Open Forum – 5 March

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78 Comments

  1. Reply
  2. Duker

     /  5th March 2020

    “Swarbrick will today submit a member’s bill calling on all public funds to divest from companies directly involved in the mining and production of fossil fuels.”

    So there theres no ‘false concerns’ there , they have specified ‘mining and production’ only.
    Will Newsroom do a beatup over the Greens using the same language as the government policy and going on about ‘minor details’ ……whats the bet they DONT.

    Reply
    • Alan Wilkinson

       /  5th March 2020

      There’s nothing like a bit of moral posturing to gladden a Lefty’s heart.

      Reply
  3. seer

     /  5th March 2020

    Turkey’s “democracy” at “play”

    4 March 2020
    Istanbul News

    A fight broke out with hands after the Vice President of the Republican People’s Party, Engin Ozkoc, attacked Turkish President Recep Tayyip Erdogan during his speech at the Parliamentary General Assembly in Istanbul, this evening, Wednesday.
    According to the details reported by “Dogan” agency and translated “Turkey Now”, the proposal submitted by Ozkoc on the security of Turkish soldiers in the city of “Idlib” in northern Syria, angered the Justice and Development Party deputies.

    Turkey’s abandonment of its “No problems with its neighbors” foreign policy not so good for it own stability – or perhaps because of its own instability?

    Reply
  4. Alan Wilkinson

     /  5th March 2020
    Reply
    • Blazer

       /  5th March 2020

      As usual Jones is WRONG…his so called ‘market economy’ since the 80’s is a FAILURE!

      De regulation because the market was a perfect balance of self interested supply and demand was a sham construct that culminated in the GFC….the biggest rescue of the vaunted, private, efficient business model promoted as the path to prosperity ever.

      The inevitable repercussions of this fiscal folly are yet to manifest….but cannot be delayed indefinitely.

      Reply
      • Corky

         /  5th March 2020

        I can’t help but agree with the last two sentences in Sir Bob’s article. No need for debate. If the Left was RIGHT, people would be voting for them. They aren’t..because many remember what nearly happened to this country under the leadership of our greatest socialist…Rob Muldoon.

        Reply
      • Alan Wilkinson

         /  5th March 2020

        GFC created by Obama’s loony Left policies of lending to people who couldn’t afford it, corrected as usual by the market to the consternation of people like B who then claim that as a disaster rather than the solution it is.

        The alternative of course is just the continuous decline to poverty and death that his national socialism has everywhere achieved.

        Reply
        • Duker

           /  5th March 2020

          You have your dates mixed up
          The GFC occurred before Obama won office in Jan 2009

          April 2007: New Century, an American REIT specialising in sub-prime mortgages, filed for bankruptcy
          March 17, 2008: The Federal Reserve guaranteed Bear Stearns’ bad loans to facilitate its acquisition by JPMorgan Chase.
          September 7, 2008: Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac were taken over by the federal government.
          September 15, 2008: Lehman Brothers went bankrupt after the Federal Reserve declined to guarantee its loans
          September 16, 2008: The Federal Reserve took over American International Group. ( as they couldnt honour the insurance on loan defaults)
          September 26, 2008: Washington Mutual went bankrupt after a bank run.

          And on Jan 2009 Obama took office
          Pray tell how GW Bush administration was doing ‘Obamas looney left policies’
          They didnt of course

          as for blame the enquiry said this, a small amount lent to low income borrowers wasnt the triggering factor
          “The Financial Crisis Inquiry Commission concluded that the financial crisis was avoidable and was caused by “widespread failures in financial regulation and supervision”, “dramatic failures of corporate governance and risk management at many systemically important financial institutions”, “a combination of excessive borrowing, risky investments, and lack of transparency” by financial institutions, ill preparation and inconsistent action by government that “added to the uncertainty and panic”, a “systemic breakdown in accountability and ethics”, “collapsing mortgage-lending standards and the mortgage securitization pipeline”, deregulation of over-the-counter derivatives, especially credit default swaps, and “the failures of credit rating agencies” to correctly price risk-
          https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Financial_crisis_of_2007%E2%80%9308#Background_causes

          Reply
        • Griff.

           /  6th March 2020

          GFC created by Obama’s loony Left policies of lending to people who couldn’t afford it

          Yip.
          GFC 2007 to 2008 Obama inaugurated as president January 2009.
          A Obama time traveled to before his election and caused the GFC .
          B loony right wing delusion.

          As far as I know travel back in time is impossible due to physics.
          That leaves B.

