Parish withdraws from Anglican Church over same-sex marriage

An Anglican parish in Dunedin has voted for disaffiliation with the Anglican Church due to opposition to the ‘abomination’ of homosexuality and opposition to blessing same-sex marriages.

Several other parishes around the country have taken similar action.

ODT:  Parish to leave church

A Dunedin parish opposed to the blessing of same-sex civil marriages has withdrawn from the Anglican Church, its minister saying homosexuality is an “abomination”.

St Matthew’s in Stafford St this week voted to disaffiliate from the church.

The decision means those in the parish who supported the move — it is understood  79% voted for disaffiliation — will have to find a new place to worship.

Bishop of Dunedin the Rt Rev Steven Benford confirmed the move yesterday. He said St Matthew’s voted to disaffiliate at a special meeting on Monday, in what was “a result of the General Synod resolution on the blessing of same-sex civil marriages passed in May 2018”.

In May, Dr Benford sent an email to his congregation in response to the move to allow priests to bless same-sex marriages and civil unions.

The vicar (or is that ex-vicar?) would not discuss the matter, but has previously made strong anti-homosexual comments.

St Matthew’s vicar, the Rev Stu Crosson, declined to discuss the matter yesterday.

But earlier this year Mr Crosson wrote the move to allow the blessing of same-sex marriages “appears to me to be a step into false teaching, contrary to the unified witness of scripture, a denial of what it means to be faithful, human, image bearers, in our maleness and femaleness and as such an idolatrous step away from our God”.

Mr Crosson said to bless something God called an abomination and the apostle Paul described as “inviting the wrath of God” seemed destined to invite the judgement of God upon the church.

To ‘restore’ the parts of the Bible they choose.

In a May document the parish suggested aligning itself with the Global Anglican Church, a movement that describes itself as “a global family of authentic Anglicans standing together to retain and restore the Bible to the heart of the Anglican communion”.

The parish could also “plant a new church in Dunedin, not under the Anglican banner”.

I’m not sure how well they have thought through the implications of de-affiliation.

Anglican diocesan registrar Andrew Metcalfe said yesterday the church and its buildings were owned by the Anglican Church.

A process would begin to deal with matters such as how to deal with paid staff at the church, he said.

The church would look for advice from Canterbury and discuss how it dealt with the churches there that disaffiliated.

“It is, for them and for us, unknown territory in many ways.

Perhaps they should have checked this territory out before deciding to disaffiliate. They are now shorty of a venue, and may also be short of staff and finances.

It may be a challenge trying to stick to archaic Bible based principles in a modern world.

 

Same sex marriage supported in Australia

Same sex Australian couples may not have to come to New Zealand to get married soon after a referendum that strongly supported same sex marriage looks set to push change there.

Nearly 62 percent of Australians voted in favour of allowing same-sex marriage.

But:

 

Homosexuality, abortion, birth control and population

Fifty years ago (1964) the world population was about 3.2 billion people.

Since then acceptance of homosexual relationships, same sex marriage, oral contraception, male and female sterilisation and safe abortions have increased substantially.

The world population this year will be about 7.2 billion people. It is projected to be over 10 billion in another fifty years.

Source: http://www.geohive.com/earth/his_history3.aspx

Mixed marriage equality editorials

Editorial reaction to the passing of marriage equality bill has been mixed – it’s worth guessing that editorial writers will often be from older age groups.

Dominion Post was in favour – Bill gives equal opportunity for all

Before 9.30pm on Wednesday, a heterosexual couple who wanted to spend the rest of their lives together had three options. They could live as de-facto husband and wife, as many do, they could enter into a civil union or they could get married.

The passing two nights ago of Labour MP Louisa Wall’s bill allowing same-sex marriage has not altered those choices for heterosexual couples. Nor has it undermined or devalued the relationship status of those already married and those who will marry in the future.

It has merely extended to gay and transgender couples all the options that are available to straight couples.

All that has changed is that same-sex couples who love each other and who want to spend their lives together are no longer excluded by law from making the ultimate commitment purely because of their sexual orientation.

