Open Forum Wednesday

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81 Comments

  1. David

     /  3rd June 2020

    The chaos in the US has nothing to do with police brutality, Trump, Floyd, racism it is opportunists in Democrat run areas who know their political leaders dont have the guts to crack down on the looting.
    The city where Floyd was murdered has been run by Democrats for 50 years, the Democrats have run the police force for that many years and its nothing new that they had issues that do nothing Democrats have ignored. Too many places in the US where the only form of democracy is for who gets the Democrat nomination and these areas are turning into sewers. San Fran and others have turned into wastelands of human misery and the disparity between rich and poor is something few other developed countries would tolerate, I have been a few times and its jarring. Multi millionaire card carrying Democrats can literally walk out of the front door of their outrageously priced houses and step over a mentally ill drug addict who has shat themselves.
    Been to New York a few times and its heading the same way under De Blasio which is so sad after decades long clean ups had turned it into a beautiful city. Have a look at the pictures in this article and find me a reason why looting these stores, who all had their Instagram pages displaying their suppport for the protestors, has anything to do with what happened to Floyd.

    https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-8379935/Manhattan-looters-Midtown-designer-stores-including-Coach-Balenciaga.html

    Reply
    • artcroft

       /  3rd June 2020

      Half right. Nothing to do with the democrats. It’s the Republican corporates who select Republican candidates, who in turn, select their voters via gerrymandering, that have broken the American political system. Its’s a cynical system designed to enable Wall St to indenture the population. The whole system is designed to ensure young people arrive in a state of debt at the earliest possible age which Wall St repackages and grifts off. And if you don’t pay Wall St gets the govt to through you into prison for your crimes.
      The young can see the mess and injustice and are rioting.

      Reply
      • Alan Wilkinson

         /  3rd June 2020

        Another inconvenient truth: Democrats run the biggest corporations and comprise most of the wealthiest entertainers and celebrities.

        Reply
    • Blame the Democrats for everything? That’s one of the most ridiculous partisan diversions I’ve seen. It’s a very complex problem in the US. To say it is nothing to do with the callous killing of George Floyd, police violence or racism is gobsmacking ignorance, or dirty political game playing.

      “The death of George Floyd on the streets of Minneapolis was a grave tragedy. It should never have happened. It has filled Americans all over the country with horror, anger and grief.”

      https://edition.cnn.com/2020/05/31/politics/trump-george-floyd-protests/index.html

      Reply
      • David

         /  3rd June 2020

        What has looting Coach stores in Manhatten to do with Floyd ?
        How has that helped the cause ? There was universal condemnation of the copper so why torch buildings ?
        From Trump down everyone is on the same page until anarchists and opportunists were allowed to cause total chaos in Democrat cities.
        Floyd’s death will change nothing as the commentariat can just blame Trump and not the actual people responsible for policing…the democrat governor in case it’s been forgotten.

        Reply
        • artcroft

           /  3rd June 2020

          No not everyone is on the same page. Just a month ago video emerged showing a black jogger being hunted down and killed on a Georgia Street. Outrage followed, followed by the execution of George Floyd.

          Reply
      • Alan Wilkinson

         /  3rd June 2020

        Does anyone still take CNN seriously?

        Obviously the sickening, callous killing of Floyd was the trigger. Equally obviously that was entirely the responsibility of successive Democrat city and state administrations. So too the failures nationwide to maintain law and order in the big cities. All of that is plain and undeniable.

        Despite those facts the Democrat elite and their media colleagues launched into a ridiculous “Blame Trump” campaign.

        Yes, it is complex but those basic facts are undeniable. This one too: the Democrat administrations, elite and their media have been supporting and imposing relentless virus lockdowns which have hit the poor hardest while Trump and the Republicans have tried to avoid and lift them.

        Reply
  2. Gerrit

     /  3rd June 2020

    What David said +1. Be interesting to know what others think the end game will be. Will Trump resign? Will the looting carry on for months? Or simply run its course and nothing changes?

    Noting that all previous attempts at great social change by looting has not changed a single thing, any reason this latest bout will lead to any change at all?

    Will the military intervene? Even stage a coup (unlikely)?

