian aggression, the United States will immediately impose additional punishing economic sanctions on the Iranian regime. These powerful sanctions will remain until Iran changes its behavior.”

There have been US imposed sanctions on Iran for years.

CREATING A NEW IRAN DEAL

“Iran must abandon its nuclear ambitions and end its support for terrorism. The time has come for the United Kingdom, Greece, France, Russia and China to recognize this reality. They must now break away from the remnants of the Iran deal, or JCPOA. And we must all work together toward making a deal with Iran that makes the world a safer and more peaceful place.”

Trying appeasement after assassinating a foreign leader in another country.

Wanting to scrap one deal and make another deal is typical Trump.

Leave a comment

89 Comments

  1. Duker

     /  9th January 2020

    US seems to have been blindsided by Iran making direct attacks on US military bases, they wouldnt have sent more troops in harms way without any additional way to protect them against incoming ballistic missile attacks – these things can be done but the US hasnt developed the sytems like Israel has who only cover a small area. Iran is a large country and the US has many many fixed bases , mostly airfields which are large easy targets.
    Even the pentagon doesnt know whether its coming or going, and with Trump as commander in Chief confusion will only increase

    Reply
    • Pink David

       /  9th January 2020

      Iran has been clever. They have struck back in a way that almost guaranteed they would cause no harm. Scud are largely worthless except using a WMD, but they look good on TV.

      Iran gets to say they struck back, while the US feels no need to respond.

      Iran has also said that firing those missiles was ‘proportionate’. The message is that Iran want to do a deal and de-escalate. They don’t care about Soleimani being killed.

      “these things can be done but the US hasnt developed the sytems like Israel has who only cover a small area. Iran is a large country ”

      Patriot, THAAD and SM-3 all provide ballistic missile defense. Patriots have intercepted at lest a dozen Scuds in Saudi over the last few years.

      Reply
  2. Reply
  3. Reply
    • Corky

       /  9th January 2020

      First we look at his Twitter account. That really yells out at us. Then we read this:

      ”That’s always the source of the most potent cognitive dissonance: his followers believe there’s always a plan.”

      There’s never ‘a plan’ in politics. I don’t know why this chap is complaining. He should be happy Trumpy’s cognitive dissonance has averted confrontation… for the interim.

      Of course, Islam is not worried. As one talkback caller reiterated yesterday, and it’s something we in the West forget -Jihad is forever until Islam rules the world. Full stop.
      Even if we know of this concept our Western minds cannot grasp it’s reality. We only understand time in a short term context. For many Westerners 24 hours is about our limit.

      So Trumpy’s actions will be lauded by media, supporters and opponents as the right course of action. And in the short to medium term they are right. In the long term they are wrong.
      And Trumps action is just another nail in the coffin of Western culture

      Reply
      • Duker

         /  9th January 2020

        “we in the West forget -Jihad is forever until Islam rules the world. Full stop.” So you get your information and theories from talkback ? You are a bigger fool than they are.
        Thats what they used to say about the the Comintern too … then the Chinese
        Stick to your Age of Empires computer games

        Reply
        • Corky

           /  9th January 2020

          ”So you get your information and theories from talkback ? You are a bigger fool than they are.”

          You need to have another squizz at my post. Maybe look up the meaning of ‘reiterated.’

          So, is the talkback caller right or wrong?

          Maybe you need to stop worrying about your Pokemon collection and start reading about the real world.😃

          Reply
          • Duker

             /  9th January 2020

            Its the US thats in a muslim region of the world , not the other way round. In in fact is the Iranian Presidents stated aim : We wont rest till the region is rid of US troops.
            The US has troops in Gulf States, Saudi Arabia , Jordan, Syria ( it changes according to Trumps mood swings), Iraq

            The Sunny -Shia conflict long predates even the idea of ‘the west’ .

            Reply
            • Corky

               /  9th January 2020

              Quotes:

              ”Bin Laden viewed his terrorism as a prologue to a caliphate he did not
              expect to see in his lifetime.”

              ”There is a temptation to rehearse this observation—that jihadists are modern secular people, with modern political concerns, wearing medieval religious disguise—and make it fit the Islamic State. In fact, much of what the group does looks nonsensical except in light of a sincere, carefully considered commitment to returning civilization to a seventh-century legal environment, and ultimately to bringing about the apocalypse.”

              ”The most-articulate spokesmen for that position are the Islamic State’s officials and supporters themselves. They refer derisively to “moderns.” In conversation, they insist that they will not—cannot—waver from governing precepts that were embedded in Islam by the Prophet Muhammad and his earliest followers.”

