Should Auckland come down to level 2 tomorrow?

Covid cases continue to be reported in Auckland with 13 new cases yesterday, about half of those from community transmission. Should Auckland lower to level 2 as planned at midnight?

From a health perspective this must be a risk.

From a political perspective with an election coming up in October it may be more of a risk not to allow the level to drop.

The Ministry of Health is pushing for more testing in South and West Auckland in particular:

Say yes to the test

Widespread testing is a critical part of our COVID-19 elimination strategy. COVID-19 tests are free and should be easy to access for everyone. We have more than 1,100 testing sites nationwide, including at most GPs.

If you’re in South or West Auckland, or if you have a greater risk of poor health outcomes if you were to get COVID-19, even if you don’t have symptoms, please have a test.

UPDATE: this is apparently incorrect and all people in South and West Auckland are not encouraged to have a test. There has been a lot of criticism of this and the poor communication from the Ministry of Health and Ardern in correcting it.

If you develop symptoms consistent with COVID-19, wherever you are, please call Healthline (0800 358 5453) or your doctor immediately and have a test.

Testing sites will be open this weekend, right across the country – this includes GPs and community-based assessment centres. 

Pop-up testing sites continue to move around Auckland communities to ensure nearby, easy and equitable access to testing, particularly for Māori and for Pacific peoples. 

With “Māori and for Pacific peoples” at greater risk at the moment it’s a big call for the Government to relax restrictions.

There are currently 137 active cases, with 11 people in hospital and three in intensive care.

The big concern right now should be that the numbers of new cases have been persistent for two weeks.

New confirmed and probable cases over time

So the current outbreak in Auckland looks barely under control. Relaxing restrictions to level 2 must risk this getting out of control.

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113 Comments

  1. Gerrit

     /  30th August 2020

    “From a political perspective with an election coming up in October it may be more of a risk not to allow the level to drop.”

    Labour will blink and go to level 2. People in my bubble (which is reasonably large due to visiting customers and suppliers daily) are fed up with the restrictions and the holier than thou attitude from the, on full pay, state administrators and their advisors.

    There is no financial hurt in the state administrators or their advisors, there is huge hurt at ground level.

    No amount of fairy dust spreading and promises of unicorns for all, will sooth a deeply simmering voting base.

    Reply
  2. John J Harrison

     /  30th August 2020

    Pete, you have summed it up correctly.
    If Ardern continues to listen to Hendy – the individual who provided the BS about 80,000 dying if we did not go to level 4 in March, and not go to level 2 in AKL then our economy will resemble Venezuela by Christmas.
    Why is this individual still being paid to provide such devastating and untruthful information?
    Ardern has painted herself into a corner.
    If she has an ounce of pragmatism she will listen to her economists and drop to level 2 in AKL.
    Her hopeless administration has been well and truly been showed up by the fact that 19,000 have transited through AKL airport during level 3.
    Many flew to Queenstown and were never asked for documentation.
    Indeed, they have stated in the weekend papers that it is all BS regarding “ checking at the border.”
    Meanwhile, the Pacific community continued to hold church and private prayer meetings with dozens attending in close proximity.
    Most Aucklanders blatantly ignore her decrees and enjoy the beaches and parks.
    Concurrently innumerable businesses are preparing to close for good and Queen Street currently resembles a ghost town.
    The ineptitude of Ardern and her now warring partners have not only ensured that our economy is devastated ( watch out for the 17/09 financials ) but mental health concerns have reached catastrophic levels.
    If Ardern had followed the same course that Taiwan did then this would never have happened.
    A country 1/2 the size of the North Island with 5 times our population.
    Seymour has been proven to be correct all along.
    We must all learn to live with Covid and get on with our lives.
    Meanwhile, circa 500 will die from the common flu !
    Ardern’s preposition is to instill us with abject fear and rely on her utterances from the “ Pulpit of Truth.”

    Reply
    • Jack

       /  30th August 2020

      Everyone holds to their own ‘truth’. If only Jacinda’s didn’t cause such harm. Hopefully her pulpit is removed – preferable to have politicians with none

      Reply
      • No one has died in this new outbreak. We are all responsible for looking after ourselves (I won’t say for looking after each other, as that doesn’t happen)

        Closing the country, or even Auckland, down and sending people into bankruptcy for 137 cases of anything makes no sense.

        Reply
        • Jack

           /  30th August 2020

          Doesn’t happen? It does in my wee bubble, including here
          Lack of sense from politicians doesn’t cause us to stop taking care of others
          Mask wearing is supposed to be a way of looking after others
          My manner of doing my best for others (people admit to me their general anxiety) is to encourage my fellow Kiwis to carry their crosses and to say that it’s not what we’ve been taught. It’s incomparably easier than that
          If you hadn’t consistently tried to discourage me I would have removed the running record by now and moved on
          I hope you know that you are cared for Kitty. Lots of Kiwis care for others. That’s the Christian way

          Reply
          • You don’t encourage people, you annoy them with your patronising manner and facile solutions.

