Who to vote for?

Early voting starts on 3 October, and the election is on 17 October, less than five weeks away, but at that stage that seems like a long time to have to suffer an uninteresting, uninspiring campaign.

I don’t know who I’m going to vote for and I don’t care, but I will front up and vote for the referendums (End of Life Choice and Cannabis legalisation and control).

Jacinda Ardern has put a very veneer of niceness on an ultra cautious, some say timid campaign for Labour. Apart from Ardern there’s not much in the Labour ranks to inspire or attract my vote. Labour look like romping in, but unlikely with my support.

Since getting the most party votes three years ago but deciding against giving Winston peters what he wanted National have been disappointing. Simon Bridges failed to fire as leader, Todd Muller fizzled out quickly, and while I think that Judith Collins looked worth a try but she has also been disappointing, failing to step up.

National’s campaign and policies haven’t demanded much attention let alone votes, including mine. Their chances of coming anywhere near close to Labour look less than slim, which is what they deserve.

I’ve never considered voting NZ First and that hasn’t changed. I don’t like Winston Peters’ style of politics, and I don’t like Shane Jones’ style of politics. I’m not a fan of the policies that I’m aware of.

The media seems to have written off any chance of Jones winning Northland, so it looks to be all up to Winston bussing around the country trying to look interested in what people want for a few weeks. He looks jaded. His main offer seems to be to stop Labour doing stuff. His likely outcome is voters choosing to stop him and NZ First doing stuff like holding larger parties to political ransom.

Normally I would consider voting Green to help them survive in Parliament, I think their presence generally is worthwhile, but I can’t think why they deserve support. Leaders James Shaw and Marama Davidson don’t do it for me (and don’t seem widely popular even in their own party).

Greens went into the last campaign being ultra careful to not scare voters, signing up to a ‘fiscal responsibility’ agreement with Labour to try to portray themselves as responsible and deserving a seat at the Cabinet table. Then Metiria Turei gambled and lost, Greens lost half their support and just made it back into Parliament, and they negotiated a weak hand in Government.

This campaign they seem to have the opposite approach, saying they will force Labour to be a lot more radical. In response Labour are poaching their policies and probably their votes.

I have voted Green in the past but the current version lacks the leaders, the lineup and the priorities that do it for me.

David Seymour has done well with ACT this term, helped by National’s slide. He looks comfortable in Epsom and with ACT looking likely to make the threshold he should get a few MPs with him next term.

But I don’t know whether I will vote for them. I like some of their policies but am not a fan of others, probably about 50/50 which is less than for other parties. So a weak maybe but probably not.

None of the parties outside Parliament look like coming close to getting in, such is the prohibitive threshold that has made it nearly impossible for parties without MPs to get into Parliament.

The Maori Party seems to be struggling. Who are their leaders? What are their key policies? I won’t be their target market.

New Conservatives have a lot of hoardings up in the South Island, with a lot of messages that are difficult to pick up at a glance. I don’t need to glance to exclude them from my options, they are really not my thing.

Advance NZ have proven popular with a few thousand people but they are certainly not for me. Jami-Lee Ross alone would put me off, but he is trying to piggy back on a bunch of bizarre claims and misguided misfits.

I may look to see if there’s any other small parties deserving of support. That would be a vote that does nothing but may be the best choice this time.

At least our insipid campaign is likely to mean a continuation of much the same mediocre but safe Government. The choices are much more demoralising in the US.


Andrea Vance is also not impressed with our election choices – When these are the options, this is why I don’t vote

When Parliament returns, these careerists will return to business as usual. Politics is the only business that doesn’t suffer in a recession.

It’s a system built for failure: failure to deliver results in the public interest and failure to foster policy innovation. Worse still, doesn’t demand accountability for failure to fix these problems.

The current Labour Government is the starkest example of this stagnation.

My decision not to vote is not apathy. It’s cynicism: choosing between the lesser of two evils isn’t really much of a choice at all.

I’d vote in support of that analysis.

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74 Comments

  1. It is worth remembering that Parties don’t win elections, they lose them.
    Labour despite riding high in the very few polls didn’t win the last election, they were appointed (anointed) by Winston.
    Till Covid and the “climate of fear”and their sure footed handling of that they still needed support to remain in power.
    It all makes for interesting times, eh.