Waikato Times quoted several people in favour of the bill including Maurice Williamson and Lynda Topp but didn’t seem to share the gay mood in The sun will still rise

How well the vote mirrored public opinion is hard to gauge. One recent poll showed public opposition to same-sex marriage had grown significantly since Ms Wall’s bill came before Parliament. This shift in sentiment was not necessarily caused by scaremongering by the bill’s opponents, as its champions maintained. Opponents nevertheless were still outnumbered by supporters and young people overwhelmingly favoured it.

Some opposition was rooted in homophobia. Some was based on strongly held religious beliefs. Some people simply didn’t see the need for change, because civil unions went far enough in recognising same-sex relationships.

Former National MP Marilyn Waring wasn’t altogether in a celebratory mood, however, and condemned MPs who intended voting against the bill as cowards.

She will be aware that the rights of the opponents of same-sex marriage would be corroded, no matter how disagreeably they reason their stance, if Parliamentarians could not represent them. She will be aware, too, of the paradox in displaying intolerance of intolerance.

Manawatu Standard is positive despite their title – Prophecies of doom are overstated

The sanctity of marriage and even society itself will not be undermined or torn asunder. In fact, both will be strengthened by spreading even further underlying messages of hard work and togetherness implicit in the community’s official recognition of a couple, and by bringing gays further under the umbrella of conformity.

Even the churches could benefit, if they see the opportunity to spread their own message to a wider audience.

And maybe they too will find the sky hasn’t fallen.

ODT is more against the change – Same-sex marriage

For many social conservatives, notably those of fundamental or traditional religious beliefs, marriage was, is and should be a commitment between a man and a woman. The two genders are complementary and it is only through their union that children can be made naturally.

This important institution, upon which a healthy community is built, is being weakened, even debased. Further, why should gays try to co-opt ”marriage” when gay couples have virtually all the same rights through civil union legislation? That union signals couple status through specific vows and at a ceremony.

Surely, that is sufficient without muscling in on marriage?

Even though society is changing, even though liberalism triumphed on this occasion, the genuine and thoughtful beliefs of those opposed to change should be respected. Conservative reactions to declines in the morality, standards and safety in a complex and, at times, nasty modern world are understandable. There will, indeed, be times when holding fast to traditional views and laws are the appropriate reaction.

Taranaki Daily News has a “Modern Maiden” opinion – May we move on in love

One of the best things that will come from the passing of the Marriage Amendment Bill is that the arguments will stop and the nastiness will cease.

I’m glad to have it carved in stone and written into the law, not only for the obvious and most important reason of equality, but also so people will eventually stop voicing their hateful views.

As an openly bisexual woman there has not been a week gone by since the bill was pulled from the ballot that I have not had to listen to somebody telling me exactly why it shouldn’t be made into law, and why it is wrong to even want it to.

The people who have shared their sometimes hurtful views with me have been friends, men at the bar who I had known for less than an hour, and even a couple of members of my family.

The bill has now passed, and for reasons of equality and civil rights I am over the moon, but I can’t shift this feeling of relief.

I am relieved because now the saga is over. There will be no more debating, no national marches and no more personal harassment.

The hurtful conversations should eventually stop and we can get on with trying to love one another again.

I am pretty sure that love was meant to be the focus of the bill in the first place, and I guess that’s what made it hard to understand where all this hatred came from.

The time has come. The bill has passed. May we move on in love.

 

MPs on same sex marriage

UPDATE December 2012 – this page was updated with voting intentiions as determined from a number of media, online sources plus direct contact with MPs.

I stopped updating this at the time of the vote on 29 August 2012.

For a table of summary of intent plus how MPs voted at the first reading: MPs on same sex marriage – first vote

MP comments and positions on same sex marriage and marriage equality. If MPs want to add, amend or remove details please advise.

