Open Forum Wednesday

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53 Comments

  1. lurcher1948

     /  7th October 2020

    Ms Collins looks like shes being keeped up,her eyes keep closing,maybe her energy is deserting her, [deleted] being 61 it takes it out of you when your own party is in turmoil.

    Reply
    • lurcher1948

       /  7th October 2020

      My lovely wife wants to know why Ms Collins shouts so much,and argues when she loses,NZ doesn’t need to have Ms Collins inflicted apon us.so whose the next cab on Nationals rank…Paul Goldsmith

      Reply
  2. Corky

     /  7th October 2020

    I hope I heard wrong. I hope Mike and Barry Soper were sleep deprived when they spoke about this funding:

    $100 million for marae restoration, signed off by Grant Robinson and Phil Housing.

    This is on top of millions SOME marae have already received.

    I doubt this generosity will get Shane Jones reelected. But it will guarantee him plenty of free kai during his retirement.

    Reply
    • Corky

       /  7th October 2020

      Let me add before it’s pointed out to me, that this funding will create 3000 jobs. I don’t believe that. What it will do if the money is bulk allocated to marae and not paid by government for work finished and signed off on, is split marae committees apart as they wrangle over what is done and who gets their hands on, or not, that money.

      Reply
      • Blazer

         /  7th October 2020

        ‘$100 million for marae restoration’….I raise you another 100million for the Americas Cup which will be a nice earner for a handful of wealthy,sloth like parasites….and of course bring X into the economy and provide Y jobs! 😦

        Reply
        • Corky

           /  7th October 2020

          Well, of course, that’s crap. The whole economy benefits. Even the lower class who are hired to attend to the welffy when they are PORT side.

          Talking of supoposed economic mismanagment:

          https://www.nzherald.co.nz/sport/news/article.cfm?c_id=4&objectid=12370797

          This government just doesn’t get it. Neither do the halwits who are voting for them.

          Reply
          • The Americas Cup is a huge yawn as fas as I am concerned, but it does bring money in. The cafes and hotels are in dire straits thanks to the PM, and they will benefit hugely. So will shops and other businesses. Perhaps Blazer thinks that these people are wealthy parasites.

            It’s spelt ‘wealthy’, by the way.

            Reply
            • duperez

               /  7th October 2020

              “The cafes and hotels are in dire straits thanks to the PM.”

              Yeah right.

            • The Auckland ones are, do try to keep up.

            • duperez

               /  7th October 2020

              I am keeping up. I admit it is hard to keep up with distorted logic.

              If you are going to say businesses are in dire straits thanks to the PM I presume that’s because the buck stops with her because she has the label on her door. In that sense I suppose everything that happens in the country is down to her. It’s her fault if something goes wrong or doesn’t meet someone’s approval.

              Which suggestion is nonsense of course.

            • Do you subscribe to the fawning adulation about her being a saint who has saved NZ from C19 ? People can’t have it both ways. She can’t be only responsible for nationwide good things and not bad ones.

            • Blazer

               /  7th October 2020

              Your posts are such a source of amusement.

              You ,who are supposedly well educated have a one dimensional outlook and absolutely zero understanding of economic dynamics.

          • Fight4nz

             /  7th October 2020

            The tennis loss does not look good. Would really like to see how unconvincing the government could be on this one.
            Also wonder what economic value it brings without a contingent of overseas money coming in with it?

            Reply
            • Fight4nz

               /  7th October 2020

              For “Also”, read “On the other hand…”.

    • Duker

       /  7th October 2020

      Its NOT marae restoration , which has been funded many years including during Key/English years
      https://www.odt.co.nz/news/national/pm-reveals-100m-funding-package-maori
      ‘In a statement today, Ardern said access to capital was a challenge for Maori landowners as the special status of their land meant commercial banks have been less willing to lend them money.
      Today’s funding announcement would enable Maori to access the capital required to progress projects which are ready for investment and would support moves towards higher-value land use, she said.”
      She cited research from 2013 which revealed roughly 80 per cent of Maori freehold land was either underutilised or underproductive.”