    Reply
    • Corky

       /  14th September 2020

      Times will be very interesting if New Zealand Last and the Greens don’t make it back. Maybe ACT does better than expected..and Labour unexpectedly not so good. The fat lady may have wobbled up to the microphone, but she hasn’t sung yet.

      Reply
  2. John J Harrison

     /  14th September 2020

    Pete, this is why I enjoy this blog.
    I have no clue as to your political persuasions, as you have pissed off the left and right so you are clearly doing something right !
    From your comments I presume you are going to give Act your party vote.
    Let us all know on 18/10 how you voted – or maybe not.

    Reply
  3. I think Labour will win with probably enough votes to govern alone. I think the Greens will scrape back in and will form a coalition with Labour. My party vote is going to Sustainable NZ. I am not sure about electorate, Christchurch Central, as haven’t seen who is standing here. I won’t vote for the incumbent Labour MP, Duncan Webb, because he wanted the city council to increase rates. He’s one Duncan I wouldn’t want to have a beer with. I shall probably vote “yes” for the both referenda questions.

    Reply
  4. Conspiratoor

     /  14th September 2020

    Some friendly advice for pg and others who don’t know who to vote for…

    “If you are part of a society that votes, then do so. There may be no candidates and no measures you want to vote for …but there are certain to be ones you want to vote against. In case of doubt vote against. By this rule you will rarely go wrong”

    – The Notebooks of Lazarus Long

    Reply
    • Griff.

       /  14th September 2020

      You bet me to it .
      Like Mark Twain Heinlein has a lot of memorable ideas.
      This is Robert A. Heinlein best contribution to the human condition.
      Pay it forward.

      The banker reached into the folds of his gown, pulled out a single credit note. “But eat first—a full belly steadies the judgment. Do me the honor of accepting this as our welcome to the newcomer.”

      His pride said no; his stomach said YES! Don took it and said, “Uh, thanks! That’s awfully kind of you. I’ll pay it back, first chance.”
      “Instead, pay it forward to some other brother who needs it.

      https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Heinlein_Society
      As I have already said Griff will be electorate voting national.
      Griff lives in the northland electorate.
      He is voting for the national candidate purely to keep NZ first out of Parliament.

      Reply
  5. Alan Wilkinson

     /  14th September 2020

    Simple choice for me. Seymour has done a good job and deserves the party vote. I’ll be voting against NZF/Jones for the electorate.

    Reply
    • Duker

       /  14th September 2020

      Careful what you ask for there…. a mini caucus will be poison for Seymour who only knows a one man band.
      He was so insignificant that in the last national governments he didnt even become a minister like that other one man band Peter Dunne.

      Reply
      • He is hardly insignificant; and, as it happens, he was offered a ministerial post and declined it. Nor is he a one man band, as you would know if you knew him

        Reply
        • Duker

           /  14th September 2020

          “Education was the portfolio he would like most in his time in Government but when he weighed up the associate role offered, combined with Regulatory Reform, it wasn’t enough.
          Wanted Education and didnt get it because ?
          A single MP party is a one man band
          https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/politics/74827955/judith-collins-reinstated-to-cabinet-acts-david-seymour-rejects-minister-role

          Reply
          • duperez

             /  14th September 2020

            Maybe he didn’t want education because of the conflict. He says he/they want free choice for people including parents and schooling He doesn’t want school zones. His survival though depends on all sorts of conundrums about those.
            Better to shelve the principles.

            Reply
          • You were silly to put that link there; it gives the lie to your statement about it not being enough and the rest of it.

            Reply
            • Duker

               /  14th September 2020

              Its a direct quote from that link that Seymour turned down an ‘associate education job’ as it wasnt enough.
              he felt he now had his big boys pants on and wanted Minister of Education or nothing …..he got nothing as he couldnt negotiate out of a paper bag

              As we know the Assisted Dying Bill wasnt withdrawn form the ballot till 3 months before the 2017 election. So there was no additional work required before that time and when it was introduced Seymour delegated all the hard yakka to Van der Velden. All that could have happened as an “Associate Minister of education to Nikki Kaye’

      • Alan Wilkinson

         /  14th September 2020

        More big fat red squirrels, Duker.

        Reply
  6. Gerrit

     /  14th September 2020

    Simple choice in the new Takanini electorate in regards the seat.

    Rima Nakhle all the way.

    http://auckland.scoop.co.nz/2020/06/rima-nakhle-nationals-candidate-in-takanini/

    As for party vote, still deciding between National and Act.