            How many people wear masks to protect others and not themselves ? If one doesn’t have a virus, one can’t spread it. I don’t and won’t wear a mask because I know that I don’t have C19 ! I will on public transport rather than pay a fine, but that’s all.

            Reply
    • Duker

       /  30th August 2020

      “Seymour has been proven to be correct all along.”
      When has he said that?

      Seymour spoke in parliament ( recorded in Hansard) at the start of the 4 week level 4 lockdown SUPPORTING It

      Seymour had a press release at the start of the new restrictions for level2/3 SUPPORTING it.
      “”Tonight’s news is not what anyone hoped for,” says ACT Leader David Seymour.
      “There will be time enough to ask why this has happened, but right now the goal is to get on top of it before there is loss of life or further loss of livelihoods.
      “As with the last lockdown, we all need to do the right thing to beat the virus as quickly as possible.
      https://www.scoop.co.nz/stories/PA2008/S00118/act-statement-on-covid-19-community-transmission.htm

      Whats this ‘live with covid’ you speak of , is that something you like to think he says

      Reply
      • John J Harrison

         /  30th August 2020

        Duker, like us all we believed Ardern’s strident speech that 80,000 would die unless we followed her dictate.
        We now know this was a lie.

        Reply
        • Duker

           /  30th August 2020

          There was no speech or report from Hendy that 80,000 would die
          Look up her speech and Hendys report, theres is not even 8,000 number
          That number was ‘invented’ by the NZ Herald in their story when it needed a clickbait number for mugs like you

          Reply
            • John J Harrison

               /  30th August 2020

              Gerrit, SPOT ON !
              I am left to ponder why Duker gets up every morning spouting untruths and constantly shooting [deleted] in both feet.

            • Duker

               /  30th August 2020

              Look at the original reports no mention of 80,000 at all.
              Reporters made up those numbers for the no restrictions at all. Which we never had
              One of the paper’s authors Shaun Hendy told Stuff it was possible that New Zealand’s actions could see the disease stamped out relatively quickly. ( which is what happened)
              He noted that the paper was written before the Government announced the lockdown and it didn’t take into account aggressive contact tracing and testing.

              Click to access Supression-and-Mitigation-New-Zealand-TPM-006.pdf


              Use the ‘find’ function to look for ‘80,000’

              The other side of predictions of what could be done
              “Only a full mix of suppression strategies – population-wide social distancing with a lockdown and the closure of almost all businesses and schools – could keep the case numbers down enough for the healthcare system to cope, with a mortality rate of just 0.0004 per cent: About 20 people.
              Again they said at best we could be 20 people die ..hmmmm. Tell me how many deaths we had because of the governments actions , was it…. around 20 ?

            • Gerrit

               /  30th August 2020

              Duker; Page six says without control a fatality rate of 1.67%. Based on the fabled 5 million that is 83500 fatalities.

              No control would see a non fatal infection rate of 89%.

              The numbers are there if you can read and do some simple arithmetic.

            • John J Harrison

               /  30th August 2020

              Gerrit, what Duker will not accept is that Ardern deliberately used the 80,000 figure in her infamous and frightful speech to the nation on Saturday at noon prior to the level 4 lockdown of the country.
              Everyone heard it apart from Duker apparently.
              It was utterly disgraceful and has resulted in a national debt of circa $140 Billion which my grandchildren’s children will be paying.
              Typical socialist, wants total control of the populous.

            • Google ‘80,000 could die of Covid in NZ’ and there will be ample evidence of this figure being quoted by the Herald, Stuff, Newsroom, Newshub……it was based on modelling that would only work if almost everyone had it.

              It was the scaremongering to end all scaremongering, but the gullible believed it.

              One person was squawking about how 500,000 would die here. They actually quoted 400,000, but they thought that we had 4,000,000 people and believed that 10% of us would die. That would be 500,000 !

            • Duker

               /  30th August 2020

              The 80,000 is just newspapers just quoting each other. The link to the original source doesnt give that number

            • duperez

               /  30th August 2020

              John J Harrison
              “…Ardern deliberately used the 80,000 figure in her infamous and frightful speech to the nation on Saturday at noon prior to the level 4 lockdown of the country.”

              Did you not want her to ‘deliberately’ use numbers?
              Did you want her to use your numbers?
              Did you want her to make up her own numbers?
              Did you want her to not use numbers at all?