    Being a USA rail fan and watching their extensive live rail camera feed’s (i know pretty sad sack), the large increase in military trains moving material around, increased greatly last month. Not till you see a single military train can you really appreciate the size and strength of the military in the USA. There were many many train movements like this last month. These are just Army and National Guard movements, add the unseen air force and navy capacity and civil war might be closer than one thinks. Not as many trains lately.

    Reply
    • Gezza

       /  3rd June 2020

      Noting that all previous attempts at great social change by looting has not changed a single thing, any reason this latest bout will lead to any change at all?

      Even allowing for David’s sudden ridiculous brain explosion above, that’d have to be one of the daftest things I’ve read so far on the many ills of America.

      Opportunistic criminals & have-nothings looting & taking advantage of mayhem during the outpouring of outrage against yet more attrocious & racist bad cop behaviour in the US is a symptom, not a cause, of this mess. Looting has never been intended to bring about social change.

      The wealth & power disparities in the US are extreme. The politicians including Trump are all shite. It’s a screwed up society. Every so often the lid blows off.

      Reply
      • Alan Wilkinson

         /  3rd June 2020

        So if burning buildings is not pressing for social change what is it?

        Reply
        • Gezza

           /  3rd June 2020

          Arson.

          Reply
          • Alan Wilkinson

             /  3rd June 2020

            Rubbish. Arson is random, this isn’t.

            Reply
            • Gezza

               /  3rd June 2020

              Arson is arson.

            • Gezza

               /  3rd June 2020

              And arsonists frequently commit morecthan one act of arson, even here in NZ.

            • Alan Wilkinson

               /  3rd June 2020

              Irrelevant nonsense, G. Arsonists are just nutters who get a kick out of fires. This lot are on a “burn because I hate you” trip. Give up now.

            • Gezza

               /  3rd June 2020

              How would you know? You are guessing & choosing a scenario that suits your politics. Link me to an arrest & conviction that constitutes your evidence.

            • Alan Wilkinson

               /  3rd June 2020

              You are flannelling to support your nonsense.

            • Gezza

               /  3rd June 2020

              So no evidence then.

              Arsonists aren’t burning buildings to bring about social change. They’re setting fire to buildings because they’re fkn arsonists. They don’t give a fkying fk about who’ll lose their jobs and all that shit. Plenty of people protesting & even attacking cop cars aren’t arsonists.

            • Alan Wilkinson

               /  3rd June 2020

              No, as I said these are not arsonists who like fires, they are haters who think they are getting revenge for perceived social injustice to themselves.

            • Gezza

               /  3rd June 2020

              People who deliberately set fire to buildings are committing arson. They are arsonists.

              You’re confusing them with serial arsonists.

            • Alan Wilkinson

               /  3rd June 2020

              I’m not confusing anything. I’m telling you what motivates these people which is hatred of the existing social order. Now give up gracefully

      • Alan Wilkinson

         /  3rd June 2020

        Is a society more screwed up if the lid blows off occasionally or if it doesn’t?

        Reply
        • duperez

           /  3rd June 2020

          The lid naturally blows off like a 4 or 7 year old or teenager having a ‘coming to terms with the world’ tantrum.

          What caused this one wasn’t being told to go to bed but that some black guy got killed on the street. Another one. Getting a bit uppity about it all they are, they’re supposed to just accept it. Some white folks haven’t read the narrative and aren’t playing the game as it’s supposed to go.

          In the gloom some bright moments. The loaves and fishes story came to mind yesterday when I saw the Bible being brandished. It was raised and held and I expected a booming voice from somewhere to proclaim, ‘And lo it was a miracle, peace descended upon the land. ‘

          Reply
      • David

         /  3rd June 2020

        The point is that the rioting and looting has allowed the Democrats and the media to go after Trump. So now the people responsible for policing in Minnesota from before Floyd was born bear no responsibility and now dont have pressure on them to change or fix the crappyvway they run things.
        Trump has no responsibility whatsoever under the constitution for policing. It’s like blaming Ardern for a rogue coppers behaviour here rather than walloping the police commissioner

        Reply
        • Democrat mayors and governors and the media have had a lot more than Trump to deal with in the US over the last week. As much as he seems to want it to be, it’s not all about Trump.