    Reply
    • ACT, of course. The voice of reason.

      Reply
      • Duker

         /  14th September 2020

        The voice of the 5%, as long as it spoke what the Gibbs wanted. Hide was glove puppet of Gibbs ( his connection came as someone with a background in economics who Gibbs picked from obscurity as a university lecturer) and Seymour had to have that support.
        We can see how Seymour has sailed a different tack now Tony Gibbs is dead, but Jenny is still around and donating heavily along with some other 0.01%ers

        Reply
        • Alan Wilkinson

           /  14th September 2020

          There’s a lot to be said for obscurity. You seem to enjoy it.

          Reply
        • Gerrit

           /  14th September 2020

          Love the conspiracy theory.

          Reply
          • Duker

             /  14th September 2020

            No conspiracy, Gibb and his ex wife have built the ACT party into to the 1% party its been since 2005.
            Although a newer mega donor Reeves, a shearer/cow cocky turned commercial property investor is likely now pulling the strings…Im wondering aloud if hes got the Advance party with Billy TK as a side ‘investment’ as well.
            No wonder ACT has flip flopped around the covid lockdowns and embraced the looney gun lobby.

            Reply
            • Alan Wilkinson

               /  14th September 2020

              It’s terrible if folks have their own ideas and don’t all want to vote for our glorious socialist future.

            • Gerrit

               /  14th September 2020

              So do the unions (especially state sector) control the Labour party and is that an equal to your conspiracy theory in regards ACT?

              After all the farmers plus the Chinese control National (they do don’t they?) So all political parties are “owned” by those who provide the money.

              And the racing and fishing industries provide money for NZFirst and pull their strings. Or so it would seem but who know for sure with Peters.

            • The Gibbs are well-known as ACT supporters, but anyone who thinks that they made ACT is dreaming.

            • Duker

               /  14th September 2020

              What state sector unions donate to the labour party ?
              No education union is a major donor , over $30k.
              https://elections.nz/democracy-in-nz/political-parties-in-new-zealand/party-donations-and-loans-by-year/
              Check it out and name them.

            • Fight4nz

               /  14th September 2020

              “ So all political parties are “owned” by those who provide the money.”
              Pretty much.
              The point Duker is trying to make I think is ACT and National have wealthy benefactors. The level of support that allows them to exploit the maximum promotional opportunities available. This is why they have had disproportionate hold on power over time and convince those are irrelevant to their actual values and policies (some to their own detriment) to vote for them. If they got the vote of only the 5 – 10% of the electorate they actually represent they would have sunk without trace eons ago.
              Whereas Labour and Green support is mainly their voters and what they can raise from “sausage sizzles”. I guess that’s why they can relate to the teachers.

            • A number of unions are significant benefactors of Labour, and they also have voting rights in the party.

              NZ First has influential benefactors by the look of who donates and who benefits from NZF policies.

              Both of these situations are well known.

            • Blazer

               /  14th September 2020

              ACT was Gibbs ‘baby’ designed to privatise more State assets and deliver them to …’rich pricks’ at bargain basement…rates.

              NZ H-‘At the other end of the political spectrum, ACT Party founder Alan Gibbs, along with his former wife, art collector Dame Jenny Gibbs, …’

            • Duker

               /  14th September 2020

              “A number of unions”
              7 Labour Party Affiliated Unions
              ‘E tū – created through the merger of the Engineering, Printing and Manufacturing Union and the Service & Food Workers Union in 2015.[92]
              Maritime Union of New Zealand (MUNZ)
              New Zealand Dairy Workers Union (DWU)
              New Zealand Meat & Related Trades Workers Union (MWU)
              Rail and Maritime Transport Union (RMTU)
              Central Amalgamated Workers’ Union ( Construction)

              No teachers unions , no state sector unions apart from rail

            • Alan Wilkinson

               /  14th September 2020

              Labour are pretty expert at securing taxpayer funding for themselves which not only doesn’t have to be solicited but doesn’t have to be declared.

        • Blazer

           /  14th September 2020

          Alan Gibbs was the man behind ACT…Jenny’s ex.

          He describes himself an ‘inventor’ these days.

          Reply
          • Alan Wilkinson

             /  14th September 2020

            Nice sculptures.