      Its to provide funds to develop Maori land like dairying horticulture etc

      Reply
  3. NOEL

     /  7th October 2020

    Reroof, kitchen upgrade,toilet upgrade and other refurbishments to code for 19 marae would be right.

    Reply
    • Corky

       /  7th October 2020

      EXCELLENT!! Not quite $100 million. But in these times of cultural cringes…and hatred of Western culture, it’s nothing to be sneezed at.

      Reply
  4. lurcher1948

     /  7th October 2020

    Ms Collins the trump wannabe shouting over everyone

    Reply
    • Miss Ardern, ignoring social distancing; it’s for other people, not her.

      I don’t know where you think that you hear Judith Collins shouting, I never have.

      Reply
      • duperez

         /  7th October 2020

        Her comments regarding one of her Auckland MPs shouted arrogance and that her concepts and practice of leadership are out of the textbooks of those despised as tyrannical rulers.

        Reply
        • The PM went into lockdown based upon her own ‘instinct’ as opposed to ‘science and evidence’ (her own words) That seems rather dictatorial. Bugger science and evidence, go for instinct.

          Reply
          • Duker

             /  7th October 2020

            It wasnt instinct only as you keep telling ‘the same repeated lie’ ,( and been corrected many times) she said the science wasnt clear cut and was a range of options. No one knew anything for certain back then other than doing nothing wasnt an option.

            Judith is the one man band making it up on the fly – as she has both admitted and denied on separate days and then bullying an Mp who speaks up.

            Reply
          • duperez

             /  7th October 2020

            And everything you say is based on your instinct.

            You are depicting Ardern waking up one day, saying “bugger science and evidence my instinct tells me this so is what I’LL do.”

            You interpret a comment the PM made as her solely coming to a conclusion, making a decision and going into lockdown based upon nothing but her own instinct. Other people, various organisations, the overall situation, unfolding events and other factors were all subservient or anonymous to her feeling everything was her show, her making up her mind and the world being ordered to follow.

            If that is the claim you are making I think it is absurd and simply based on your antipathy towards Ardern. And based on a hopeless understanding of the way government is carried out in any situation let alone the pandemic one as it was happening.

            However, I read some sites which have the PM somewhere left of Stalin and somewhere more dictatorial than Mao Zedong. What I see as delusion some see as some sort of reality.

            Reply
  5. Jack

     /  7th October 2020

    Caricatures of themselves in the Press Leaders debate and Jacinda easily seemed the more pleasant.

    [Deleted. You’re back on your agenda, and you’re also making claims about politicians that you can’t know. PG]

    Reply
  6. duperez

     /  7th October 2020

    I treated myself to a pretty rare visit to Kiwiblog this morning. Ardern seemingly wasn’t left bloodied and battered in a TV thing last night so there is no big post about the event or floods of stuff there about how Collins conquered.

    There is a solid running torrent of resignation and pettiness and the simply pathetic about the state of play. Amusing to consider that most likely amongst the downhearted and desperate are many who don’t want 16 year olds to get the vote. For reasons to do with lack of maturity and inability to have reasonable perspectives. 🙃

    Reply
    • lurcher1948

       /  7th October 2020

      WOW 2 votes RED 2 ticksYES…LETS KEEP MOVING

      Reply
    • Corky

       /  7th October 2020

      You should have stayed there. I would not have missed you.

      Reply
      • duperez

         /  7th October 2020

        Were you there? Do you go there? There’s a heap of prejudice, ignorance, and intolerance to be explore. They probably call newstalkzb and that magic talk station with their festering malevolence too.

        One of the qualities is pissed-offness. I get the image of middle and older men who can’t handle it that there is a younger (relatively) woman PM. They will never get over it and I like that..