              To take one example: In September, Sheikh Abu Muhammad al-Adnani, the Islamic State’s chief spokesman, called on Muslims in Western countries such as France and Canada to find an infidel and “smash his head with a rock,” poison him, run him over with a car, or “destroy his crops.” To Western ears, the biblical-sounding punishments—the stoning and crop destruction—juxtaposed strangely with his more modern-sounding call to vehicular homicide. (As if to show that he could terrorize by imagery alone, Adnani also referred to Secretary of State John Kerry as an “uncircumcised geezer.”)

              But Adnani was not merely talking trash. His speech was laced with theological and legal discussion, and his exhortation to attack crops directly echoed orders from Muhammad to leave well water and crops alone—unless the armies of Islam were in a defensive position, in which case Muslims in the lands of kuffar, or infidels, should be unmerciful, and poison away.”

              https://www.theatlantic.com/magazine/archive/2015/03/what-isis-really-wants/384980/

              Now a question needs to be asked: What do, what we consider ”average Muslims, think?” Muslims that show no interest in Jihad (?).

              Now look at Kitty’s ignorant comments. Maybe now you understand why Islam is in no rush. And our talkback caller was RIGHT.

            • Kitty Catkin

               /  10th January 2020

              That wellknown talkback expert, Stu Pidd, holding forth after a night at the pub, one imagines. Too thick to realise that there are different kinds of Muslim and that they don’t think alike any more than all Christians do.

          • Kitty Catkin

             /  9th January 2020

            The talkback caller is wrong, needless to say. Their understanding of jihad and Islam is extremely limited.

            Speak for yourself when you say that ‘our limit’ is 24 hours. There are very few people for whom this is all that they can grasp.

            Reply
            • Kitty Catkin

               /  9th January 2020

              What is an ‘average Muslim’ ? There’s no such thing. There are millions of Muslims.

              Why didn’t the Muslims in Western countries start bashing heads in with rocks, poisoning them, running them over and poisoning their crops ? If they did, it wasn’t in the news.

              To assume that all Muslims are like the ones in ISIS is as stupid as thinking that all Christians are like the Westboro Baptist nutters or the ones at Gloriavale.

            • Kitty Catkin

               /  9th January 2020

              If people could only grasp the concept of time as 24 hours ahead, they would be unable to function. Even a weather forecast would be meaningless. People would be unable to make plans of any kind unless these were for the next day. How could someone who was unable to grasp the idea of a time further ahead than the next day survive ?

            • Kitty Catkin

               /  9th January 2020

              ISIS and Islam are not synonymous. The members of ISIS are a small minority of Muslims, even at the largest estimate of their numbers.

              It’s like thinking that all Irish people were IRA members.

      • Why did Donald Trump provoke Iran into striking US troops?

        A New York Times report suggested Mr Trump initially rejected the Soleimani option on December 28.

        “A few days later, Mr Trump watched, fuming, as television reports showed Iranian-backed attacks on the American embassy in Baghdad,” the report said.

        Then, on the way into New Year’s Eve celebrations at his Mar-a-Lago resort in Florida, the President promised: “This will not be a Benghazi.”

        There’s no doubt Iran was flummoxed by the surprise hit on its most powerful and important military man.

        But so were America’s allies.

        Germany is now reducing its troop numbers in Iraq, citing “security reasons”.

        An international NATO training force has moved more than half of its 500 personnel to safer sites outside of Baghdad for the same reasons.

        The bungled release of an unsigned letter, which suggested the US was preparing to pull its troops out of Iraq (it’s not), reeks of an administration caught on the hop and struggling to catch up with the realities of a situation in danger of spiralling out of control.

        America’s allies in the Middle East are unimpressed, to say the least.

        Saudi Arabia’s Deputy Defence Minister raised eyebrows in Washington by tweeting photos of a meeting with Mr Trump in the White House yesterday.

        https://www.abc.net.au/news/2020-01-08/why-donald-trump-provoked-iran-into-striking-us-troops/11850656

        Reply
        • Duker

           /  9th January 2020

          Wheres your critique PG about Trumps ‘indecisiveness’ or is that only for woman leaders ?

          Reply
        • Pink David

           /  9th January 2020

          “Why did Donald Trump provoke Iran into striking US troops?”

          Curious as to how they frame it this way. Iran has clearly never done anything that would provoke any kind of response.