            Reply
          • Duker

             /  14th September 2020

            Yes , my mistake with the first names

            Reply
            • John J Harrison

               /  14th September 2020

              Duker, you will be incandescent with rage when you realize on election night that parliament will be made up of only 3 parties.
              ACT will increase its number of MP’s by over 700% and could be the most powerful depending on the level of support for the two establishment parties.

            • Duker

               /  14th September 2020

              National goes down , ACT goes up, but not as much.

              You seem to forget that parties that arent parliament ( win seat or over 5%) their vote isnt counted when seats are allocated . Its called the wasted vote and essentially is distributed to the other parties and if labour is near 50% then its gets roughly half the wasted vote seats, which could be between 3 -6 extra.
              Greens are in big danger because the 18-25 yr olds only 50% vote , while the 50+ voters its 80% . Thats good news for NZF. The polls distribute the numbers by demographics not by voting demographics

            • Blazer

               /  14th September 2020

              ‘Alan Gibbs is a good bloke; he never puts on side. He cheerfully describes himself as a ‘rich prick.’

              He has got at least $250 million reasons to be cheerful(compliments of Telecom privatisation)

          • ACT was founded by Roger Douglas and Derek Quigley, not Alan Gibbs.

            Reply
            • He was a founding member, not the same thing at all. My late husband was one, and he was not the founder, either.

              Your envy of the rich is rather sad.

            • Duker

               /  14th September 2020

              Never said he founded it- my words were “built”- , but his money is the reason for it still existing , along with that of other rich listers.

            • Blazer

               /  14th September 2020

              You are wrong…again.

              ‘Rogernomics’ was the catalyst for Gibbs fortune…=cheap Govt assets.

            • Duker

               /  14th September 2020

              From Blazers link
              ‘At the other end of the political spectrum, ACT Party founder Alan Gibbs, along with his former wife, art collector Dame Jenny Gibbs, have donated more than $200,000 to ACT between them this year.”

              Thats one year , likely its been $1-2 mill since Gibbs said to Prebble, Douglas and Quigley – Lets do This

            • Blazer is unaware that Alan Gibbs was a wealthy man before Roger Douglas’s financial reforms; he also seems to think that being a founding member is the same as being the founder of a party. ACT began as the Association of Consumers & Taxpayers some time before it became a political party.

              By his logic my husband and I founded ACT, which is nonsense. We were there from the beginning; I was at the first meeting. But I am NOT a founder.

              $200,000 a year wouldn’t keep them going. Don’t be so naive.

            • Blazer

               /  14th September 2020

              the link is from a respected NZ news source.Says FOUNDER.

              I am aware Gibbs was wealthy prior to Rogernomics.
              His car dealership business was very profitable(huge margins then).

              As he has said himself…privatisation reaped him an unimaginable windfall.
              He became one of NZ’s richest men along with his collaborater Michael Fay.

              Flying Douglas and co from Welly to Aucks in a private jet cemented a …cosy relationship.

              ACT is a recognised dumping ground for past use by date ..politicians.

            • Duker

               /  14th September 2020

              “The initial idea of forming The Association of Consumers and Taxpayers first came about in a mid-1991 meeting between Roger Douglas and a few Backbone Club activists, and by early 1992 the idea had gathered momentum. The actual catalyst for the group’s formation (and the idea for its name) came after Douglas visited and addressed the Canadian Taxpayers Federation (Rudman, 1994: p.C8). Douglas returned to New Zealand determined to start a New Zealand variation on the Canadian group.”
              and the founding members of this ‘association’

              Sir Roger Douglas, former Labour Minister of Finance;
              Sir Peter Elworthy, former president of Federated Farmers;
              Mr Rob McLagan, former chief executive of Federated Farmers;
              Robyn Leeming, operations manager of Duroid Ltd, a Fletcher Challenge subsidiary; ….
              Mr Rick Vallance, a farmer involved with the Tararua Meat Co-operative; The Hon Derek Quigley, former National cabinet minister;
              Mr Michael Gorman, a management consultant;
              Mr Andy Gregory, communications manager for the Employers’ Federation;
              Mr Cedric Percy, a Wairarapa farmer;
              Mr Barrie Saunders, a public relations consultant who has done work for the Business Roundtable;
              Deborah Coddington, a journalist;
              Mr Rodney Hide, an economist with Gibbs Securities;
              Mr Bryan Mockridge, project manager with the computer firm Paxux

              Hide wasnt there because he was a ‘notable’ like most of the others he was there because he was the mouthpeice eyes and ears of Alan Gibbs
              https://liberation.typepad.com/liberation/2009/01/act-party-history-1-formation-of-a-pressure-group.html
              later when MMP began thats when ‘the party’ was started from the ‘association’
              Figure in ACT were of course opposed to MMP
              ” Key personnel working with ACT included three former leaders of the anti-MMP Campaign For Better Government: Owen Jennings, Brian Nicolle and Priscilla Tate (J Roper, 1996: p.34). Act’s association with this and other pressure groups, such as the Business Roundtable and Federated Farmers, did not help its image as a progressive party of the future.