            • Duker

               /  30th August 2020

              That 13th place loser on the Napier City Council Harrison
              “not accept is that Ardern deliberately used the 80,000 figure in her infamous and frightful speech to the nation on Saturday at noon prior to the level 4 lockdown of the country.”
              This is the Sat 21 March speech made by Ardern
              https://www.beehive.govt.nz/speech/pm-address-covid-19-update
              No mention of deaths or dying at all.
              So the 80,000 claim is a complete lie repeated by an outrageous liar…when its repeated without evidence it moves beyond a falsehood.

            • John J Harrison

               /  30th August 2020

              Duker, pity you only used Ardern’s opening remarks.
              Why not include those made in answer to reporters questions at the same time ?
              If not refer to the media quotes from her stand up from the “ Pulpit of Truth.”

            • Duker

               /  30th August 2020

              Not proof of that in ‘impromptu remarks’ ..surely it would be on TV if that were the case and you could find it.
              Once again a falsehood is exposed but instead of retracting its repeated becoming another big fat lie

        • According to Duker, that quoted figure was a lie when I repeated it although it was easy enough to find evidence of it being said. But when I said it, I was lying.

          I didn’t believe it could be that high, as too many people here would have had to have it to make it happen (more than the entire population ?)

          A lot of people believed that the announced extended state of emergency meant an extension of L4 and lockdown, and were horrified. What irresponsible reporting. I was one of those who thought this !

          Reply
          • Duker

             /  30th August 2020

            You cant find it can you , just like you cant find Seymour saying ‘living with virus’
            Skilled – and manipulative politicians- can easily make their political fans believe they are saying stuff you already believe. When they dont.
            In this case there is nothing near to what you believe which is live with the virus ( for other people).
            The only reasonable thing to conclude- on the balance of probabilities- is that you are irrational and deluded over this as Seymour and ACT want to BEAT the virus.
            It will probably produce a complete mental mental breakdown to bust a core belief of yours over the last 6 months to find your political hero is a covid apostate… embracing ‘Wellbeing’ too boot.!
            lest hope you get all the support you so obviously need and get well.

            Reply
      • John J Harrison

         /  30th August 2020

        Duker, do keep up.
        As I type this Hendy and innumerable other so – called academics are urging Ardern to remain in level 3 in AKL.
        If she gave them the undeserved credence she gave them in March she would aqueous.
        But even Ardern has realized that we have all been lied to and are rebelling with continuing blatant breaches such as enjoying our beaches and parks.
        Ardern made this the Covid election, I am sure her ineptitude is now on full display.
        Watch for the frowning and hand waving at 1 PM.

        Reply
      • David has said many times that we need to learn to live with Covid, while emphasising that he doesn’t mean doing what Sweden did, as that’s ‘dying with Covid.’ It would be easy enough to google his saying this.

        Reply
        • Duker

           /  30th August 2020

          Why do you invent things you think he says , is he a weasel that says different things to different people ?
          “As with the last lockdown, we all need to do the right thing to beat the virus as quickly as possible.”
          Clear as a bell, lockdowns work in those words to BEAT the virus.

          Give me a direct quote where he says ‘live with the virus’ – you are making it up as usual nonsense from a crazy cat woman.
          I know absolutely that he isnt saying that publically because it would be toxic for ACT

          Reply
          • You wanted a direct quote. This one was made to the press and is on video. There are others in print on ACT newsletters.

            ‘If a lockdown is required to maintain elimination, then it is time to accept a new reality that the virus is here to stay and we must learn to live with it intelligently.

            Your comments about my sanity and supposed lies are extremely offensive as well as being untrue. Please refrain from making these insulting and defamatory personal attacks.

            Reply
            • John J Harrison

               /  30th August 2020

              Kitty, Duker is a true socialist and an Ardern “ fan – boy.”
              NEVER, expect an apology.

            • I am not that naive; I’d be waiting for a long time.

              But he has been making vicious personal attacks on my sanity and veracity for a long time and I am tired of it.

              At one time he was saying that I had senile dementia. Pete stepped in at that point.

              He accuses me of lying even when there is evidence that I am quoting something that is on record like David’s words on C19.

              It wears thin after a while.

            • Duker

               /  30th August 2020

              Stop making things up KK, youre an educated an intelligent woman, so act like it . Theres enough [Canadian national birds] here as it is, who never give references or links.
              I just proved you wrong on Seymour, you are smart enough to understand words he used , so the only conclusion when you continue with your falsehoods is that you are [flying mammal like]

            • For crying out bloody loud, David’s exact words are quoted above.
              He said them ON CAMERA. The video is there for all to see. What more do you want ?