See also:

  • New Zealand for Marriage Equality :
    DOES YOUR MP SUPPORT THE BILL FOR MARRIAGE EQUALITY (AT FIRST READING AT LEAST)?
    67 Yes
    15 No
    8 Abstain (NOTE: There was a news report that NZF may vote against)
    7 Undecided
    24 Unknown
    (as at 29 August 2012)
  • Listener: NZ’s marriage equality bill – a longblog
    A running blog on the bill that would legalise same-sex marriage in New Zealand. Links to source material, commentary and analysis.
  • NZ Herald survey of MPs : Are you for or against Louisa Wall’s bill?
    * 52 – For
    * 13 – Against
    * 2 – Undecided / maybe for
    * 2 – Undecided / maybe against
    * 44 – Undecided
    * 8 – No reply / no comment.
    (as at 1 August 2012)
Name Party Yes/No Comment
Adams, Amy NAT Yes  ‏@amyadamsMP I’m voting yes to the Marriage Equality Bill today. I respect genuine views on both sides but ultimately I’m a live and let live person.
Ardern, Jacinda LAB Yes …if a vote came up tomorrow on the question of gay marriage, I would give my support because of the same principle – fairness. 4
Ardern, Shane NAT No  NZ for Marriage Equality
Auchinvole, Chris NAT No  NZ for Marriage Equality
Bakshi, Kanwaljit Singh NAT No  NZ for Marriage Equality
Banks, John ACT Yes ‏@patrickgowernzJohn banks is voting for gay marriage
Barry, Maggie NAT Yes
‏@maggiebarry: I’m voting YES to #marriageequality. I respect the sincere, strongly held views but believe gay people should have the opportunity to marry
Bennett, David NAT Yes  NZ for Marriage Equality
Bennett, Paula NAT
Blue, Jackie NAT Yes  NZ for Marriage Equality
Borrows, Chester NAT No …Chester Borrows cited religious beliefs…6(NZ for Marriage Equality say Yes)
Bridges, Simon NAT Undec. ‘Not sure’ about allowing gay marriage. He says ‘I’m hedging my bets, but I’d want to think about that’. He adds that in terms of civil unions, ‘I’m relaxed about that’.
– 5 Vote Chat 2011
Browning, Steffan GRE Yes The Green Party has policy supporting full legal equality, regardless of sexual orientation, which means that all of our MPs will vote for marriage equality. We do not believe that this important human rights issue is appropriate for a conscience vote. (K Hague email)
Brownlee, Gerry NAT No  NZ for Marriage Equality
Calder, Cam NAT Yes Feedback from National MP’s on Marriage Bill on the way into caucus(@felixmarwick)
Carter, David NAT NoYes  NZ for Marriage EqualityFeedback from National MP’s on Marriage Bill on the way into caucus(@felixmarwick)
Chauvel, Charles LAB Yes Making sure that every couple has the right to marry is a no-brainer. (Facebook)“It was Labour policy in the last election to support the right of same-sex couples to marry.” 1
Clark, David LAB Yes @DavidClarkNZ  Ibelieve in fairness and equality of opportunity. I’m also a civil union celebrant.NZ for Marriage Equality
Clendon, David GRE Yes (email 11/5/12)
Coleman, Jonathan NAT
Collins, Judith NAT Yes Collins said of marriage equality: “I’ve got no problem with it.”
Justice minister now pro gay equality, marriage
Cosgrove, Clayton LAB Undec. NZ for Marriage Equality
Cunliffe, David LAB Yes NZ for Marriage EqualityCunliffe said ‘I strongly support civil unions, and I strongly support the equalisation of property and other rights for civil union couples’. But in terms of changes to marriage, he said ‘We have to be guided by public opinions’. He admitted that his policy on allowing gay marriage could be characterised as: ‘No’ for now, ‘maybe’ for later.
Vote Chat 2011
Curran, Clare LAB Yes Says she sees it as ‘a human rights issue’ and that she finds it ‘extraordinary that we’re still having these discussions’.
5 Vote Chat 2011
Dalziel, Lianne LAB Yes  NZ for Marriage Equality
Dean, Jacqui NAT
Delahunty, Catherine GRE Yes “Totally support marriage equality for everyone!” (email 18/5/12)‘We’re into it. It’s a human right’.
5 Vote Chat 2011
Dunne, Peter UF Yes The reason I support Louisa Wall’s Bill is because the community is ready for the debate, and we should not be afraid of it. (Consistent with United Future liberal principles.)
– email 28/07/12
Dyson, Ruth LAB Yes  (email 11/5/12)
English, Bill NAT No? Deputy Prime Minister Bill English said the issue was “not that important” and he “thought the problem had been solved” with the introduction of civil unions in 2004. “In the big picture, it’s not that important,” Mr English said. 6Says he’s changed his view on civil unions, and is ‘relaxed about civil unions’. He stresses that gay community is not simply in favour of getting married.
5
Faafoi, Kris LAB Yes  NZ for Marriage Equality