          Reply
          • Alan Wilkinson

             /  6th March 2020

            Congress makes the laws not the President’s administration of them. It pressured Fannie and Freddie to make the bad loans that fell over when interest rates rose and brought the rest of the flakey instruments built on top of them crashing down.

            Reply
  5. Alan Wilkinson

     /  5th March 2020

    Trump.wins again:
    https://theintercept.com/2020/03/02/on-afghanistan-three-words-i-never-thought-id-write-bravo-donald-trump/

    At least a change of course if not an arrival at the destination.

    Reply
    • Blazer

       /  5th March 2020

      yes Trump bit the bullet and accepted the Taleban’s terms for the withdrawal of the U.S invading forces.Well done.

      Reply
      • Alan Wilkinson

         /  5th March 2020

        Trump as ever the realist vs his fantasist opponents.

        Reply
        • Duker

           /  5th March 2020

          George W Bush signed a withdrawal agreement in Iraq just before the election too…how did that turn out

          Remember the 1973 Peace agreement with US and North Vietnam?
          “On May 8, 1972, President Nixon made a major concession to North Vietnam by announcing that the U.S. would accept a cease-fire in place as a precondition for its military withdrawal. In other words, the U.S. would withdraw its forces from South Vietnam without North Vietnam doing the same…… wikipedia
          And how did that turn out

          Reply
          • Alan Wilkinson

             /  5th March 2020

            Probably saved a lot of lives, Duker. Unlike the bombing of Cambodia which led to the vile and evil Lefty Pol Pot regime.

            Reply
            • Duker

               /  5th March 2020

              But lets call it for its was . US defeat
              Cambodia?
              “Newly inaugurated President Richard Nixon [1969] authorized for the first time use of long-range Boeing B-52 Stratofortress heavy bombers to carpet bomb Cambodia.”
              https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Operation_Menu

              and again your history is as bads as Trumps memory….
              “The deposition of Sihanouk by the Cambodian National Assembly in March 1970, following wide scale protests in the capital against the presence of PAVN troops in the country, put a pro-American government in power (later declared the Khmer Republic) which demanded that the PAVN leave Cambodia. The PAVN refused and, at the request of the Khmer Rouge, promptly invaded Cambodia in force….
              Between March and June 1970, the North Vietnamese captured most of the northeastern third of the country in engagements with the Cambodian army. The North Vietnamese turned over some of their conquests and provided other assistance to the Khmer Rouge, thus empowering what was at the time a small guerrilla movement…” Thats Pol Pots group

              https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cambodian_Civil_War

              So it was more the presence of PAVN troops which was a trigger. But like Syria Civil war was existing internal conflicts set in motion by US Invasion of Iraq, the US presence in Vietnam was bound to led to disruption in Cambodia

            • Alan Wilkinson

               /  5th March 2020

              Plenty of disagreement with that:
              .https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Operation_Menu

            • Duker

               /  5th March 2020

              That was my link and my quotes….like your memory about GFC, the story supports a different view to yours

            • Alan Wilkinson

               /  5th March 2020

              So you quoted selectively. E.g.
              Result
              Strategic US Failure

              PAVN/VC, civilian and material losses
              Failure to prevent North Vietnamese forces from operating in the country
              Failure to kill COSVN leadership

              and
              The consequences of U.S. bombing of Cambodia, positive and negative, are still widely debated by participants and scholars …

              Author William Shawcross and other commentors asserted that the “Khmer Rouge were born out of the inferno that American policy did much to create” and that Sihanouk’s “collaboration with both powers [the United States and North Vietnam] … was intended to save his people by confining the conflict to the border regions. It was American policy that engulfed the nation in war.” …

              Apart from the large human toll, perhaps the most powerful and direct impact of the bombing was the political backlash it caused … The CIA’s Directorate of Operations, after investigations south of Phnom Penh, reported in May 1973 that the communists there were successfully ‘using damage caused by B-52 strikes as the main theme of their propaganda’ … The U.S. carpet bombing of Cambodia was partly responsible for the rise of what had been a small-scale Khmer Rouge insurgency, which now grew capable of overthrowing the Lon Nol government …[69]

              Shawcross’s and Kiernan’s views were echoed in a 2011 statistical study of U.S. bombing in Vietnam which concluded that the air war “was counterproductive … hampered the pacification campaign and more of it would likely have hastened the communist victory”

          • Alan Wilkinson

             /  5th March 2020

            That was why I called it a change of course only. Water to flow yet.