            • Duker

               /  30th August 2020

              The quote you gave , without a source is from Aug 14

              ACT: Statement On Covid-19 Community Transmission
              Tuesday, 11 August 2020, 11:32 pm
              Press Release: ACT New Zealand
              “Tonight’s news is not what anyone hoped for,” says ACT Leader David Seymour.
              “There will be time enough to ask why this has happened, but right now the goal is to get on top of it before there is loss of life or further loss of livelihoods.
              “As with the last lockdown, we all need to do the right thing to beat the virus as quickly as possible.

          • Google ‘David Seymour, living with Covid.’ See for yourself.

            Don’t call me a loony or batty, please.

            Trolling and calling someone a liar is not the same as proving someone wrong. Nor is making personal abusive attacks.

            Reply
            • Duker

               /  30th August 2020

              Official written statement is get on top of the outbreak and BEAT the virus

    • Duker

       /  30th August 2020

      Harrison again spouting BS
      “If she has an ounce of pragmatism she will listen to her economists and drop to level 2 in AKL.”
      The decision was made LAST WEEK when the extension till Sunday was made

      “* Auckland is staying at level 3 until 11.59pm on Sunday, it will then move to level 2 with limits on mass gatherings.”
      https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/300089382/recap-covid19-restrictions-levels-extended-to-sunday-face-masks-made-compulsory-on-public-transport

      Reply
      • Gerrit

         /  30th August 2020

        More confusing messages. Now they want 500,000 to take a coronavisrus test. That is roughly 40% of the Auckland population.

        “The advice flies in the face of previous official health instructions where asymptomatic people were asked not to clog up testing stations.”

        https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/health/coronavirus/300094975/coronavirus-everyone-in-south-or-west-auckland-urged-to-take-covid19-test

        ” But the advice caused widespread confusion and concern, especially as Auckland is due to move from alert level 3 to level 2 on Sunday at 11.59pm.

        “I’m so confused?! Why would someone get a test if they have no symptoms,” asked one reader. “Two weeks ago we were all told to not get a test if you do not have symptoms! Honestly this is an absolute joke.”

        Others asked why the areas were not based on the community transmission, with the “mini cluster” around Mt Roskill being in Central Auckland.”

        Reply
        • Duker

           /  30th August 2020

          “Why would someone get a test if they have no symptoms,” asked one reader”
          Because 40% of those infected have NO SYMPTOMS, but still spread it to others..duhhh

          Reply
          • Gerrit

             /  30th August 2020

            Supplies in stock * 282,654 29 August 2020

            https://www.health.govt.nz/our-work/diseases-and-conditions/covid-19-novel-coronavirus/covid-19-current-situation/covid-19-current-cases

            There are not enough testing kits to test 500,000 people.

            Does New Zealand have enough laboratory infastructure to handle 500,000 tests?

            Even at 30,000 tests per day (current highest rate per day), it would take 17 days to test 500,000. By which time the first to be tested will need to be retested.

            As my Doctor said. A clear test is only valid for the single minute in time it is a clear test. The next minute you could be infected and the test worthless.

            Reply
            • Duker

               /  30th August 2020

              https://www.health.govt.nz/our-work/diseases-and-conditions/covid-19-novel-coronavirus/covid-19-current-situation/covid-19-current-cases

              getting on 800,000 tests so far , peaked at almost 30,000 per day
              The lab infrastructure handles it because they use innovative techniques like mixing 10 or so samples together to test ( only a tiny tiny proportion are postive) so if mix of 10 is negative all are negative , if its postive then all 10 are retested to find ‘the one’
              Thats why they are asking for more people to test , the infrastructure can handle it.
              BTW you can make rational and reasonable comments , even though I disagree its based on some reality.
              Not like a certain ‘cat lover’

            • Gerrit

               /  30th August 2020

              Duker; I don’t like your antagonism and disrespect shown to other commentators.

              It weakens your arguments.

              It weakens any respect people may have for your points of view.

            • Blazer

               /  30th August 2020

              What you really don’t like is he is showing you,Kitty and JJ up as pedalling false information.

              He backs up his rebuttals….the rest of you just …howl.

          • Then why did the MoH or whoever it was tell people NOT to be tested if they had no symptoms ?

            Reply
        • Fight4nz

           /  30th August 2020

          “I’m so confused?! Why would someone get a test if they have no symptoms,” asked one reader. “Two weeks ago we were all told to not get a test if you do not have symptoms! Honestly this is an absolute joke.”
          Aaahhh, because situations change perhaps? Two weeks ago there was a rush. Now testing numbers are down and the medical community wants to get them back up again.

          This must be one of the stupid people AW predicted will bring down humanity

          Reply
          • The health people were telling people NOT to be tested, so were taken at their word.