          Reply
    • Pink David

       /  9th January 2020

      He is not very bright. Anyone who has ever done any military work will know the value of ‘a plan’.

      Plans Are Worthless, But Planning Is Everything

      Reply
  4. lurcher1948

     /  9th January 2020

    My wife said Trump should learn to put the orange crap on his face better,in his little speech it looked very patchy and made him look like a clown.

    Reply
    • Corky

       /  9th January 2020

      Your wife should join the Country Women’s Institute. It also has become an irrelevancy with the march of time.

      Reply
      • lurcher1948

         /  9th January 2020

        Are you sure you are not [deleted – don’t try to suggest people’s identities] he posted nasty comments to.

        Reply
  5. Duker

     /  9th January 2020

    Only in the US.
    “He Fled Iran as a Child. Now He’s Commanding a U.S. Aircraft Carrier.
    The aircraft carrier Harry S. Truman could play a role in any military conflict with Iran. Leading its crew is Capt. Kavon Hakimzadeh, who fled Iran during the revolution.”

    Reply
    • Corky

       /  9th January 2020

      He fled America as a child. Now he commands Iran’s largest battleship. Yep, it would never happen. As you say Duke – only in America. I would add – only in the West.

      Reply
      • Duker

         /  9th January 2020

        Immigrant nations, not just ‘west’ After all George Washington was only a few generations from England.

        Reply
      • Kitty Catkin

         /  9th January 2020

        He’s commanding AMERICA’S largest battleship, not IRAN’S largest battleship.

        He fled Iran, not America.

        Don’t try to claim that you meant this to be satirical or anything other that what you said. At best, it was muddled thinking.

        Reply
      • Corky

         /  9th January 2020

        Geez. the situation is worse than I first imagined. The ability to break non linear thought almost is non-existent. I wonder why slip-on shoes were invented?

        Reply
        • Kitty Catkin

           /  10th January 2020

          For people like you, of course. I suppose that jandals are about your level or near enough for you to understand. Your linear thought is not so much that as a flatline.To call it linear would be flattering.

          Reply
    • duperez

       /  9th January 2020

      He’s being feted. But if he were a witness in, say an impeachment hearing, every effort would be made to cast doubt on every fibre in his body, every notion in his mind about being a ‘real’ US citizen or patriot.

      And if he’d been into Canada in the last couple of days and tried to cross the border to get home he would have had problems:

      https://www.vox.com/2020/1/7/21054780/iran-trump-detain-canada-border-soleimani
      https://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-51011029

      Reply
  6. Alan Wilkinson

     /  9th January 2020

    Very bizarre. Trump removes several of the major warmongers and threats to ME peace in return for a symbolic shower of b.s. from Iran which also shoots itself in the foot by killing several hundred of its own people in the process. And PG and the Lefty media are trying to spin this as some sort of blunder by the US???

    And when Trump tells Iran be good or I’ll hit you again this is spun as apeasement? What are you guys smoking?

    Reply
    • Gezza

       /  9th January 2020

      Still a potential time bomb over there.

      Iran’s Foreign Minister has promised a “harsh response” if there is any US retaliation attack – “but proportional”, he quickly added answering reporters’ questions this morning.

      The Iranians notified the Iraqis 30 minutes in advance of the bases they were hitting; both of those bases have bunkers, suggesting they were sending the message that we can kill Americans if we want, but we are deliberately choosing not to at this stage.

      The Iranians are making it clear their full revenge for the killing of Soleimani will be the departure of the US from the Middle East.

      And it seems as likely as not they will continue provoking the US via their various proxies to that end, because they have (so far) survived a revenge attack on the US that the Ayatollah can show to the population as proof of Allah’s help to the devout believers like Soleimani, as he was suggesting would be the case in a televised speech/sermon last night.

      Trump says the US is imposing further immediate sanctions on the Iranian regime pending consideration of other “options for responses to Iranian aggression”, but also that the door is open to negotiations about a new no nukes deal – while the Iranians continue to assert that there can be no negotiations until the US or at least the European parties meet all the terms of the Iran nuclear deal.

      The various parties still seem to be in exactly the same situation which created the assassination crisis in the first place, with both the US & Iran threatening each other, & each one led by people equally likely to respond to retaliatory strikes.

      Reply
      • Alan Wilkinson

         /  9th January 2020

        We will see whether Iran controls its proxies or not. So far it seems to be doing so. It now knows Trump is not likely to turn a blind eye to its depoloyment of them.