              Rd17ACT officially became a political party in November 1994. However it was not until February 27 of the following year that the party was officially launched, and not until April that year when it ran its concentrated media campaign.”

            • Blazer

               /  14th September 2020

              Can’t see the imaginary former husband amongst the founders!

        • Blazer

           /  14th September 2020

          Losers gallery…ACT

          Roger Douglas (1994–1996)
          Richard Prebble (1996–2004)
          Rodney Hide (2004–2011)
          Don Brash (2011)
          John Banks (2012–2014)
          Jamie Whyte (2014)
          David Seymour.

          The only one with no ‘baggage’ is Jamie Whyte who didn’t know what was going on and seems to have vanished without a…trace!

          Reply
          • John J Harrison

             /  14th September 2020

            Blazer, you really are the epitome of pathetic.
            What have you ever done in your life as an elected office holder ?
            Be it local school committee, local council or national politics.
            Have you ever stood for anything, or are you a full time loser ?
            Continually demonizing those that have had the guts to stand up for their beliefs even when it costs dearly, both financially and domestically.
            Grow up and get a life.
            Better yet tell us all of your innumerable successes on the public stage.
            Gutless – you will continue to hide behind your non de plume.

            Reply
            • Blazer

               /  14th September 2020

              Thats rich coming from you John….play the ball not the man is the name of the …game.

              ‘If you meet triumph or disaster….treat those imposters exactly the…same’!(R.Kipling)

              You can be a successful failure,have honours degrees,boast and brag about your self on the internet and it actually means NOTHING!

            • John J Harrison

               /  14th September 2020

              Blazer, in other words you have achieved SFA.
              Not even elected dog catcher in your community?
              Clearly your community is well aware of your “ attributes “ thus you are non entity with a PhD in meaningless bitching at others who have actually achieved something in life.
              Sad !

            • Blazer

               /  14th September 2020

              Not so John….I did invest in this project and still think it has potential…

  7. Jack

     /  14th September 2020

    As usual, I find myself agreeing with everyone politically. This will be the first time I can’t vote. Fiscally – Act hands down, but this is best shared in Open.

    Reply
  8. Duker

     /  14th September 2020

    More provincial pork barreling for Otago and Southland from National – the labour-lite campaign is in full swing.
    Some money for trains too, Mosgiel to Dunedin…hahahha, its just a feasibility study, which any fool can tell you its unfeasible
    https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/politics/122756480/national-unveils-140-million-transport-plan-for-lower-south-island
    “There are 850 bridges in Southland, with 171 needing replacement within the next 12 years. Little funding has been allocated and planning needs to begin now,”
    Ahhh the pperenial more bidges ….9 years of neglect means nothing was done ( and still wont be)

    and more policy and plans stolen from The Greens/Labour/NZ First
    ” included safety improvements on State Highway 1 between Mosgiel and Balclutha, a heavy bypass for Mosgiel, and passing lanes and safety improvements for the road between Queenstown and Te Anau.

    When labour promises safety improvements its bad , but its election time, seats are in danger so its wholesale grab of anything that ‘has a road’ in it.
    During the 9 years of neglect , if it wasnt in the RONS it was wasnt getting done. They want the Chinese funded Infrastructure bank with ex nats as directors to come to the rescue

    Reply
  9. Alan Wilkinson

     /  14th September 2020

    ?? The original link works. What are you on about, B?

    Reply
  10. NOEL

     /  15th September 2020

    I’m miss the opportunity to tick the missing “A pox on all their houses” box.
    Have voted National, Labour Greens and NZ First with my party vote and also not at all.
    I guess it will be none this time and I will end up debating that round Robbin argument an empty form is not a vote.
    I presume they are counted as invalid along with with defaced forms.

    Reply

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