            Reply
            • John J Harrison

               /  30th August 2020

              Kitty, quiet so.
              Demonstrates, yet again the complete shambles that is the Ardern government.

          • John J Harrison

             /  30th August 2020

            Fight4nz, little wonder you are confused.
            So is everyone else , including Ardern.
            At the 1 PM press conference from the “ Pulpit of Truth” it was revealed that the MOH instruction for ALL in South and West AKL to get tested was a “ communication “ SNAFU.
            Indeed Ardern stated she had reminded the situation this AM to mean only those showing symptoms.
            Unfortunately for Ardern the reporters were able to point out that the incorrect information was still up on all web sites and social media.
            Oh dear, she was most unpleased to have this pointed out.

            Reply
            • Duker

               /  30th August 2020

              One social media site. Must be the sunday crew on duty

              The point is that ‘ALL’ meant only ‘ all those of greater risk of poor health outcomes if you were to get COVID-19’

              Not every single person in those areas . A typo really

            • Kimbo

               /  30th August 2020

              ”A typo really”

              Glad to see you are so sanguine about it. For those of us in West Auckland who were thrown into a flurry of planning how and when and where we wold be tested it was a hassle with which we could have done without.

              But good to know the how apologists of the governmental incompetence think.

            • Alan Wilkinson

               /  30th August 2020

              What is the point of being tested if they are vulnerable unless they are going to be offered special medical aid if infected? Surely it is far more useful to test their contacts to prevent them getting infected? Complete bureaucratic idiocy.

            • Duker

               /  30th August 2020

              Kimbo this was the FULL message
              “The “important message” was posted on the Government’s Unite Against Covid-19 Facebook page about 5pm on Saturday.
              It was titled:

              “If you’re in South or West Auckland, please have a test”..
              “If you’re in South or West Auckland, or if you have a greater risk of poor health outcomes if you were to get Covid-19, even if you don’t have symptoms, please have a test,” it said in the post.
              For people outside South and West Auckland, it was still recommended that they only get tested if they “develop symptoms consistent with Covid-19”.

              Clearly the full message said – those with greater risk of poor outcomes-
              The short title left the qualification out, but was only part of the full message. Its a media beatup ,
              did you read the beatup or the facebook original..let me guess

              So you have joined the trolling brigade over that ?

            • Fight4nz

               /  30th August 2020

              Not confused. No idea what there is to be confused about.
              Two weeks ago instructions were to get tested if symptomatic or linked to cluster.
              Last day or it says 500,000 to be tested with or without symptoms. I offered plausible explanation. Turns out there has been an error. The correct instructions are ….
              People like Kimbo rightly should be pissed off at error. But nothing to be confused about.
              But feel free to maintain that frenzy in your own tea cup at maximum revs if that’s what floats your boat.

            • Kimbo

               /  30th August 2020

              No, Duker, was not trolling. Was reporting what occurred in our household this morning on reading the media reports, which accurately reported…the headline.

              And again, it is instructive to see an apologist for government incompetence (Ardern referred to it as a mistake over which she is – rightly imho – “very angry”) show what they really think by digging the hole they are in even deeper.

            • Duker

               /  30th August 2020

              So you read the beatup – let me guess it was the NZ Herald and acted accordingly.
              So its the governments incompetence a so called news story by a reporter left out the part that said ONLY those who ‘have a greater risk of poor health outcomes’
              And yes your trolled about it – even if you made a mistake.

              I see the Herald is now trying to cover its sorry backside over this prime example of fake news…Jason Walls seems to be the [ not nice ]

              Could have guessed …a millennial wanna be

            • Kimbo

               /  30th August 2020

              So you read the beatup

              My family in good faith read the headline in the media (iwhich was an entirely accurate reporting of the Government’s headline, and it was their fault it was not an accurate summation of the following content. Is the purpose of a headline, ffs)

              ….and then tried unsuccessfully to confirm verification in the offending entry in the Covid website

              ….while also making provisional arrangements to get tested (some of us presume we can walk and chew gum at the same time)

              …with no knowledge the government had dropped the ball.

              But good to see an apologist for government incompetence that inconveniences and worries its citizens at a time when accurate and precise communication should be a given thinks that “shoot the messenger” and “blame the public” are viable damage-control strategies.

      • John J Harrison

         /  30th August 2020

        Duker, I have just wasted nearly an hour watching Ardern.
        You are wrong – again.
        AKL is not on level 2 or 3 from Monday but 2.5 which will absolutely decimate the hospitality industry, among others.
        One could assume that Hendy et al had a hand in not dropping AKL to 2.