        Trump doesn’t care about keeping troops in the ME but he is not going to allow Iran nuclear weapons, to threaten others or to disrupt shipping.

        Reply
        • Gezza

           /  9th January 2020

          Al Jazeera tv reporting sounds of blasts tonight in Baghdad, & that 3 katyusha rockets have just been fired into Badhdad’s Green Zone, according to Iraqi police.

          I don’t think the Iranians are seriously intending to produce nuclear weapons; they know they’ll be attacked before they can develop & deploy them.

          They seem to want to be allowed to be the acknowledged regional power, & as they appear to remain committed to wiping Israel from their Islamic map of the Middle East that’s never going to be allowed by the US.

          Reply
          • Pink David

             /  9th January 2020

            “I don’t think the Iranians are seriously intending to produce nuclear weapons”

            They have spent over $100 billion on it. That’s 25% of their GDP, so the equivalent for the US would be $5 trillion. The Bushehr reactor cost $11bn alone.

            That’s not serious, clearly.

            Reply
            • Gezza

               /  9th January 2020

              Yes, I know they’ve spent a phenomenal amount of their national budget on it; but they’ve also known how closely they’ve been being watched & as far as I can make out they were acknowledged by all the relevant Western experts as having complied completely with the terms of the JCPOA prior to Trump pulling out of the deal.

              And they will still know that if they show any signs of moving to concretely produce a nuclear weapon, their nuclear facilities WILL be attacked.

      • Pink David

         /  9th January 2020

        “The Iranians are making it clear their full revenge for the killing of Soleimani will be the departure of the US from the Middle East.”

        Where is this?

        Reply
      • Pink David

         /  9th January 2020

        “The various parties still seem to be in exactly the same situation which created the assassination crisis in the first place, with both the US & Iran threatening each other, & each one led by people equally likely to respond to retaliatory strikes.”

        You are seriously misreading the situation. Both sides are making threats, but both sides have open doors to something more. You have also missed the simple fact that Soleimani is no longer a factor. Soleimani was not a bit part player, he was a significant policy maker.

        This is possibly the most significant shift in the Middle East since Saudi and Israel became ‘friends’.

        Reply
        • Gezza

           /  9th January 2020

          “You are seriously misreading the situation. Both sides are making threats, but both sides have open doors to something more. You have also missed the simple fact that Soleimani is no longer a factor. Soleimani was not a bit part player, he was a significant policy maker.”

          Both sides have always said the door is open to negotiations – but only on their own unacceptable terms; this is no change.

          Re Soleimani – nobody could miss that he is no longer an actor, but he has been the architect of the power projection & defence system that the Iranians seem to think not only remains viable without him, but that since his martyrdom, they think or hope will deliver what was said to be his avowed aim – removing the US from the region.

          It’s quite bizarre watching the Iranian President Rouhani, Ayatollah Khamenei, addressing supporters, where Rouhani says the real revenge for Soleimani will be the departure of the US from the region in video & Khamenei used the same kind of language in a much longer sermon last night. They really do seem to live in a parallel universe where things look completely different to them & they believe they have widespread international respect & support.

          I’m not advocating for them, PD. I’m just noting stuff that’s not being reported in the West, which is focussed more on what Trump is saying & doing than what they are.

          Reply
  7. Duker

     /  9th January 2020

    Symbolic shower of bs ? Are you talking about Trumps repeated statements that ‘any retaliation’ will lead to the ’52 targets being hit HARD’.
    Now hes offering ‘new negotiations’ on the nuclear treaty ? What his generals have told him is US bases ( and all Us military in region) are vulnerable to barrages of ballistic missiles of which Iran would have 1000s . .. gee even the Youthis in Yemen have 100s

    Who are these major warmongers removed ? has the general who advised sending 3000 more ‘targets’ been sacked

    Reply
    • Alan Wilkinson

       /  9th January 2020

      Are you blind? A shower of missiles that achieved nothing. A shower of media b.s. claiming 80 dead Americans and denying they shot down their own plane.

      Increasing sanctions pressure and demanding a new and better agreement to prevent Iran getting nuclear weapons and/or threatening others. Warning Iran it will be hammered if it or its proxies harm Americans. Its missiles and generals are irrelevant unless the regime is suicidal. The current response shows it is not.

      Reply
    • Pink David

       /  9th January 2020

      ” and all Us military in region) are vulnerable to barrages of ballistic missiles of which Iran would have 1000s . .. gee even the Youthis in Yemen have 100s”

      You do realise these missile are militarily useless don’t you? They really are only a bit more advanced than a WW2 V2. Their accuracy is that they have a reasonable chance of hitting a city.