          If Trump has no responsibility for policing why is he trying to influence and direct policing?

          I guess if he gets the military more involved it will be more about him, and potentially civil war.

          Reply
          • Alan Wilkinson

             /  3rd June 2020

            The National Guard are under dual state and federal control. The President has a duty to intervene and impose federal command if the states are failing to protect lives and property. That is the reason for Trump’s involvement.

            Reply
        • Bullshit David. Trump has enabled the Democrats and the media to go after him.

          Just one example. Trump’s support for the gun-carriers who protested for re-opening at the start of May contrasted with his abuse of protesters supporting BLM – hypocrisy and a double-standard that Americans are clearly no longer willing to tolerate.

          Another – tear-gassing peaceful protesters and the clergy of St John’s so that he could hold a photo op, because his vanity was bruised after barricading himself in the WH bunker.

          Watching Trump preen in front of St. John’s with a bible held upside down above his head, moments after he threatened to deploy the American military against the American people, I remembered this quote, “when facism comes to America it will be wrapped in the flag and carrying a cross”

          Reply
          • Alan Wilkinson

             /  3rd June 2020

            The cops say they used tear gas because the mob attacked them. Inconvenient truth, Ishmael.

            Reply
          • Pink David

             /  3rd June 2020

            “Just one example. Trump’s support for the gun-carriers who protested for re-opening at the start of May contrasted with his abuse of protesters supporting BLM – hypocrisy and a double-standard that Americans are clearly no longer willing to tolerate.”

            How many shops did these protesters loot? Just to the nearest 10 or so, you don’t need to be exact.

            ” “when facism comes to America it will be wrapped in the flag and carrying a cross””

            Insightful. True liberty is burning the American flag and the churches.

            And ANTIFA is anti-fascist, so everyone else must be pro-fascist right?

            “Another – tear-gassing peaceful protesters and the clergy of St John’s so that he could hold a photo op, because his vanity was bruised after barricading himself in the WH bunker.”

            No tear gas was used. The wonderful thing about tear gas is it creates lots of photo ops for people with streaming eyes; in pain. Exactly the thing you want to get on the front cover of your dying newspaper.

            Why no photos?

            Reply
    • Pink David

       /  3rd June 2020

      “Will Trump resign?” No
      “Will the looting carry on for months?” No
      “Or simply run its course and nothing changes?”

      A few things will change. More whites will leave the areas where the riots were worst. Those areas will get poorer, businesses will move away as well. More blacks will vote for Trump. More Portland liberals will dye their hair purple.
      The gap between the big cities and the rest of America will grow a bit larger.
      Justin Timberlake will be arrested for funding terrorism.

      Reply
  3. duperez

     /  3rd June 2020

    I’ll repeat the salient point to prove that I actually saw it : ‘The chaos in the States has nothing to do with police brutality, Trump, Floyd, racism. It’s just opportunists in Democrat run areas.’

    Would that stuff be happening on the streets of New York if the Floyd incident didn’t happen? No, unless it wasn’t Floyd, instead it was Jones, or Smith and it was in a different city and it was a different cop.

    Reply
    • I remember in 2017 Trump told law enforcement officers at Suffolk County Community College in Brentwood, Long Island to rough people up during their arrest.

      I remember in 2017 Trump signed an executive order allowing police departments to obtain and use surplus military equipment like grenade launchers, tactical vehicles, and bayonets either for free or with the use of federal dollars.

      I remember in 2017 Trump pardoned former sheriff, Joe Arpaio, who was convicted of criminal contempt of court following his refusal to follow a federal order meant to protect immigrants from racial profiling by police.Trump sent a message not to worry about any of that.

      I remember in 2019 Trump issued war crime pardons to Lorance, Golstyn, Gallagher and Behenna, abdicating his moral responsibility and sending a message that murderers in the militaryu need not worry about the military justice system.

      I remember in 2017 when Trump demanded Colin Kaepernik be fired by the NFL for kneeling to protest against police violence: “Get that son of a bitch off the field right now, out. He’s fired. He’s fired!”