Fenton, Darien LAB Yes  However civil unions should remain for those who don’t subscribe to the religious connotations around marriage. (email)
Finlayson, Christopher NAT N/C “I haven’t given it a moment’s thought. I’m too busy solving Treaty grievances.”  6
Flavell, Te Ururoa MAO Yes Te Ururoa supports both and wants to add that tamariki should stay with whanau where appropriate.Nga mihi,
Foss, Craig NAT
Genter, Julie Anne GRE Yes The Green Party has policy supporting full legal equality, regardless of sexual orientation, which means that all of our MPs will vote for marriage equality. We do not believe that this important human rights issue is appropriate for a conscience vote. (K Hague email)
Goff, Phil LAB Yes  NZ for Marriage Equality
Goldsmith, Paul NAT
Goodhew, Jo NAT
Graham, Kennedy GRE Yes The Green Party has policy supporting full legal equality, regardless of sexual orientation, which means that all of our MPs will vote for marriage equality. We do not believe that this important human rights issue is appropriate for a conscience vote. (K Hague email)
Groser, Tim NAT
Guy, Nathan NAT
Hague, Kevin GRE Yes The Green Party has policy supporting full legal equality, regardless of sexual orientation, which means that all of our MPs will vote for marriage equality. We do not believe that this important human rights issue is appropriate for a conscience vote. (email) @KevinHagueIn case you weren’t sure: I personally support marriage equality and all Green MPs will support a Bill that achieves this
Also: 5 Vote Chat 2011
Harawira, Hone MAN Yes Harawira said that MANA believes that strong and healthy relationships were the foundation of loving whanau and a positive and vibrant society, and recognised that those relationships could be found between all people, regardless of sex, race or class.“Because of that” said Harawira “MANA also believes that partners in such relationships should be entitled to enter into marriage and/or adopt children, with the same legal protections, rights and responsibilities for all, regardless of sex, race or class”.Harawira said that on behalf of MANA he would be proud to support Miss Wall’s bill at first reading and looked forward to further discussions with her about the future of her bill.Press Release: Mana Party
Hayes, John NAT
Heatley, Phil NAT
Henare, Tau NAT Yes Check what I said on Twitter about my view, I think that will suffice. (email)
@tauhenare human rights issue lift, my nonstick view is, if you want to, why not, as long as there is no harm to others.@tauhenare have a read of my comments then and you will see that I’m quite relaxed. If they want to marry then y not.
Hipkins, Chris LAB Yes  NZ for Marriage Equality
Horan, Brendan NZF Yes  NZ for Marriage Equality
Horomia, Parekura LAB Yes  NZ for Marriage Equality
Hughes, Gareth GRE Yes The Green Party has policy supporting full legal equality, regardless of sexual orientation, which means that all of our MPs will vote for marriage equality. We do not believe that this important human rights issue is appropriate for a conscience vote. (K Hague email)
Huo, Raymond LAB
Hutchison, Paul NAT No  Feedback from National MP’s on Marriage Bill on the way into caucus(@felixmarwick)
Jones, Shane LAB
Joyce, Steven NAT Undec. Steven Joyce said he had “not given it a moment’s thought” and that it was “not exactly the biggest issue of the day”. 6
Kaye, Nikki NAT Yes If legislation came before Parliament I’d vote for it. 4
Key, John NAT Yes Prime Minister John Key announced in May that he would vote for the first reading of a gay marriage bill. 6Prime Minister John Key said he was not against same-sex marriage. 1Not on National’s agenda (Radio NZ)
King, Annette LAB Yes  ‘I certainly do. I do not see why we would deny a loving couple who had a relationship that they wanted to make a long-lasting one in a marriage, why we would deny them.… I would vote for gay marriage’. She said: ‘I see it as a human rights issues’.
5 Vote Chat 2011
King, Colin NAT  Yes Relaxed about it, let’s have the debate. Back Benches 16/5/12NZ for Marriage Equality
Lee, Melissa NAT
Lees-Galloway, Iain LAB Advised by independent email: I have personally asked him about this issue, and even put the question to the candidates for the Palmerston North electorate at last year’s Manawatu Standard election debate. The video can be viewed here: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DtTF08p5bSs
Little, Andrew LAB Yes  NZ for Marriage Equality
Logie, Jan GRE Yes The Green Party has policy supporting full legal equality, regardless of sexual orientation, which means that all of our MPs will vote for marriage equality. We do not believe that this important human rights issue is appropriate for a conscience vote. (K Hague email)