        Reply
        • Duker

           /  30th August 2020

          There is no official level 2 ! It was all decided last week

          Auckland will be at Alert Level 2 from 11:59pm Sunday 30 August
          From 11:59pm on Sunday 30 August, Auckland is expected to move to Alert Level 2. There will still be restrictions on gatherings, funerals and tangihanga.
          Information on life and business at Alert Level 2
          Restrictions for Auckland region [this is the special level 2 only for Auckland]
          At Alert Level 2 in Auckland, gatherings can have up to 10 people. Funerals and tangihanga may have up to 50 people, and have to meet other conditions set by the Ministry of Health.
          Gatherings and events at Alert Level 2
          Funerals and tangihanga at Alert Level 2

          https://covid19.govt.nz/covid-19/alert-system/auckland/

          As the evidence shows the special Auckland only level 2 was announced last week.

          Reply
      • John J Harrison

         /  30th August 2020

        Duker, wrong again !
        After Hendy et al pontificated in the media to not go to level 2 Ardern has acquiesced to 2.5 in AKL thus ensuring continuing economic carnage.
        You should not believe everything a Labour minister insists will happen.
        Lesson learned?

        Reply
        • The one ‘social media site’ was the Government’s own one.

          It’s hardly a typo. No wonder the people who queued for hours only to find that they had wasted their time are furious.

          Reply
          • Duker

             /  30th August 2020

            It was a typo …all people with pre existing conditions was the correct message.
            Its been clearly telegraphed as the original wording was the wrong emphasis

            Reply
            • Duker

               /  30th August 2020

              The full facebook story included the version that ‘only those at high risk of health conditions but no symptoms’ should be tested.
              A beatup in the NZ Herald left that part out , even though people would have seen the full version on FACEBOOK.
              I guess that reporter might be part of the next redundancies to increase NZME profits…he knows who he is.

    • I just want to make the point that 500 people WILL NOT die of the flu this year. Why? Because of the COVID restrictions. So including that in your argument is false and unhelpful. Beyond that I agree with some of your points.

      Reply
      • Duker

         /  30th August 2020

        People wont die either because of the restrictions on ‘elective operations’ means less complications that can lead to death.
        40% of the patients in ICU are those who had elective surgery, many people have additional illnesses that they suffer from.
        Its the reverse of some scaremongers who said MORE people will die because elective operations are postponed , although those whos need is urgent will be treatment.
        Definitely the less road deaths, work place deaths , less suicides, less flu deaths should be included as the ‘lives saved’ from Covid restrictions.
        NZ has been one of the countries that has had that effect , many other countries have a considerable increase in all deaths.

        Reply
      • We could have bought a lot of flu vaccines for $140,000,000,000.

        Reply
      • John J Harrison

         /  30th August 2020

        I stand corrected for 2020.
        However, that is the normal annual toll.
        We do not destroy our economy, livelihoods and lives every year because circa 500 die of the flu.

        Reply
    • duperez

       /  30th August 2020

      Hendy – the individual who provided the BS about 80,000 dying if we did not go to level 4 in March? Can you prove that he was wrong? Can you suggest why we should accept any contention from you rather than him?

      “Most Aucklanders blatantly ignore her decrees and enjoy the beaches and parks.”
      Could you run the numbers by us? You’ll need about 800,000 ignorers.

      “Meanwhile, the Pacific community continued to hold church and private prayer meetings with dozens attending in close proximity.” All the Pacific community? What numbers?

      “Ardern’s preposition is to instill us with abject fear and rely on her utterances from the “ Pulpit of Truth.”

      What’s your angle and why?

      Reply
      • John J Harrison

         /  30th August 2020

        Duperez, yes I can.
        Sweden has twice our population- check out the death rate.
        That’s your maths lesson for the day.

        Reply
        • duperez

           /  30th August 2020

          Just back a bit you said “Hendy and innumerable other so – called academics.”
          You think you know what academics are?

          I thought you might bring a bit of erudition to the table. Like answers to the questions. Is that the best you can come up with?

          You say that whatever happened in Sweden is proof the Hendy was wrong.

          I’m just going to have my maths lesson for the day to see what numbers are all about and why Hendy is so wrong:

          Sweden: Population 10.25 million Coronavirus Cases: 83,958 Deaths: 5,821
          New Zealand: Population 5.00 million Coronavirus Cases: 1729 Deaths: 22

          Reply
          • Duker

             /  30th August 2020

            Hendy did say if ‘all the corrective measures’ were taken the deaths would be around 20
            Heres the quote linked to before
            “Only a full mix of suppression strategies – population-wide social distancing with a lockdown and the closure of almost all businesses and schools – could keep the case numbers down enough for the healthcare system to cope, with a mortality rate of just 0.0004 per cent: About 20 people.

            No country that I know has refused to take any corrective measure , Sweden is more like level 2 with some other restrictions and some looser things.