      This has everything to do with police brutality, Trump, Floyd, and racism.

      Reply
      • Alan Wilkinson

         /  3rd June 2020

        In election year for the Left everything is to do with Trump. You are like the man with the hammer seeing nails everywhere.

        Reply
        • Gezza

           /  3rd June 2020

          And for Trump everything is to do with the Left. So what?

          Reply
          • Alan Wilkinson

             /  3rd June 2020

            Huh? Last you were claiming for Trump everything is to do with him. That puts the Left in the same boat.

            Reply
            • Gezza

               /  3rd June 2020

              Don’t be cute. It IS all about him; him blaming the lefty Dems for everything is typical Trump.

            • Alan Wilkinson

               /  3rd June 2020

              Mrs Al says I’m cute but I worry when you do.

      • Pink David

         /  3rd June 2020

        “I remember in 2017 Trump told law enforcement officers at Suffolk County Community College in Brentwood, Long Island to rough people up during their arrest.”

        Your memory is not very good. He told law enforcement officers to “not to be too nice” to members of MS-13 when arresting them. Of course, not great given the Suffolk County Police Department Chief had gone to jail for beating someone up.

        “I remember in 2017 Trump signed an executive order allowing police departments to obtain and use surplus military equipment like grenade launchers, tactical vehicles, and bayonets either for free or with the use of federal dollars.”

        Strange, I remember Obama doing this too! How odd, oh yes, it’s been going on for decades. Odd that your only started with this memory in 2017.
        https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1033_program

        “I remember in 2017 Trump pardoned former sheriff, Joe Arpaio, who was convicted of criminal contempt of court following his refusal to follow a federal order meant to protect immigrants from racial profiling by police.Trump sent a message not to worry about any of that.”

        Given all the problems with Policing and crime in the US, this really is small beer. Maybe you are right and racial profiling is the source of all the problems.

        “I remember in 2019 Trump issued war crime pardons to Lorance, Golstyn, Gallagher and Behenna, abdicating his moral responsibility and sending a message that murderers in the militaryu need not worry about the military justice system.”

        Send men to war, expect them to kill people. If you do not want them to kill people, don’t send them to war. It’s not complicated.

        “I remember in 2017 when Trump demanded Colin Kaepernik be fired by the NFL for kneeling to protest against police violence: “Get that son of a bitch off the field right now, out. He’s fired. He’s fired!””

        He should have been demanding he be fired for being the worst quarterback in the NHL. Which is what he is. His kneeling made him millions.

        “This has everything to do with police brutality, Trump, Floyd, and racism.”

        The thing with racists like you is your inability to understand others. Police brutality impacts everyone in America. It’s not a race issue and you promoting it as such simply means it will never be solved. Take a stab at what rioting in response to Police brutality will result in?

        Just for fun, how do you link Trump to Floyd being killed? I’d love to see your gymnastics there, I expect nothing less than a 10/10.

        Reply
  4. lurcher1948

     /  3rd June 2020

    Halley Holt looks beautiful today,welcome back…so much better than that POS trump,who appears to be on a twitter wank at this moment

    Reply
    • Gezza

       /  3rd June 2020

      She does the bimbo blonde thing well.

      Reply
      • I am not a fan, but I pitied her losing the baby so far along and having to go through it alone (I hope that people ignored and ‘flouted’ the law)

        Reply
  5. Corky

     /  3rd June 2020

    It had to come. A confused WHITE talent trying not to be a confused white.

    Maybe it has to do with her career? I previously have had many heated debates regarding the long term viability and talent of Lorde. I have always said she was a novelty mediocre talent. I can go to any party across Aotearoa and find better.

    That however, does not mean I don’t respect what she has done. She scaled the heights and was the in-thing for a while. Not many musicians from or neck of the woods can claim that.

    And, who knows, perhaps the fat lady hasn’t sung yet?🤔

    https://www.tvnz.co.nz/one-news/new-zealand/lorde-speaks-against-white-silence-in-email-followers-after-attending-auckland-protest

    https://www.theguardian.com/music/2018/mar/19/lorde-us-tour-flops-pop-career

    Reply
  6. Corky

     /  3rd June 2020

    Australia gets in on the act.