            Reply
            • Gezza

               /  5th March 2020

              I doubt one could rely on the Taliban to stick with any deal. At the very time you’d think they’d at least want to humour Trump for a few months by giving the appearance of negotiating with Kabul & maintaining a ceasefire, they (or some uncontrolled faction in Hemland) immediately go all out to attack the US’s official government allies. They perhaps have assumed Trump’s going to pull out Afghanistan whatever happens.

            • Duker

               /  5th March 2020

              Wasnt the ‘negotiating with terrorists’ thing a big no no under Trump ?

              Oh dear
              “The Taliban’s actions over the past two decades fit the definition of terrorism as unlawful, violent action, often undertaken against citizens. It commits indiscriminate acts of violence against civilians with the goal of achieving political change.
              Yep …another of Trumps flip-flop-flips

              This is what the taleban want and Donny has given them that…
              “It intends to establish an Islamic Emirate that operates under sharia law and seeks to expand the Muslim caliphate across the globe.”

              maybe a new chapter in the “Art of the Deal’ …hahahahaha
              https://www.realcleardefense.com/articles/2020/01/23/new_terrorism_in_the_wake_of_withdrawal_114990.html

            • Gezza

               /  5th March 2020

              An interesting review of the Trump peace deal & previous administrations attempts to negoiate with the Taliban.

              https://www.theatlantic.com/politics/archive/2020/02/united-states-taliban-afghanistan-peace-deal/607234/

            • Alan Wilkinson

               /  5th March 2020

              Bush the Idiot famously threatened to bomb Afghanistan back to the stone age thus revealing his ignorance that it was already there. Way before all this began a student mate of mine travelled through the country and told me it was full of wild men with old rifles. When the US leaves it will be the same except with more modern weapons.

  6. lurcher1948

     /  5th March 2020

    Hell this person seems to think hes fit to be PM….i dont think so
    https://thespinoff.co.nz/politics/04-03-2020/some-advice-for-simon-bridges-on-being-responsible-in-a-health-emergency/
    Simon YOU rush out to buy dunny paper,and get TV to film it

    Reply
  7. lurcher1948

     /  5th March 2020

    HI PG, the other day you posted a post on GD Kiwiblog that i thought was well thought out, but a OLD failed disgraced MP called david garrett, called you a shrill, hes a nasty but kiwi blog abused you,but let’s move on to the psychotic weirdo alt rightwing blog called YSB they abuse David Farrar and Kiwi Blog with a vengeance, so PG a failure in life david garrett a righty abuses you and the halfwit at YSB,called holly sheet abuses David Farrar…you righties are devouring yourselves….but if you are a gun-toting old white male supremacist, you are made UNTILL COMRADE ARDERN COMES TO HOOVER THE TOSSERS UP

    PS PG let it have birth

    Reply
    • lurcher1948

       /  5th March 2020

      Im breathless

      Reply
    • Corky

       /  5th March 2020

      .Lurchy..have you been starting your scooter in a confined space again?

      Reply
      • Kitty Catkin

         /  7th March 2020

        Lurch’s two cars are not mobility scooters. Surely you know the difference…and that mobiltity scooters are battery operated.

        Reply
  8. National MP David Bennett says stupid things on radio:

    And then denies he has said them (as shown on One news but not online yet).

    Reply
    • Duker

       /  5th March 2020

      I couldn’t believe it when I saw it…his claims of not saying it ..twice with separate comments, was followed directly with the audio of him saying it.
      How come some a the deadwood seems to stay around in spite of claims of contary.
      I guess he will be going on stress leave from tonight to keep him out of sight

      Reply
    • duperez

       /  5th March 2020

      I can’t see why David Bennett is criticised for saying stupid things on radio. He doesn’t seem to get criticised for saying stupid things in Parliament.
      At times I’ve seen him in action there and wondered how someone so experienced could be so dumb.

      Reply
    • Kitty Catkin

       /  5th March 2020

      Well, he did correct himself and say ‘stocking up’.

      Reply
      • Kitty Catkin

         /  5th March 2020

        It was hardly ‘encouraging’ panic buying; more a lapsus linguae.

        Reply
        • Duker

           /  5th March 2020

          Hmmmm…it’s big fat lies that’s the issue now
          Then again he’s from the Tron

          Reply
  9. Non-ministerial Green MPs’ average flight-spending trumps other backbenchers

    Davidson, who co-leads the party with James Shaw, who is a minister, said because the Greens only have eight MPs, “we always tried to get out and about, but certainly with eight MPs it’s quite tough and we have to try and spread ourselves as much as possible”.