      Reply
      • Alan Wilkinson

         /  9th January 2020

        Apparently 15-20 of them managed to damage a tent and a helicopter.

        Reply
        • Duker

           /  9th January 2020

          Things have moved on since Sadaams Scuds in the 90s
          The damage is no different to us cruise missiles would do….perhaps Trump has been told this too.
          Yes the troops were in bunkers because Iran told Iraq, Latvia etc an 1 hr before the attacks were launched.
          Tell us about the HUGE destruction from Trump’s missiles? That’s right hes decided to relatiate with new negotiations for Treaty he scrapped. Well that was today’s ‘plan’…no doubt there will be many more ‘tweet barrages’ from the moron in chief

          Reply
          • Alan Wilkinson

             /  9th January 2020

            Oh, just get real, duker. Trump always wanted Iran properly blocked from nuclear weapons, not just delayed as per Obama’s deal. So that has to be scrapped and replaced. He is tightening the screws to make it happen. Perfectly consistent as have been most of his political objectives.

            Reply
          • Pink David

             /  9th January 2020

            “The damage is no different to us cruise missiles would do….perhaps Trump has been told this too.”

            The difference is a US Tomahawk can hit within 1-2m, Iranian Scuds are, best case, hundreds of meters.

            The only time they will be hitting anything worthwhile will be out of pure luck.

            Reply
            • Duker

               /  9th January 2020

              US has ballistic missiles , supposed to be useless are they ?
              https://www.armscontrol.org/factsheets/missiles
              USA
              ATACMS Block I 165km

              ATACMS Block IA 300km

            • Pink David

               /  10th January 2020

              I like how your take my comments on a particular weapon system, the Iranian scud derivatives, then us it to apply to an entirely different system. A single warhead, on an inaccurate rocket that is a direct decendant of the V2 is nothing more than a Boo! weapon.

              ATACMS are not that, they are far more accurate and they are also mostly used to deliver area denial sub-munitions. That is a far more effective system.

              Accuracy is in the tens of meters. Compared to 500m for most of the Iranian Scuds. One of these can reasonably be expected to hit a specific target, the other cannot.

          • Duker

             /  9th January 2020

            Tightening screws with sanctions …..that has been the plan for last 3 years …
            Are you now saying the sanctions havent worked before …. or are you just a rubbish Trump repeater

            Reply
            • Alan Wilkinson

               /  9th January 2020

              Iran used to have oil wealth and the power to survive sanctions. Now it doesn’t.

        • Blazer

           /  9th January 2020

          Al I say Al…the U.S employed Agent Orange,Napalm,and dropped more bombs on Vietnam than the total dropped in WW2 and achieved nothing much, except thousands of grunts(or dumb animals as HK called them) in…body bags.

          Reply
          • Alan Wilkinson

             /  9th January 2020

            Quite. But Trump just takes out the leader and saves a hundred thousand lives.

            Reply
            • Blazer

               /  9th January 2020

              at least you do not suffer from over exuberant,biased ..spin..Al. 😦

            • Alan Wilkinson

               /  9th January 2020

              That’s because I am rational and objective, B.

            • Blazer

               /  9th January 2020

              good pickup..I missed the irrational ,(overexuberance)in the..epithet.

    • Alan Wilkinson

       /  9th January 2020

      I see Iran is estimated to have 200 medium range missiles not thousands. So they just fired 10% of them to save face. Meanwhile the country is bankrupt with inflation running at 40%. Trump has them by the scruff of the neck.

      Reply
      • Gezza

         /  9th January 2020

        “Previously hampered by sanctions, Iran’s missile development programme has recently made significant gains.

        Its domestic military-industrial base has matured as it has sought to become self-sufficient in its missile production.

        Western defence planners estimate Iran’s inventory of short and medium-range ballistic missiles to be slightly over 200, the bulk of which are under the control of the Islamic Revolutionary Guard Corps (IRGC).

        With ranges of up to 2,500km (1,554 miles), the latest missiles, like the Sejjil-2, are solid fuelled. This means the time needed to launch a missile is much shorter, while its range allows it to hit most targets in the Middle East.

        What has surprised most observers is the maturity of Iran’s cruise missile programme, such as the domestically-built Hoveyzeh. With a range of over 1,300km (808 miles), it can fly virtually undetected, skimming the surface, to its target.