    Commentator: ”This can’t be the right way to treat a teenager, can it?’

    Yeah, it can. On the street if someone threatens you with harm…a statement has to be made.
    That the teenager was indigenous made it more imperative for the officer to take strong action.

    https://www.theguardian.com/australia-news/2020/jun/02/video-shows-nsw-australia-police-officer-slamming-indigenous-boy-face-first-onto-pavement

    Reply
    • Gezza

       /  3rd June 2020

      That the teenager was indigenous made it more imperative for the officer to take strong action.

      Why?

      Reply
      • Corky

         /  3rd June 2020

        Indigenous folk think differently. They know and administer the ‘bash.’ The white middleclass way does not work with them. Rational thought isn’t their first prority when they are faced with a problem. They see white folk as weak..protected only by their power structure. If they catch them slipping on the street they will administer their type of justice…unless they are made to think twice.

        Now, before some idiot says: ” they all aren’t like that,” I say too many are. Trying to work out who you can and can’t talk to in a rational manner on the street isn’t a viable option in my opinion.

        Notice a common demonimator here…and across the world. This is China of all places.

        Reply
        • EVERYONE is indigenous to somewhere, it’s not a skin colour. Being darkskinned doesn’t make someone automatically or even usually think a different way to white people and vice versa.

          If you think that there’s no violence in the white middle-class, you obviously don’t know any. And there are plenty of dark-skinned middle-class people in all countries.

          An adult slamming a teenager into the pavement is unacceptable by any standards, I think. If you’d been to Australia, you’d know that their police are armed, so a young boy is unlikely to be any threat to one. They have been armed for many years.

          Reply
          • Corky

             /  3rd June 2020

            As usual, you wilfully miss the point. I’m sorry, I won’t be explaining.

            Reply
          • You must surely be aware that indigenous doesn’t mean brown or black skinned. If you are not, and can’t take my word for it, look it up in a dictionary, Swedes are indigenous to Sweden, French people to France and so on.

            There can be no explanation that makes any sense for causing GBH to a young boy who hasn’t done anything simply because he is ‘indigenous’. Your idea that this is the only thing that they understand is racist nonsense. Stating that indigenous people think differently is rubbish. We are all indigenous to somewhere. Indigenous simply means native, and everyone’s that; native is indigena in Latin, which should give even you a clue.

            You claim to have Maori great-nieces and nephews. Would you find it acceptable if a cop committed this level of assautl on one because of their race?

            Reply
            • Your idea that the unarmed boy was threatening harm to the armed policeman is contradicted by the video which shows that he did nothing at all. Another boy made a threatening remark,

            • Corky

               /  3rd June 2020

              ”You must surely be aware that indigenous doesn’t mean brown or black skinned.”

              There you go again. Indigenous in our region means one thing.

              ”Your idea that this is the only thing that they understand is racist nonsense.”

              White middleclass(?) ignorance. The type I continuously run into on blogs.

              ”Stating that indigenous people think differently is rubbish. ”

              Provable nonsense. Starting with folk who speak different languages..as you supposedly do..but don’t. Otherwise you wouldn’t have written that.

              ”Your idea that the unarmed boy was threatening harm to the armed policeman is contradicted by the video which shows that he did nothing at all. Another boy made a threatening remark.”

              More fantasy from Kitty’s fantasy world.

              Quote from article;

              ”In the video of the incident, the teenager can be heard saying “I’ll crack ya across the jaw, bro” before the officer walks over to him and restrains him.”

              Are you one of these soppy liberal apologists? I will say it again. Only post on what you have firsthand knowledge about.

  7. lurcher1948

     /  3rd June 2020

    Can anyone rescue the USA from Trump, with 107858 Covid-19 deaths,a real jobless rate of 23.9%, murderous police and national guards running amok, Cannot Communist China or Russia step in to save the people from Donald Trump and his war on his own people.