        Reply
        • Corky

           /  7th October 2020

          ”Were you there? Do you go there? There’s a heap of prejudice, ignorance, and intolerance to be explore.”

          No.

          ”They probably call newstalkzb and that magic talk station with their festering malevolence too.”

          And there we have it, folks. Doesn’t take much for a Lefties true colours to come out.

          ” I get the image of middle and older men who can’t handle it that there is a younger (relatively) woman PM. They will never get over it and I like that..”

          I can’t talk for others, but I think Jacinda is a nice person. She’s the type of person I would want my toddlers taught by. She is the type of person who would make a good nurse…even run a small business.

          But she’s not a politicians rear end. She has no skills or intellectual depth.

          Reply
          • Blazer

             /  7th October 2020

            She has no skills or intellectual depth.’-compared to who..Corky!

            Reply
            • Corky

               /  7th October 2020

              Take your pick.

            • Blazer

               /  7th October 2020

              Don’t duck….be brave and name 1 or 2.

            • Corky

               /  7th October 2020

              @ Blazer. Shane Reti and Judith Collins.

              @ Fight4nz

              ”How does that conclusion sit with her clear win in the most robust debate seen so far?”

              Two points. Judith was off centre for that debate because of the email fiasco. And Jacinda was due for a win. In fact she had to win. It was just a simple change in energy.

              Just because Jacinda is a good communicator doesn’t make her a good politician. She can’t man manage her team. How is she going to handle the pressure next year when things get tough? For example she MAY have to cancel any increases to benefits and super. That will straight away see her poll rating go down

          • Fight4nz

             /  7th October 2020

            “But she’s not a politicians rear end.“
            How does that conclusion sit with her clear win in the most robust debate seen so far?

            Reply
  7. lurcher1948

     /  7th October 2020

    Another great Guitarist crosses the golden bridge, to join my past dogs, forever loved
    Eddie Van Halen, RIP….my dogs will love you forever

    Reply
  8. Duker

     /  7th October 2020

    After Ms Collins prayer photo op on Sunday ( regular churchgoers say no one they know prays like that in Anglican churches, and even in the 70s when I went a few times with friends no one did it that way either)
    Today a staged walkabout on Ponsonby Rd…apparently it was ‘seeded with party activists’ spread out along her route as Collins says ‘not much foot traffic on Ponsonby Rd” …..hello , this is the place which is lined with shops and cafes for good reason. We are getting into ‘peak porkies’ season.

    Reply
  9. Blazer

     /  7th October 2020

    Atypical behaviour from one of NZ’s wealthiest businessmen….all done in the best possible taste…paysannes..

    read://https_www.stuff.co.nz/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.stuff.co.nz%2Fbusiness%2Findustries%2F123005880%2Feric-watson-found-in-contempt-of-court-as-sir-owen-glenn-pursues-him-for-more-than-50m

    Reply
  10. Duker

     /  7th October 2020

    Game up the other day when Hooton said when Muller and his coterie including Hooton ( there was a complete clean-out) there was no, track polling, no policies, no campaign grid.

    Had me wondering what a campaign grid was

    The Political message quadrant is as it sounds — used by political strategists and communicators. It asks four questions that the campaign must answer:

    What will I tell voters about me?
    What will I tell them about my opponent?
    What will my opponent tell voters about his or herself?
    What will my opponent tell voters about me?

    and in more detail
    “How to use the grid
    Here are some questions that will help you develop messages for each quadrant.

    -What will I tell voters about me?
    What are my/our values?
    What’s at stake and how will I/we be involved?
    What have I/we achieved?
    What is my/our view of the world?
    What will I/we do if elected?
    How will that make people’s lives better?

    -What will I tell them about my opponent?
    What is their negative track record?
    What harm have they caused?
    What are the negative consequences of what they are proposing?
    How will they make people’s lives worse?
    What indicates they don’t have people’s interests at heart?
    Who do they associate with?
    What do other credible groups say that’s negative about them?