        The September attacks on Aramco oil facilities in Saudi Arabia, for which Yemen’s Iran-allied Houthi rebels claimed responsibility, demonstrated great accuracy with most of the cruise missiles hitting their targets with pinpoint precision.

        The success of this attack showed that Iran’s missiles have become fully operational battlefield weapons.”
        https://www.aljazeera.com/indepth/interactive/2020/01/explainer-iran-ballistic-missiles-200108184121600.html

        I think you are right that their economy is on its knees, but what does a desperate theorcratic dictatorship do when it can’t back down & thinks Allah won’t let them lose? That’s the big unknown. They need time to think this through clearly & the Quran is not going to be the best source of advice.

        Reply
        • Kitty Catkin

           /  9th January 2020

          Trump thinks that God is on HIS side and has said so.

          God/Allah can’t be on both sides.

          Reply
          • Gezza

             /  9th January 2020

            God/Allah can’t be on both sides.

            Except that it’s the same God, & he’s been on the side of warring Christian countries & even warring Christian sects for a millenium or so.

            Reply
          • Alan Wilkinson

             /  9th January 2020

            Trump puts much more trust in his missiles than his God.

            Reply
        • Duker

           /  9th January 2020

          “Western defence planners estimate Iran’s inventory of short and medium-range ballistic missiles to be slightly over 200,”

          None of them have any idea ….I was reading yesterday how they said Iran would retaliate only through proxies and avoid direct strike on US forces .

          They were so wrong

          Reply
          • Gezza

             /  9th January 2020

            Well, they were right & they were wrong. I don’t think they do know how many strategic weapons Iran has in total – Iran would keep that information confusing, & many of their missiles are probably well-hidden in tunnels in a mountainous country, I believe.

            But a well-signalled demonstration strike on two bases with US troops that actually did little real damage & caused no US casualties seems to be being debated by “experts” as to whether no casualties was dumb luck, or an indication of how precisely some of their missiles can be targeted, or a bit of both.

            Reply
  8. Alan Wilkinson

     /  9th January 2020

    Obviously the Democrats are far more interested in hamstringing Trump than straightening out Iran. I suspect their posturing will come back to bite them when Trump is seen as winning.

    Reply
    • Blazer

       /  9th January 2020

      how should Iran be ‘straightened out’…same as Iraq?

      Reply
      • Kitty Catkin

         /  9th January 2020

        I don’t see Trump or his sons and grandsons doing any actual fighting.

        Reply
        • Alan Wilkinson

           /  9th January 2020

          Trump doesn’t want any Americans to do any actual fighting except by firing rockets from a very safe distance if necessary, but preferably the threat will make the actuality unnecessary.

          Reply
      • Alan Wilkinson

         /  9th January 2020

        Probably will be like Iraq but that is up to the Iranians. Trump doesn’t care about that, just that they won’t have nuclear weapons, won’t be threatening other countries and won’t be formenting terrorist attacks against Americans.

        Reply
  9. duperez

     /  9th January 2020

    Of course they’re interested in hamstringing Trump. He’s only interested in what’s good for America, no posturing from him. 🙂

    https://www.stuff.co.nz/world/americas/118687048/factchecking-donald-trumps-claim-barack-obama-funded-irans-attack

    Reply
    • Pink David

       /  9th January 2020

      Doesn’t that fact check prove him correct, despite trying not too?

      “Iran did receive money, but the reasons why are nuanced.”

      So they did get the money.

      “The US$150 billion is a false claim Trump has repeatedly made; it actually refers to funds already belonging to Iran that were unfrozen as part of the nuclear deal signed in 2015 after a preliminary agreement in 2013, and it’s on the high end of estimates.”

      So which is it, is it ‘false’, or is it just at the high end of estimates?

      “The US$400 million was paid in cash and flown to Tehran on a cargo plane, which gave rise to Trump’s previous dramatic accounts of money stuffed in barrels or boxes and delivered in the dead of night. The arrangement provided for the interest to be paid later, not crammed into containers.”

      So, hundreds of millions in cash was transported on pallets to Iran.

      “Part of that money was delivered to Iran in controversial circumstances, with the Obama administration using it as leverage for freed hostages. It was likened to ransom, but it was money that Iran was owed.”

      It had been ‘owed’ for decades, no previous administration felt the need to return it. Obama chose to do so as part of his deal.