    Reply
    • Gerrit

       /  3rd June 2020

      No, that would strengthen Trumps and the military’s hand. Neither country has the logistical capacity to invade nor the ability to wage nuclear war without tasting the ashes of of victory in their mouths (paraphrasing John Kennedy)..

      Reply
      • duperez

         /  3rd June 2020

        Ashes of of victory in their mouths? Reminded me of this:

        Reply
      • lurcher1948

         /  3rd June 2020

        CRAP,5 times the population and as many nuclear bombs and weapons AND HAVE BIGGER NUTS, ( remember STALINGRAD),Garret, tell us HOW MANY WARS SINCE WW2 HAS THE USA WON, NONE, THEY ARE LOSING THE USA WAR…..just saying,WAIT trump looted a bible from a church after banishing local citizens, with gas,bullets,AND brutality,….bone spurs legacy…an orange narcissist COWARD…again a COWARD,back into the bunker trump.

        Reply
        • lurcher1948

           /  3rd June 2020

          PG im very proud of you today,just saying for me, the posters who think they have the right to rant FREELY, SHOULD feel and think for the moderated poster WHO MIGHT get posted, when the idiots rant freely….thanks PG one whos old and appreciates your blog

          Reply
          • Alan Wilkinson

             /  3rd June 2020

            You are a lucky man to be able to rant unfreely, Lurch. PG has to be your personal minder. You would both prefer he didn’t have to be but only you can make that possible.

            Reply
        • Gerrit

           /  3rd June 2020

          If the history of war has taught us anything is that to win one needs boots on the ground. Neither China nor Russia has the capability to quickly deploy enough boots on the ground to counter any push back. Even with a foothold, the supply line is so long and fragile that those troops, with a foothold, would be on the fighting a defence battle not an offencive one. Study WW2 history, the the ability to seize and hold ground for any length is determined by the supply line and ones opponent ability to bring men and material in greater numbers to the battle field. .

          As for nuclear war, the MAD scenario still stands. Not going to happen.

          Reply
    • Pink David

       /  3rd June 2020

      “Cannot Communist China or Russia step in to save the people from Donald Trump and his war on his own people.”

      I’m confused. I thought Donald Trump worked for Russia. That’s what Ishmael told me.

      I’m sure China could make a lot of money selling the organs of the protesters to the highest bidders. That’s the SOP for their riot control.

      Not that the Chinese are racist or anything, but didn’t the new Star Wars film flop because of, ahem, certain Chinese sensibilities….

      Reply
  8. Gezza

     /  3rd June 2020

    This thing’s nearly the size of a small town! Great pilot. Makes it look graceful.

    Reply
    • Gerrit

       /  3rd June 2020

      Ukrainian owned and operated. Cant see it being lent to the Russians whilst the conflict rages in the eastern Ukraine. Plus only one is available and not enough capacity to deliver safely boots on the ground in the USA.

      Reply
    • Corky

       /  3rd June 2020

      People like Lance are always unstable in some way. I have seen it time and again. I’m waiting for the Pink One to lose it in some way when she realises no one is listening.

      Reply
    • Gezza

       /  3rd June 2020

      Hang on. I’ll have a look 😐

      Reply
      • Gezza

         /  3rd June 2020

        Not enuf detail given about the incident to figure much out.
        Personal problems? Threatened by other driver?
        Could even be a cultural thing.
        Who knows.

        Reply
    • Jack

       /  4th June 2020

      It appears that Lance is succumbing to cult. His mother is Mormon (I think). In his book he talks about wanting to explore being a good Mormon alongside Te Ao Maori. Spiritual confusions lead to physical outbursts. He’s an unhappy man.
      Just taking another op to offer my book to readers. “Haka on the Pew” is available from Kindle Store and by contacting jckmargaret@gmail.com. It details a family’s escape from the Presbyterians.

      Reply
  9. Pink David

     /  3rd June 2020

    At some point we are going to see an end to the ‘Experts say’

    ‘Couples should be wearing face masks during sex, expert says
    Researchers from Harvard University have warned sex could spread coronavirus’

    https://www.standard.co.uk/lifestyle/dating/facemasks-during-sex-a4457801.html

    Reply
  10. Alan Wilkinson

     /  3rd June 2020
    Reply

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