            Hendy predicted a death rate of 0.0004% , which is what happened.

            Reply
          • John J Harrison

             /  30th August 2020

            Duperez, and with that quick calculation you have well and truly proved my point.
            Thank you.

            Reply
            • Duker

               /  30th August 2020

              “death rate of 0.0004% , which is what happened.”
              That number is around 20 people , we had 22. proves his point
              Your point about ‘a number’ in Arderns March Sat speech ?

              You made it up . She never said anything about deaths or dying at all.

            • duperez

               /  30th August 2020

              I didn’t think there was a calculation there just a list of facts.

              We only have half the population of Sweden so we should have gone full Sweden and only had 41,900 deaths.

              Then you could have raved about how wrong the ‘so-called academics’ were. If you were still alive.

              Anyway, speaking of calculations, have you processed the proof yet about ‘Most Aucklanders blatantly ignore her decrees and enjoy the beaches and parks?’ Where did you get the more tan 800,000 ignorers from”

              And of course numbers about ‘the Pacific community continued to hold church and private prayer meetings with dozens attending in close proximity.’

            • Duker

               /  30th August 2020

              ” ‘the Pacific community continued to hold church and private prayer meetings with dozens attending in close proximity.’”

              Anecdotal chatter from social media is it ?

  3. Duker

     /  30th August 2020

    This is REALLY waht ACT is saying , nothing about ‘living with covid at all.
    It boils down to high class BS and waffle buzz words.
    And its uses the verboten word WELLBEING as the play Jacinda-lite

    A multi-disciplinary Epidemic Response Centre
    Government as referee, not player: allow alternative isolation where safe and be electronically monitored; strict punishment for rule-breakers
    A risk-weighted response: treat different countries and travellers with different levels of caution
    A technology-driven response: use innovations such as the COVID Card, GPS locatable cell phones and Datamine’s ëlarm

    https://www.scoop.co.nz/stories/PA2008/S00166/acts-wellbeing-response-to-covid-19.htm

    GPS locatable cell phones ? Who knew there were such things..actually is bluetooth enabled phones that will allow contacts to be , well ‘contacted’

    Reply
    • If you quoted the entire article rather than nitpicking and trying to make out that this small section is the entire ACT Covid policy, it would be obvious that ACT’s approach is eminently sensible and workable.

      Reply
      • Duker

         /  30th August 2020

        ACT wrote the Press release which Scoop quoted in its entirety, are you saying their own release is ‘selective’ and doesnt give the full picture?
        Ring him up and tell Seymour that, even better record him saying ‘live with covid’ and release that ! Hahahaha

        Reply
        • Scoop quoted the whole thing, YOU didn’t.

          You shouldn’t have included the link, as this means that people will be able to see for themselves that you took a small section out of context.

          Reply
        • He has been recorded as saying that; do you not watch the news ? He said it to the press before the house sat,

          Reply
          • Duker

             /  30th August 2020

            Link it or shut up !

            Reply
            • Duker

               /  30th August 2020

              “He has been recorded as saying that;[false] do you not watch the news ? He said it to the press [false] before the house sat,
              Wheres the evidence , Its clear you ‘think that’ but no surprises as your head is full of nonsense…. endless nonsense as we have found over the last 5-6 months

            • There is NO POINT IN MAKING A LINK. YOU HAVE ALREADY DONE SO. THE SCOOP LINK HAS ONE TO ACT’S POLICY.

              THE VIDEO OF DAVID SEYMOUR SAYING WHAT I SAID HE DID IS ON GOOGLE.

          • Duker must think that One News put out a fake video and invented David’s speech which they quote in its entirety, and which I transcribed from their site.

            Reply
            • John J Harrison

               /  30th August 2020

              Kitty, like me you are going to have to get more disciplined.
              Try your best to ignore moronic, infantile and assorted lies from the resident Ardern “ fan – boy.”
              It most certainly leads to a much improved disposition as you look longingly at a good red that needs finishing off over dinner.
              I too have to learn what I am preaching and slowly getting better by the day.

            • I can’t drink red wine, it gives me migraines. Have one for me.

              There are some things that are hard to ignore; being called a liar, a thief, batty and loony (I have been to Canada and knew which bird was meant) or having senile dementia would anger anyone. These things are personal abuse and totally uncalled for. He has now begun talking about my pension (sic) for some reason, but as I am not on super and won’t be for a long time, I don’t know why he’s saying this. Meshuggenah ?

              Blazer thinks I am jealous of the PM because she’s married and I am not. Er, she’s not and I was !

              The saying about not casting pearls before swine does come to mind at times.