Lotu-Iiga, Peseta Sam NAT
Macindoe, Tim NAT No Clearly states that he is ‘Against gay marriage’ and that his ‘personal view is that marriage is between a man and a women’. But he qualifies this by saying that he ‘appreciate[s] the fact that gay couples have an absolute legal right to enjoy the protection of their interests’.
5 Vote Chat 2011
Mackey, Moana LAB Yes  NZ for Marriage Equality
Mahuta, Nanaia LAB Yes  NZ for Marriage Equality
Mallard, Trevor LAB Yes  (email)
Martin, Tracey NZF  Yes Personally, why shouldn’t they have the same rights. Very hard to argue against it.
But need to go to the people who voted fo her.
Back Benches 16/05/12NZ for Marriage Equality
Mathers, Mojo GRE Yes The Green Party has policy supporting full legal equality, regardless of sexual orientation, which means that all of our MPs will vote for marriage equality. We do not believe that this important human rights issue is appropriate for a conscience vote. (K Hague email)
McClay, Todd NAT
McCully, Murray NAT Undec.
McKelvie, Ian NAT
Mitchell, Mark NAT Yes  NZ for Marriage Equality
Voted No
Moroney, Sue LAB Yes  NZ for Marriage Equality
Ngaro, Alfred NAT No Feedback from National MP’s on Marriage Bill on the way into caucus(@felixmarwick)
Norman, Russel GRE Yes I support same sex marriage (email)“If gay people want to get married then they should be allowed to.”Seriously, it’s pretty straightforward. I don’t see why your sexual preference should be any barrier to marriage. It’s no big deal.” 3
O’Connor, Damien LAB No  NZ for Marriage Equality
O’Connor, Simon NAT
O’Rourke, Denis NZF Yes  NZ for Marriage Equality
Parata, Hekia NAT
Parker, David LAB Yes
Peters, Winston NZF No  No commentPeters defends his opposition to allowing same-sex couples to marry by stressing that a lot of gay people that he talks to aren’t actually in favour of it, and they say ‘I don’t want to be caught in some sort of matrimonial association’
‘Privately telling me, whatever you do, don’t do this’.
‘If it’s a human right, you need to tell me where that human right came from’.
‘‘The question is what does the public want?’
5 Vote Chat 2011
Prasad, Rajen LAB Undec.
Prosser, Richard NZF No … said he would vote against the bill, so as to “preserve the institution of marriage”. 6
Robertson, Grant LAB Yes Announced his support when asked at Aro Valley Candidates’ Meeting last election.Of course I’m in favour of it. Marriage equality. Same for everyyone. Back Benches 16/05/125 Vote Chat 2011
Robertson, Ross LAB No  NZ for Marriage Equality
Roche, Denise GRE Yes The Green Party has policy supporting full legal equality, regardless of sexual orientation, which means that all of our MPs will vote for marriage equality. We do not believe that this important human rights issue is appropriate for a conscience vote. (K Hague email)
Ross, Jami-Lee NAT Yes I can confirm I am in favour of marriage equality. (Email 19/5/12)
Roy, Eric NAT No  Feedback from National MP’s on Marriage Bill on the way into caucus(@felixmarwick)
Ryall, Tony NAT
Sabin, Mike NAT No  NZ for Marriage Equality
Sage, Eugenie GRE Yes The Green Party has policy supporting full legal equality, regardless of sexual orientation, which means that all of our MPs will vote for marriage equality. We do not believe that this important human rights issue is appropriate for a conscience vote. (K Hague email)
Shanks, Katrina NAT
Sharples, Pita MAO  Yes …Ms Wall won the immediate support of … Maori Party co-leader Pita Sharples. 6
Shearer, David LAB Yes “fully” supported marriage equality in principle but would like to see the detail of any legislation before giving it formal support. 3David Shearer gave an unequivocal response in favour of allowing gay marriage
5 Vote Chat 2011
Simpson, Scott NAT
Sio, Su’a William LAB
Smith, Lockwood NAT
Smith, Nick NAT Undec.No I have not come to a view yet. On such issues, I like to firstly see the specifics of the legislation and secondly, would wish to consider the views of my Nelson electorate.My broader perspective is that there are more important issues for NZ currently. Civil unions enable gay couples to enjoy all the same legal rights as married couples, so the debate in a NZ context is more about terminology than substance. (email 18/5/12)Feedback from National MP’s on Marriage Bill on the way into caucus(@felixmarwick)
Stewart, Barbara NZF
Street, Maryan LAB Yes  NZ for Marriage Equality
Taylor, Asenati NZF
Tirikatene, Rino LAB Yes  NZ for Marriage Equality
Tisch, Lindsay NAT
Tolley, Anne NAT
Tremain, Chris NAT
Turei, Metiria GRE Yes