      Reply
      • Duker

         /  9th January 2020

        Chose to do so ?
        It would have been part of negotiations, clearly Iran wouldnt sign without it as its a huge amount. Us wasnt only partner to agreement . EU, Russia, China as well
        Israel had same sort of problem in the middle 1960s after paying for some Dassault Mirages which were then embargoed by De Gaulle after 6 day war.. They got the money plus interest only in 1972

        Hows those deals Trump is doing with North Korea going ? It was such a success getting Mexico to pay for the wall wasnt it. I suppose Iraq will have to pay US for those military facilities too. Way to go Trumpy

        Reply
        • Alan Wilkinson

           /  9th January 2020

          Trump has succeeded in making Mexico solve the problem by stopping the refugee flow across its country. He has stopped North Korea threatening its neighbours without firing a shot. He has neutered Iran by firing two shots. Evidently he is a heck of a lot smarter and more successful than his critics and predecessors.

          Reply
  10. Kitty Catkin

     /  9th January 2020

    How annoying. Television reception was erratic during the first 10 minutes of the news, so I am little the wiser about what’s been happening.

    Reply
    • Blazer

       /  9th January 2020

      oh well ,just listen to 1ZB and you will know whats going on….or ..will you?

      Reply
      • Kitty Catkin

         /  9th January 2020

        I was able to get it on 3+1, so didn’t need to resort to Joe Redneck on talkback…not that I would have anyway. The picture kept freezing on 1 & 3 at 6pm

        Reply
    • Gezza

       /  9th January 2020

      Well on 1News at 6 the headline item & first up was Prince Harry announcing that he & Meghan will be stepping down from their public roles as “senior royals”, & speculations about why, & reports about the queen’s being reportedly incensed about not being consulted /informed before the announcement was made etc.

      The Iran/US situation was only item number two. And pretty light, I thought.

      Reply
  11. Corky

     /  9th January 2020

    Anyone who didn’t watch 3 News dodged a climate change bullet. Warming; sea temp rises, sea walls. rising water levels.. and the difference between weather and climate:

    ”Whereas weather refers to short-term changes in the atmosphere, climate describes what the weather is like over a long period of time in a specific area. Different regions can have different climates. … And, we refer to these three-decade averages of weather observations as Climate Normals.”

    There’s a hole in this cosy, and on the surface completely rational explanation, but I have little interest pursuing it. What’s the point…given the saturation coverage on 3 News tonight. The scammers are in complete control.

    Reply
    • Kitty Catkin

       /  9th January 2020

      No, the difference between weather and climate is not a scam, it’s a purely factual description.

      Reply
    • Corky

       /  10th January 2020

      Maybe the news should have reported concurrently with their CC extravaganza that 183 Aussies have be charge/fined for reckless activities that could contribute to starting fires.
      24 are alleged to have started fires deliberately. These idiots obviously have been struck down with CC fever.

      Talkback reports that fines for this type of offence are severe.

      Reply
    • Corky

       /  10th January 2020

      ”https://www.newshub.co.nz/home/new-zealand/2020/01/wellington-s-crumbling-seawalls-losing-the-climate-change-fight-experts.html.”

      James Renwick is not an engineer.

      ”A natural hazards advisor from Greater Wellington Regional Council.” That could be anyone
      with a few letters who applies for the job. And what is the ultimate use of this job. Will it stop an earth quake?

      ”Scientists predict the sea will rise 50 centimetres in the next 50 years.”

      Predict..Predict..Predict… So many predictions already in the waste paper basket.

      Now here’s a dumb question I have thought about – why are these sea walls crumbling?
      Could part of the problem be they are old? Poorly constructed? Didn’t have regular maintenance? Why is it beyond these fuggwit reporters to ask these questions?

      ”For some communities, James Renwick said those conversations may include the prospect of moving away from the coast because it’s the “best way” to deal with it.”

      He means the ”only” solution from his perspective I can’t think of any others unless houses are put on moored pontoons.

      Reply
  12. Alan Wilkinson

     /  10th January 2020

    So now it’s a slam-dunk certainty that Iran shot down its own passenger jet with Russian missiles the obvious question is why the big Lefty mass media tiptoed around or plain ignored that probability for so long.

    Didn’t suit their agenda of attacking Trump and supporting Iran?

    Reply
    • “the obvious question is why the big Lefty mass media tiptoed around or plain ignored that probability for so long”

      Because no facts were known?

      Speculation of blame with no evidence in the highly charged period just after the missile attacks and the plane came down would have been irresponsible in any circumstances, but especially so given Trump’s habit of reacting to news and media.