    The latest parliamentary expense disclosure shows that, on average, Green Party list MPs are outspending Labour, National and New Zealand First list MPs on air travel.

    The average air travel spending for non-ministerial Green Party list MPs was $9816, compared to New Zealand First’s $8059, and National’s $7332, and Labour’s $6499.

    https://www.newshub.co.nz/home/politics/2020/03/non-ministerial-green-mps-average-flight-spending-trumps-other-backbenchers.html

    David Seymour, MP for Epsom, told Newshub: “The Green Party has always specialised in air travel and hypocrisy – in that order.”

    Reply
    • At the same time they are trying to legislate against investment in fossil fuels:

      “New Zealanders want to know that the Government is taking action to prevent a climate crisis. But despite strong evidence that we cannot afford to keep burning coal, oil and gas, billions of dollars in public money is still being invested in fossil fuel industries.

      “The Green Party in government has achieved default KiwiSavers divestment from fossil fuels, but we know we need to go further and faster to truly address the climate change challenge.

      “That’s why today we are announcing legislation that will see all public funds divested from fossil fuel industries. Leadership starts at the top, and if our government cannot begin to move away from these industries, how can we expect the rest of New Zealand to?

      https://www.greens.org.nz/greens_celebrate_kiwisaver_divestment_win_call_for_further_and_faster_action

      Reply
      • Duker

         /  5th March 2020

        I bet newsroom won’t be doing a beatup on this version of exactly what they ran against labour’s version just a few days ago….no, greens get kid gloves from the millennial media

        Reply
  10. Corky

     /  5th March 2020

    I wrote a few days ago that in a crisis toilet rolls and tea bags become the new gold. In some parts of Aussie toilet rolls are already fetching $5 each.

    Who’s laughing at preppers now? 😪🙄

    https://www.thechronicle.com.au/news/photo-proves-australians-arent-listening/3958449/

    Reply
    • Blazer

       /  5th March 2020

      they must really be shitting themselves…over there.

      Reply
      • Alan Wilkinson

         /  5th March 2020

        .. or planning to.

        Reply
      • Corky

         /  5th March 2020

        Kind of surprising. I didn’t expect that from the Aussies. 😁

        Reply
        • Alan Wilkinson

           /  5th March 2020

          Dunno. They were brought up bowling underarm, ball tampering and pretending Kiwi champions were their own

          Reply
  11. Corky

     /  5th March 2020

    Holy Horrors..dead language may be dropped from NCEA. 😄

    Quote:

    ”The MoE has suggested scrapping the teaching of Latin, Classical Studies and Art History but adding a Māori Performing Arts option for students.”

    Yet…people laugh at me for saying Western culture is under attack. Well, what the fug is this?

    https://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=12310357

    Reply
    • Duker

       /  5th March 2020

      At level 1 only.
      Probably numbers have been dropping for years now not sustainable . Would still be available at higher levels but university’s are dropping those subjects too due to lack of demand

      Reply
      • Alan Wilkinson

         /  5th March 2020

        My sixth subject at School Cert. It did well to.last 2000 years though. Now the world will have to rely on Google Translate. When you outsource core knowledge you are left at the mercy or otherwise of the outsourcer. Govt depts have discovered this.

        Reply
        • duperez

           /  6th March 2020

          Quite nice how little flickers of interest and support for Latin have appeared. Something that was out of date, of no use, a waste of time and space, an anachronism, suddenly gained status and importance because under the present government The Ministry of Education proposed a number of changes to the year 11 curriculum. (I couldn’t find the MoE suggesting the total scrapping the teaching of Latin.)

          I still have my form three textbook in the library. Got to say it’s as battered by time as it’s owner! 🙂

          Reply
          • Kitty Catkin

             /  6th March 2020

            The story is hardly news. it was posted by Corky when it happened and he did the Western culture is under attack thing then. I don’t know why he posted it again; has he forgotten that he did it before ?

            Latin is of use if only as great training for the mind. I have a copy of Winnie Ille Pu and one of Alicia in Terra Mirabilis. Dupe, did you do the altering Latin to Eating in your texts ? I bet that you can still recite Mensa, mensa, mensam etc. And laugh at Caesar adsum jam forte/Pompey aderat/Caesar sic in omnibus/Pompey inissat.

            Supposedly seen on a park bench; Ventosa viri, restabit, fortis arare placet orestin….