            • Duker

               /  30th August 2020

            • John J Harrison

               /  30th August 2020

              Duker, why do you treasure a Canadian coin with a bird representing your comments ?

            • Fight4nz

               /  30th August 2020

              “ Try your best to ignore moronic, infantile and assorted lies ”
              JJH, I am confident it is not your posts that are troubling her.
              Though you do like to sprinkle around the loony label along with a couple of your rwnj friends, so I can see this would get you confused.

            • duperez

               /  30th August 2020

              Ignore moronic, infantile and assorted lies?
              And learn what you are preaching and slowly get better by the day so that it doesn’t come across like something fallen out of the ‘Toolbox of Strewth? 😊

            • Blazer

               /  30th August 2020

              ‘that are hard to ignore; being called a liar, a thief, batty and loony ‘

              hilarious!!

        • ….says someone who thinks that drinking wine makes women have babies….

          Reply
          • Blazer

             /  30th August 2020

            leg opener
            “Gift” for your date to get her drunk to ensure a root. Usually cheap wine.
            Took her out to the park with a cheap bottle o’ leg opener, worked a charm mate!’-Urban Dictionary

            Reply
        • Many of us will have seen and spent those coins IN Canada, so know what they look like. Only the childish still get a laugh from their name.

          Reply
  4. Alan Wilkinson

     /  30th August 2020

    Public health is only possible so long as the public are prepared to be treated like animals. Otherwise it is a grotesque lie.

    Reply
    • Fight4nz

       /  30th August 2020

      It’s escaped your attention that we are animals?
      What lie?

      Reply
      • Alan Wilkinson

         /  30th August 2020

        Reality is private health. We are all responsible for our own. There is no such thing as public health unless we are content to be treated as interchangeable helpless animals.

        Reply
        • Fight4nz

           /  30th August 2020

          Public health is funded from the public purse. Private isn’t. Our system has a mix. Still not sure what you are driving at? “Reality is private health “?
          But I am happy to be the hapless animal when it comes to anything beyond the basics of medical treatment.

          Reply
          • Alan Wilkinson

             /  30th August 2020

            We are responsible for our own health and make decisions and choices about it all the time. Public health officials can’t do it for us and can’t control how we live. Let’s have an end to the pretence they can and have the right to do so. They can’t and don’t, whatever the law pretends to say.

            Reply
            • Fight4nz

               /  30th August 2020

              But you were saying emphatically somewhere in the last day or two, that testing must happen of people at the borders I think. You can fill in details.
              Doesn’t that contradict what you’re saying now?

            • Alan Wilkinson

               /  30th August 2020

              An airline has a right to protect its staff and customers. Requiring a clear test before embarking internationally is a reasonable and not onerous requirement.

            • Fight4nz

               /  30th August 2020

              Agreed.

              And if an Airline doesn’t impose this, why should a Government not require it for the same reasons plus its citizens?

            • Alan Wilkinson

               /  31st August 2020

              As a specific test to avoid infecting others that is justifiable. Extending controls to whole populations on a daily basis semi permanently is not.

            • Fight4nz

               /  31st August 2020

              All you are doing is stating your opinion as fact.

  5. Jack

     /  30th August 2020

    Trying to discourage a Christian again – when we’re all in need of uplifting words.

    Reply
    • Jack

       /  30th August 2020

      Sorry, that was meant to go up where Kitty was earlier

      Reply
      • Isn’t there something in the Bible about not rousing others to wrath ?

        Reply
        • Jack

           /  30th August 2020

          From the top of my head – parents to children

          Reply
          • Jack

             /  30th August 2020

            Mr Harrison, you and Kitty may keep learning from each other. I learn from big Al (up to a point. I refuse to go over the line of cult)
            I’m on Duker’s side today – just because

            Reply
  6. Reply
    • The news said 3 days, I think.

      The people who’d turned up in good faith were confused and angry, and probably won’t be in a big hurry to turn out again, even if this time the call is genuine.

      Reply
    • duperez

       /  30th August 2020

      Never heard of Jason Walls. I hope he is well. I’m surprised he’s made it this far what with all the opportunities for hysteria, panic, stress and overreaction over the past few months.

      He’ll be a cot case if something serious comes along.

      Reply
      • Alan Wilkinson

         /  30th August 2020

        You think telling 700,000 people to get tested by accident wasn’t serious?

        Reply
        • duperez

           /  30th August 2020

          I’d believe it was serious if 700,000 rushed down the road and lined up to get tested. I’d believe it was serious if hundreds of thousands lined up all night to get tested.

          I haven’t read enough about it yet to find who and how many are demanding that Ardern, Hipkins and Bloomfield resign. I guess I’ll hear that from Mike Hosking in the morning.

          The world did not end.

          Reply

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