      Reply
      • Alan Wilkinson

         /  10th January 2020

        Aviation experts were quick to say the known facts didn’t match an engine fire. Can’t see any connection between perceptions of Trump’s habits and proper journalism. Trump said nothing about it.

        Reply
        • Blazer

           /  10th January 2020

          yesterday you were saying the..opposite.

          Reply
          • Alan Wilkinson

             /  10th January 2020

            When I saw the first video I thought the light the video was tracking from the start could have been interpreted as an engine fire. But obviously it wasn’t anything abnormal until the rocket hit.

            Reply
  13. Conspiratoor

     /  10th January 2020

    Forget donald and his brain farts, this is one threat the mullas know to take seriously. Anyone disagree?

    “Iran will suffer ‘crushing blow’ if it attacks Israel, Netanyahu warns”

    https://www.timesofisrael.com/iran-will-suffer-crushing-blow-if-it-attacks-israel-netanyahu-warns/

    Reply
  14. Alan Wilkinson

     /  10th January 2020

    Google just fed me this nonsense:
    https://www.newshub.co.nz/home/world/2020/01/iran-completely-called-trump-s-bluff-international-expert.html

    What a drivelling idiot this “international expert” is although I guess you wouldn’t expect much more from New Zealand’s epicentre of Lefty wokeness, Waikato Uni. Hard to get everything so wrong but he’s managed it. God help his students.

    Reply
    • Corky

       /  10th January 2020

      Robert Patman and this rooster… the go-to oracles for New Zealand’s media. It’s like the crush our media has on Clive Matthew-Wilson. Someone needs to tell them these guys aren’t the only experts in the country.

      Reply
  15. Trump’s assassination of Soleimani is a success for Iran. It accomplished what the ayatollah could not:

    1. establishing common ground between Iran and Iraq
    2. the US military may be pushed out of Iraq (allowing Suleimani to achieve in death one of his foremost goals in life)
    3. an end to Iranian protests against the regime’s economic policies
    4. A resumption of Iran’s nuclear programme
    5. broad support for retaliation against the US air strike
    6. A halt to the military campaign against ISIS, giving terrorists a chance to regroup
    7. further division in Washington over Trump’s Middle East policy, including renewed calls for restraining him from attacking Iran

    As well as that, North Korea has gained leverage, because it knows that Trump has little appetite for two international security crises at the same time.

    Topping all that off, the US war machine has lost credibility as a result of the confused and contradictory messaging:

    1. General Seely’s draft letter stating that the US would be “repositioning forces over the course of the coming days and weeks to prepare for onward movement,” specifically “movement out of Iraq versus Esper’s comment that “there’s been no decision made to leave Iraq.”
    2. Trump’s statement he would target Iran’s cultural sites (a war crime) versus Pompeo’s denial that cultural sites would be targeted
    3. The “imminent threat” that no-one can name. Pompeo: “we don’t know precisely when, we don’t know precisely when” versus another rambling Trump statement: “I can reveal that I believe it would have been four embassies … we will tell you that probably it was going to be the Embassy in Baghdad.” (As if we should believe a man who has been recorded telling upwards of 15,000 lies in only three years of office).

    Even Trump’s own Republican senators question the move, e.g. Sen. Mike Lee’s “the worst briefing, at least on a military issue, I’ve seen”

    Adding to all that, Trumps latest speech on the conflict was a wash-out:
    1. more futile sanctions that can only drive Iran closer to China
    2. more lies about Obama’s Iran policy
    3. more vain boasts about US military power, oil independence, and of course
    4. more vain boasts about Trump’s ‘exceptional foreign policy leadership’

    His speech offered Iran no reason to move relations out of the danger zone.

    And now we have the Wall Street Journal writing that “Mr. Trump, after the strike, told associates he was under pressure to deal with Gen. Soleimani from GOP senators he views as important supporters in his coming impeachment trial in the Senate.”

    Could the real truth here be that the president ordered Suleimani’s death and brought the Middle East to the brink of another futile US war all because he was impeached? Colour me unsurprised if that’s the truth.

    Reply

Leave a Reply

Fill in your details below or click an icon to log in:

WordPress.com Logo

You are commenting using your WordPress.com account. Log Out /  Change )

Google photo

You are commenting using your Google account. Log Out /  Change )

Twitter picture

You are commenting using your Twitter account. Log Out /  Change )

Facebook photo

You are commenting using your Facebook account. Log Out /  Change )

Connecting to %s