            Reply
            • Duker

               /  6th March 2020

              Just looked up a local college for 2020 which has an academic bent
              Languages level 1
              French
              Japanese
              Maori
              Samoan
              Spanish

              Interesting at Level 3 they offer
              Financial Mathematics in addition to ordinary Math
              and
              Geography
              History
              Psychology
              Classical Studies
              Art History
              Travel and Tourism

              No Latin anywhere

            • Kitty Catkin

               /  6th March 2020

              How sad. It’s been described as gymnastics for the brain.

              It may be included in Classical Studies, of course.

  12. Breaking News: Jeanette Fitzsimons ex-Greens co-leader has passed away (75)

    ‘a mighty tree has fallen’ 😦

    Reply
    • Corky

       /  6th March 2020

      Great person. True to her ideology without being nasty. The divide between her and the present Green Party is vast. In my opinion, Marama Davidson is not worthy of Jeanette’s legacy.

      Reply
      • I almost agree.. must be first 🙂

        we need to remember that many in ‘authority/power’ often stand on the shoulders of GIANTS

        Reply
      • Corky

         /  6th March 2020

        She even signed up for a natural burial. No chemicals or treated wood coffins. That’s what you call commitment to your beliefs.

        Reply
    • Alan Wilkinson

       /  6th March 2020

      First met her in 1975 Values Conference. Very idealistic but genuine and considerate. She stayed that way.

      Reply
      • Kitty Catkin

         /  6th March 2020

        Muslims have had those things for their burials forever. They don’t have coffins, just a shroud.

        Reply
      • Corky

         /  6th March 2020

        Yes,most of us know that. However, it is rare for Westerners. Hence me mentioning it.

        Reply
        • Kitty Catkin

           /  6th March 2020

          It’s not that rare now. Natural burials have been in for some years. As have cardboard coffins and plain pine ones.

          Reply
  13. Corky

     /  6th March 2020

    Crikey, I have been affected indirectly by the CoronaVirus for the first time. I walked into my local health shop to see some worried customers. The owner said 25% of their stock was affected by uncertainty of supply. For example, I went in to replenish my nutritional yeast stock. That product comes from Estonia. The NZ supplier has reported no product will be exported from Estonia for the time being. The big worry for people like me is continuity of supply from Japan of the worlds best Q10 product. Without that my CV system will age about 20 years to match my actual age in years. Not good. Some people on Statins will notice their health decline rapidly, too.

    That brings us to a bigger problem. Will pharmaceutical drugs soon be affected by supply issues?

    Reply
      • Kitty Catkin

         /  6th March 2020

        Try Countdown. They sell nutritional yeast.

        Reply
      • Corky

         /  6th March 2020

        Yes, they do. But it’s not organic and is fortified with either B12 or other synthetic B vitamins.
        That said, if things get bad I may have to use this product.

        Reply
        • Corky

           /  6th March 2020

          In fact it seem like Countdown does not sell NY at the moment.

          Reply
          • Kitty Catkin

             /  6th March 2020

            They say that they do as of five minutes ago. No mention of Vitamin B (which is in yeast anyway, isn’t it ?)

            You may have to resign yourself to looking like Gagool as your real age catches up with you.

            Reply
          • Corky

             /  6th March 2020

            https://shop.countdown.co.nz/shop/searchproducts?search=Nutritional%20yeast%20

            ”Nutritional yeast is a great source of protein, B vitamins and trace minerals. Fortified nutritional yeast contains more B vitamins than unfortified varieties, as extra amounts are added during manufacturing. … When fortified, it is especially rich in thiamine, riboflavin, niacin, vitamin B6 and vitamin B12.Nov 30, 2017”

            I actually eat the stuff. Another name is Nooch. In NZ it was called Bufax? Vegans rely on this product big time. At least those who know it exists do.

            Reply
            • Kitty Catkin

               /  6th March 2020

              Suit yourself if you want to look like Gagool rather than change brands.

            • Corky

               /  6th March 2020

              ”Nutritional yeast” is not brewers or bakers yeast. NY yeast is dead.

        • Blazer

           /  6th March 2020

          so long as they don’t run out of your nutritious staple=raspberry buns..you’ll be..o.k.

          Reply
          • Corky

             /  7th March 2020

            I can almost see your stale white Tip Top bread on the plate. Topped with Sanitarium Peanut Butter. A spread that is one process away from becoming plastic, and filled with additives. As long as the raspberry bun is organic in all regards and made with Grander Water (TM), I will be OK.

            Reply
            • Kitty Catkin

               /  7th March 2020

              The NY Countdown is advertising is called Nutritional Yeast, not bakers’ or brewers’ yeast.

              You are confusing types with brands.

            • Corky

               /  7th March 2020

              My apologies. Please supply a link….as I have.

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