    -What will my opponent tell voters about his or herself?
    What is their perceived positive track record?
    How have they improved people’s lives?
    What are the perceived positive consequences of what they are proposing?
    How will they make people’s lives better?
    What indicates they do have people’s interests at heart?
    What do other credible groups say that’s positive about them?

    -What will my opponent tell voters about me?
    What is my/our perceived negative track record?
    What are the perceived negative consequences of what I/we are proposing?
    How will I/we allegedly make people’s lives worse?
    What allegedly indicates I/we don’t have people’s interests at heart?
    Who do I/we associate with that is perceived to be negative?
    What do other credible groups say about us that’s negative?

    Interesting in a way
    ‘In his book, The Political Brain, Drew Westen says campaigners who don’t understand the idea of emotion and the passionate mind tend to lose in all four quadrants of the grid. No campaign has a chance of winning if that happens.

    Which is what Ive been saying, voters who think soley about ‘polocies’ are mostly kidding themselves, underneath its passion and emotion – both positive ane negative which drives decisions.
    I often comment here on posts on Peters who only appears when its a negative response, and thats normal, but some dont recognise the emotional triggers arent rational ones like they think.
    Collins gets a lot of negative response too, and I think she started out sticking to all the quadrants in the nats campaign grid but has reverted to type , which is to the very negative response people have .
    Labour has been cunning rather that attacking her they have let Collins create her own negative press. ex the townhall debate In Christchurch where she ‘gave back double’ or was ‘shouty’ as some people said.

    Reply
  11. Duker

     /  7th October 2020

    Brownlee has been losing it too
    <bBrownlee lashed out as he was not across the policy.

    '"Is it Anna Bracewell Warren? Yep. She should know better than asking this. Your people give me the shits. They're bloody lazy as buggery, They could've gone to Shane [Reti] today."" Brownlee said.
    “Newshub had organised the interview to take place last Tuesday. The National party media team were alerted to the likely topics of the interview. A Wellington based staff member did the interview on behalf of our political team.

    Internal polls are being hidden from Caucus for good reasons …. it break morale
    https://www.newshub.co.nz/home/politics/2020/10/leak-some-in-national-say-the-writing-is-on-the-wall-they-ll-lose-the-election.html
    https://www.newshub.co.nz/home/politics/2020/10/gerry-brownlee-s-unfair-attack-on-newshub-journalist-debated-by-tova-o-brien-mark-richardson.html

    “ANALYSIS: Newshub has been told by some in the National Party there’s a sense the writing is on the wall; that National is going to lose this election.
    Newshub was told if that happens, Judith Collins being rolled is a case of when, not if. So although she says she wants to stay on, some in National feel very differently.”
    Her grandiosity gets bigger every day, the pressure must be immense, yet she says she loves it.

    Internal polls are being hidden from Caucus for good reasons …. it would break morale

    Reply
    • duperez

       /  7th October 2020

      Internal polls being hidden from that caucus is not new. There are/were always good reasons.

      The prioritising of reasons for that often puzzled me. The party doing that probably includes many whose mission was to get production and business humming and using modern methods and approaches to achieve that. Telling the people in the engine room you don’t trust them with vital information about their mission? Information to focus their strategies and effort?

      Bizarre when you consider Parata, Kaye and Tolley based their education strategies on relentless data, stats and information and that being available to impact on action.

      Reply
      • Duker

         /  7th October 2020

        That’s what happened to Bridges near the end, polling data was hidden from caucus…happening with Collins too for the same reasons .if it was good they should be getting ‘trends’.
        I thought the next CB would be out by now but it’s Fri now , hope the numbers aren’t so weird they have to keep calling people to fix a rouge result…more likely to be a few % out not 10% like people think but if it’s out of CB previous range would ask questions

        Reply

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