I fully support same sex marriage.

See http://www.greens.org.nz/policy/summary/sexualorientation 2

Turia, Tariana MAO Yes LEANING YES “So long as children have the best parent that they can have . . . that that’s the most important thing rather than the sexuality.” 6…would support same-sex marriage on the basis that individuals and whanau had the right to choose for themselves whether or not to marry. 1
Twyford, Phil LAB Undec.  NZ for Marriage Equality
Upston, Louise NAT
Wagner, Nicky NAT
Walker, Holly GRE Yes @hollyrwalker Great work Obama! #legaliselove http://ht.ly/aOegShttps://twitter.com/#!/hollyrwalker/status/200335189229043712TAbsolutely need to have marriage equality. Both options need to be available to everybody. Back Benches 16/05/125 Vote Chat 2011
Wall, Louisa LAB Yes I believe we all need  to consider this matter in terms of equality and not our personal beliefs. In doing that no rational person could in my view oppose all people, regardless of their sexual orientation, having the same legal rights and ability to choose for themselves how they express their commitment and love for another person.
-part of this post:http://www.whaleoil.co.nz/2012/05/guest-post-louisa-wall/
Wilkinson, Kate NAT
Williams, Andrew NZF Yes  NZ for Marriage Equality
Williamson, Maurice NAT
Woodhouse, Michael NAT
Woods, Megan LAB Yes  NZ for Marriage Equality
Yang, Jian NAT
Young, Jonathan NAT

Sources

Emailed all MPs, news reports, reported by others.

1. http://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=10805027

2. Dunedin MPs on same sex marriage

3. http://www.nzherald.co.nz/politics/news/article.cfm?c_id=280&objectid=10804903

4. http://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=10733819

5. From Vote Chat responses in last year’s election campaign, with video – NZ politicians on gay marriage (on the record).

6. http://www.stuff.co.nz/national/politics/7358766/Gay-marriage-likely-as-MPs-soften-stance